Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Owlbread]

I have been pondering this idea recently. Every time I dwell on youtube or the internet in general and delve into philosophy and the like, it is very easy to be exposed to the overwhelming tidal wave of paranoia, fear and concern in the USA over perceived conspiracies from the JFK assassination to the illuminati to the Bohemian Grove coverup to Area 51 to UFOs to lizardmen and, most recently, 9/11. These kind of conspiracy theories go back a long way over the last 200-300 years. Interestingly, even though you can find conspiracy theorists elsewhere in the world that make claims about the illuminati and so on, the sources of these theories can be found in the USA. The USA is, in my mind, the centre of the world for conspiracy theories and abstract thoughts in this vein.

It occurred to me that, whether or not these theories are true, there may be a semi-national predisposition to looking for conspiracies and malicious government coverups. The reason for this could be in the fact that the USA is largely a nation of immigrants - a large number of which fled to the USA, escaping oppression from the likes of Eastern Europe. If your family were Jews who fled fear and persecution in, say, the Russian Empire or later the USSR, of course the trauma of having such a totalitarian government that was prone to lying and making dark plans in half-lit chambers would leave its mark on you. That's just one example.

As time has gone on, perhaps the fact that the USA has been so isolated from the likes of mainland Europe and the middle east and so on means that without as many wars and without as much emphasis on international politics, the American people had very few international enemies. It's only in the last century or so that this has really stepped up. Because the Americans have had so few international enemies, they ended up picking fights with each-other (simplistic, but just hear me out), the greatest manifestation of this being the American Civil War. Perhaps they also began to question the judgement of their government far more at this time, which, when coupled with sentiments being brought over from Europe about Jewish bankers and such, has led to a vast array of conspiracy theories developing and evolving.

There is also the ugly phenomenon of witch hunting and moral panic which grew out of McCarthyism and has manifested itself on a number of occasions, one of which being the 1980s Satanist Ritual Abuse panic. Perhaps America was fertile ground for that kind of thing before McCarthyism because of the mutual suspicion among immigrants from different countries and different periods. In any case, the fear that your nextdoor neighbours could be Reds plotting to overthrow your government and other such stuff surely contributed to the number of conspiracy theorists.

What do you gentlemen think? Am I rambling on about something I don't understand, or does this theory hold any water?

[Flying Dice]

The American Civil War arose from irreconcilable differences in social and economic structure, not boredom. 

That aside, I think that part of it may lie in the fact that our government, by and large, does secretly do a lot of things. The 9/11 truthers seem mildly plausible because of things like Operation Northwoods; we see clear documentation of the Joint Chiefs of Staff trying to get approval to stage false-flag attacks in order to start a war a few decades ago, and it suddenly seems... well, not reasonable, but also not entirely impossible. It's just that the U.S. govt.'s secrets tend to have more to do with supporting dictators, spying on citizens, experimenting on people with LSD, and so forth, rather than hiding UFOs, the Freemasons, and assassinating presidents.

In a similar vein, the whole load of "Jewish bankers" crap has a tiny grain of truth in that things like AIPAC do exert an undue amount of influence on U.S. foreign policy re: Israel. Sort of like how any "real" (rather than hallucinated or invented from whole cloth) UFO sightings were probably experimental aircraft, hence the stupid coverup stories. By and large, U.S. citizens tend to love a good story, and there are plenty of seeds out there that people can cultivate into bizarre conspiracy theories.

I'd guess that there are equal parts boredom and desire for public attention behind most of it, rather than genuine crazy.

[Cthulhu]

Conspiracy theories are everywhere, but I've got a couple ideas for what might be causing them in America.

The first is pretty universal, Just World Hypothesis.  I'll use the example of 9/11 since we should all remember it.  Terrorism like that is almost like a natural disaster.  It's random, unpredictable, unstoppable, you can be talking to the girl you like on the elevator and seconds later she's dead and the building is falling down.  The whole idea that your life could go from great to wreckage in a split second isn't something people like to grapple with.  Terrorists are, at least in the public perception, guys in a cave in Afghanistan who don't even know your name but will give their lives to cause you harm.  The government is a more tangible enemy.  You can protest, you can vote for Ron Paul, you can fight the government, at least you can fight it better than a terrorist.  I think a lot of post-catastrophe conspiracy theories like 9/11 and JFK are an attempt to fit horrific and unpredictable events into a worldview that doesn't allow for absurdity.

tl;dr When something bad happens, we want a bad guy we can fight, and terrorists aren't adequate.

The second is basically what you said.  The US is made up of people who fled evil governments, was created as an act of revolt against an oppressive regime, "Government is naturally evil and occasionally needs to have its ass kicked" is a pretty fundamental part of the American zeitgeist and that mindset lends itself well to conspiracies.

Two and a half:  Conspiracy theories seem to have really taken hold in the last 50 years or so.  I think that aforementioned mindset wasn't always quite so strong.  First with Vietnam, then with examples of government corruption like Nixon, the World War 2 era idea of America being a perfect thing of good has kind of been shattered for a lot of us.  Maybe we were naive before, but we definitely see the government in a more oppositional light than we may have otherwise, and that is also going to lend itself to conspiracy theories.

tl;dr It's Nixon's fault.  He broke our trust in Gubmint.

[Frumple]

The US is made up of people who fled evil governments, was created as an act of revolt against an oppressive regime, "Government is naturally evil and occasionally needs to have its ass kicked" is a pretty fundamental part of the American zeitgeist and that mindset lends itself well to conspiracies.

Isn't this pretty heavily revisionist history stuff, though? Last I checked most of America's immigrant population came over here to make a buck, or at least more of a buck than they could where they were at. You've got a bit from the world war(s) stuff, but that's only part of America's history and a fraction of the cause of immigration, yeah. The religious stuff... most of the early religiously "oppressed" immigrants were kinda' dicks, to put it poorly, from what I remember; it was less that they were decent people fleeing oppression and more than folks back home kicked them the hell out for being assholes.

Not saying it's not part of the culture at this point, but it's kinda' like "In God we Trust" being in the pledge of allegiance, I'd say. Not really, well, part of (most of) the actual history -- relatively recent stuff or outright invention, basically.

As for the theories themselves... man, I'unno. I'd probably blame entertainment media in general. People can make a buck over here spewing out the crazy conspiracy crap, and, well, so they do. Which... thinking on it, yeah, it kinda' is a product of heritage and culture, coming from that angle.

[Cthulhu]

Yeah, the immigration thing is a bit of a factoid, but it's also mostly unconditionally accepted in the American public consciousness and that's what matters for the conspiracy theory thing.

[ChairmanPoo]

There are conspiracy theories everywhere. I'ts just that you are most familiar with the American ones

[Owlbread]

A lot of people here are responding by saying that there are conspiracy theories everywhere, but you're missing the point. There is an unusually large number of them in the USA, and I was wondering where that came from. You will not find the same sheer weight of conspiracy theories nowadays in the UK, Germany, the Russian Federation or China.

Conspiracy theories are everywhere, but I've got a couple ideas for what might be causing them in America.

The first is pretty universal, Just World Hypothesis.  I'll use the example of 9/11 since we should all remember it.  Terrorism like that is almost like a natural disaster.  It's random, unpredictable, unstoppable, you can be talking to the girl you like on the elevator and seconds later she's dead and the building is falling down.  The whole idea that your life could go from great to wreckage in a split second isn't something people like to grapple with.  Terrorists are, at least in the public perception, guys in a cave in Afghanistan who don't even know your name but will give their lives to cause you harm.  The government is a more tangible enemy.  You can protest, you can vote for Ron Paul, you can fight the government, at least you can fight it better than a terrorist.  I think a lot of post-catastrophe conspiracy theories like 9/11 and JFK are an attempt to fit horrific and unpredictable events into a worldview that doesn't allow for absurdity.

tl;dr When something bad happens, we want a bad guy we can fight, and terrorists aren't adequate.

The second is basically what you said.  The US is made up of people who fled evil governments, was created as an act of revolt against an oppressive regime, "Government is naturally evil and occasionally needs to have its ass kicked" is a pretty fundamental part of the American zeitgeist and that mindset lends itself well to conspiracies.

Two and a half:  Conspiracy theories seem to have really taken hold in the last 50 years or so.  I think that aforementioned mindset wasn't always quite so strong.  First with Vietnam, then with examples of government corruption like Nixon, the World War 2 era idea of America being a perfect thing of good has kind of been shattered for a lot of us.  Maybe we were naive before, but we definitely see the government in a more oppositional light than we may have otherwise, and that is also going to lend itself to conspiracy theories.

tl;dr It's Nixon's fault.  He broke our trust in Gubmint.

I really like these points. My favourite is your first one, it's really changed how I view this topic.

[Leafsnail]

Might be to do with how polarized the politics are.  Conspiracy theories from Republicans have abounded recently because they just can't believe they lost to Obama.

[mainiac]

I'd say that Americans are notable for their lack of belief in conspiracy theories.  Most places are far more used to being screwed over by foreigners and nothing breeds conspiracy theories like being screwed over by foreigners.  For instance, it's not hard to figure out why your typical Lebanese thinks that foreign intelligence agencies are distorting the news and subverting their government, they believe it because it's true.  The only problem is that people don't direct their well founded suspicion towards the right theories.

[MrWiggles]

how can you tell that there is larger share 'thoerys' in the US? Is there a study or just your perception? According to an article in SciAm theyer copping mechanism largely.

[Flying Dice]

Might be to do with how polarized the politics are.  Conspiracy theories from Republicans have abounded recently because they just can't believe they lost to Obama.

There's a certain amount of truth in this, at least for the modern U.S. In the latter half of the 20th century, much more of it was derived from the tensions of the Cold War and the Civil Rights Movement; you had the people who were paranoid about the CCCP, communist infiltrators, and all that (essentially, McCarthyism), and then you had the people who were paranoid about the CIA, the draft, opposition to the Civil Rights Movement (the assassination of MLK Jr., for example), and things of that sort.

Again, both had some small bits of truth at the core of their reasoning: there were communist infiltrators, but they were less common and less insidious than certain people presented them as; both sides had their spies and moles in the other; and the U.S. government was involved in a whole lot of shady, unethical things, but it wasn't the facade for the NWO or anything stupid like that.

I'd say that Americans are notable for their lack of belief in conspiracy theories.  Most places are far more used to being screwed over by foreigners and nothing breeds conspiracy theories like being screwed over by foreigners.  For instance, it's not hard to figure out why your typical Lebanese thinks that foreign intelligence agencies are distorting the news and subverting their government, they believe it because it's true.  The only problem is that people don't direct their well founded suspicion towards the right theories.

But with things like that, the paranoia is less "conspiracy theory" and more "misdirected but justified suspicion".

[Owlbread]

how can you tell that there is larger share 'thoerys' in the US? Is there a study or just your perception? According to an article in SciAm theyer copping mechanism largely.

It is just my perception, yes. I could be completely wrong, but I don't see it yet.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

tl;dr It's Nixon's fault.  He broke our trust in Gubmint.

Which is a shame, because Nixon was otherwise an awesome president. His personal bigotry is repulsive, but his actual policies were more good than not.

You will not find the same sheer weight of conspiracy theories nowadays in the UK,

"David Ike is right, the Queen is a Reptilian infiltrator!"

Germany,

"Turkish immigrants are going to overrun us and turn Europe into Eurarabia!"

the Russian Federation

"Gorbachev was a CIA spy who destroyed our great nation!"

or China.

"Western Medicine is trying to poison us and take us away from good, traditional, Chinese remedies!"

Conspiracy theories are everywhere and the US has no particular exception.

[Owlbread]

tl;dr It's Nixon's fault.  He broke our trust in Gubmint.

Which is a shame, because Nixon was otherwise an awesome president. His personal bigotry is repulsive, but his actual policies were more good than not.

You will not find the same sheer weight of conspiracy theories nowadays in the UK,

"David Ike is right, the Queen is a Reptilian infiltrator!"

Germany,

"Turkish immigrants are going to overrun us and turn Europe into Eurarabia!"

the Russian Federation

"Gorbachev was a CIA spy who destroyed our great nation!"

or China.

"Western Medicine is trying to poison us and take us away from good, traditional, Chinese remedies!"

Conspiracy theories are everywhere and the US has no particular exception.

Now now, you've responded to my comment as if I said there were no other conspiracy theories outside of the USA. I did not say that. I said the sheer weight does not compare, and even though you've picked some common conspiracies in those countries (my first thoughts when I wrote the original post were of David Icke in fact), you will not be able to outweigh the sheer number of modern American conspiracy theories with those from the other countries.

Think about it. It's everywhere you look - from the conspiracy theories about the freemasons to the skull and bones society to the Bilderberg group to illuminati (or whatever) symbols on the dollar bill. In the UK, the common perceptions I have heard about the freemasons are "Oh, my grandfather was a freemason. He had a lot of medals and stuff, didn't talk about it though". It's nothing particularly suspicious or whatever. In America, from what I can tell, it's quite a different story.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

You have completely failed to quantify that. Go ahead and read, because they're all over the place.