Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Hyndis]

I'd actually like for most of my dwarves to be gay or lesbian, so they'd stop breeding so fast!

You can reduce the child cap in the ini files. Current child cap is 100, IIRC.

[Inarius]

Homosexuality is an interesting part. But i really think that there are things more important to do before that.
For example, factions within the fortress, boats, and romance. When the romance arc will be developped, homosexuality should be included. But it wouldn't make any sense to do it before.

[therahedwig]

I'd actually like for most of my dwarves to be gay or lesbian, so they'd stop breeding so fast!

Frankly, we could also propose anti-conception for that. Children tax. Celibacy. Castration.
Dwarves poop out too many children compared to what would be realistic if both parents are working 24/7(I think we can blame the spores for this)

[AutomataKittay]

I'd actually like for most of my dwarves to be gay or lesbian, so they'd stop breeding so fast!

Frankly, we could also propose anti-conception for that. Children tax. Celibacy. Castration.
Dwarves poop out too many children compared to what would be realistic if both parents are working 24/7(I think we can blame the spores for this)

Indeed!
It is a byproduct of very simplified relationship system, though. Probably the entire reason that there're child cap in the init, we can't tell them to stop sporing.

[Di]

Homosexuality is an interesting part. But i really think that there are things more important to do before that.
For example, factions within the fortress, boats, and romance. When the romance arc will be developped, homosexuality should be included. But it wouldn't make any sense to do it before.

Yeah, I doubt gay dwarves would bring anything interesting into game unless they could form groups and perform nude marches to protest this and that.

[pisskop]

Dear dwarves of Streamstrikes:
  Any dwarves caught going naked for reasons other than clothing decay will be thrown into the vampire pit.

Your divine overseer
AGOB

[GreatWyrmGold]

Homosexuality is an interesting part. But i really think that there are things more important to do before that.
For example, factions within the fortress, boats, and romance. When the romance arc will be developped, homosexuality should be included. But it wouldn't make any sense to do it before.

Yeah, I doubt gay dwarves would bring anything interesting into game unless they could form groups and perform nude marches to protest this and that.

...Um, or at least conflict...
Er, where are you that gays routinely parade around nude to protest?

[AutomataKittay]

Homosexuality is an interesting part. But i really think that there are things more important to do before that.
For example, factions within the fortress, boats, and romance. When the romance arc will be developped, homosexuality should be included. But it wouldn't make any sense to do it before.

Yeah, I doubt gay dwarves would bring anything interesting into game unless they could form groups and perform nude marches to protest this and that.

...Um, or at least conflict...
Er, where are you that gays routinely parade around nude to protest?

I think we USAians calls them Pride Marches!
( Nah, I'm kidding, but a few places does legally allow naked parades or events of sorts to happen, not heard of any specificly gay ones )

[EnigmaticHat]

Here is one reason I can think of to keep sexual orientation out of Dwarf Fortress and it is probably the biggest one I can think of.

What are the percents going to be?

Whatever Toady's best guess is?  Seriously, all of our other numbers are wrong.  Especially the ones about human biology.

On the general topic of gay dwarves, I'm all for it, whenever sexual attraction becomes relevant.  Before then, its a nice characterizing detail, but it would also be a placeholder that would eventually be demolished alongside the other relationship mechanics.  So a waste of the Great Toad's time, like others have been saying.

I will say this: some of you seem to be having a hard time separating the way your real world cultures view homosexuality and the way DF civs would.  There would be no need to add in gay pride parades or other such things because DF currently doesn't simulate societal change, and when it does the conflicts surrounding sexuality, gender, race, culture, class, and religion will all likely be handled through the same general systems.  Second of all, dwarves live in a monarchy, which means their attitudes towards marriage are likely pragmatic rather than the modern idea of marriage as love.  Gay or asexual dwarves would likely still marry and at least try to have kids if that was what their families needed (unless they don't care what happens to their familes, of course).  That doesn't mean that gay marriage wouldn't be a thing, mind you.  As anyone who's played Crusader Kings can attest, sometimes you like the current heir and want to keep family tree small*.  Plus, being able to ignore gender when arranging marriages could make the formation of alliances (for landed nobles) and family ties (for everyone else) quite easy.  Or on the flip side, if dwarves aren't ok with gay marriage, sexual orientation would still be relevant because homosexuals in a hetero relationship are less likely to have kids (for the obvious reason) which can help lead to all of those Fun succession conflicts.

*See, when you marry a second spouse of the opposite gender, sometimes you have kids with them.  And those kids won't inherit the kingdom... unless your old spouse's kids were to die.  And your spouse rates quite highly in terms of plot power when the plot is to kill your family members.  Sure, staying single is an option, but spouses are useful in that they help you run the kingdom and can give you powerful allies.

[Neonivek]

Personally I think why the numbers cannot really be reached is that sexuality is a deceptively vague concept that is also too politically/religiously/socially charged to obtain fair concensus.

And even if it COULD reach a fair concensus the differentiation between sexual orientation and sexuality are also a vague concept. (AKA what is "Just sex"?). THEN there is the fact that even straight people are naturally attracted to attractive members of the same gender, even if those traits are sexual EVEN if there is no sexual attaction./

After everything I learned on the subject all I can say is "Yeah it is a thing". It is honestly one of the more nightmarish subjects I ever had to try to gain a solid oppinion on only to actually give up and hate both of the steriotypical sides equally.

I will say this: some of you seem to be having a hard time separating the way your real world cultures view homosexuality and the way DF civs would

I was speaking more on the basis that... This could be a topic that could lead to strife. It is the largest issue I could come up with other then possibly people just don't want to see it.

Even the "10%" statistic is a heavily contested thing. (I don't think that was the dishonest statistic... I think the dishonest one was the 50% one).

Mind you I don't think I ever saw anyone really complain a lot outside trolling sites.

But either way for better or ill I cannot think of another aspect on this subject that has more potential for backfire.

[Liamar]

I think it should be left out.

A mod can cover this aspect of the game if a limited audience desires it so much.

[GreatWyrmGold]

I think that the minority seems to be the ones completely against it in any form.

I personally don't think it should be added yet, and many agree, but those of us like think it should be added once marriages are more than ways to get babies...if dwarven marriages ever are.

[pisskop]

This thread is hardly an adequate sample size.  I know several people have decided not to get involved.  and its not going to be added anytime soon, so its not like toady asked us to vote.

But I think that the most pc move for toady would be to let a competent modder add it.  Whatever Toady does is scrutinized, after all.  And some modders know the game very well.

[GreatWyrmGold]

This thread is hardly an adequate sample size.  I know several people have decided not to get involved.  and its not going to be added anytime soon, so its not like toady asked us to vote.

It's not a good sample, but it's the only one we have. What makes you think that the sample is horribly biased?

But I think that the most pc move for toady would be to let a competent modder add it.  Whatever Toady does is scrutinized, after all.  And some modders know the game very well.

I'm not sure what personal computers have to do with this, but I seem to recall someone quoting Toady about how he was planning to (eventually) add sexual orientation earlier in the thread.

[G-Flex]

I think it should be left out.

Why? After several pages of discussion, simply saying "no" doesn't contribute much.

A mod can cover this aspect of the game if a limited audience desires it so much.

Not really. This is pretty far beyond the realm of modding as DF allows it.