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[GreatWyrmGold]

It would probably wait until then, yeah.

Seriously, though, how would you power a moving drill?

[Gamerlord]

maybe some sort of channel thingy, e.g.

channelchannelchannelchannelchannelchannel
d  r  i  l  l  w  a  t  e  r  r  e  a  c  t  o  r

here the channel delivers water to the whole thing and a dwarf at one end pumps water to it.

[GreatWyrmGold]

The water wheels or whatever would also have to move, along with whatever axels or whatever was transferring the power.

[Damiac]

Here's how one could work, which will only mine downward, useful for digging through a pool of water or magma, or for a 1x1 shaft (for some reason)

                            | <- drill shaft
                            |
                            |
                            |
                            |
                            |
                           [|] <- this provides rotation, needs to be hooked up to power source, does not move
                            |
                            |
                            |
                            |
                           \/ <- drill bit, moves down with shaft

So you'd have to build all the shaft pieces and a drill head, and drag them over to the rotating piece to assemble the drill.  As the drill goes through the layers, gravity pushes the shaft down another level.  Maybe you'd need a cap piece at the top, to prevent the thing from just falling out of the rotator piece at the end.
Once you've dug your hole, the dwarves pull the drill up and dissassemble it piece by piece.  It could also be run manually, like a pump, with a dwarf at the rotator piece.

It's way less efficient than just using dwarves, but useful for digging through water/magma/open spaces, for example, to dig down to cavern water for a well.  Can a magma forge be powered by magma more than 1z level down? For !!FUN!! purposes, it could also be used to drill creatures...  Take that, stupid bronze collosus...

I suppose a horizontal version could work, but then you'd need something pushing on it, since gravity wouldn't be helping you.

[Starver]

useful ..., for example, to dig down to cavern water for a well.

You say this as if it's a problem still in need of a solution...

Anyway, assuming we are going for this, there's a thread (at least one!) from ages back where there was an idea of a hydraulic ram penetrator that could push a penetrator backed by an amount of material through solid ground, as if you were laying a wall down with that material.  Horizontally or vertically.  One idea was that you could punch new structureal walls through otherwise hazardous terrains (even put it through a liquid-filled tube and isolate one side from the other, etc).

Anyway, the same "engine-house" building behind that sounds like it would function to push (and/or retrueve by pulling!) a drill-head, even though (in this case) the void being dug is not in itself being filled with a solid barrier, but the presumable liquid-permeable/run-roundable drill-shaft.

[GreatWyrmGold]

Here's how one could work, which will only mine downward, useful for digging through a pool of water or magma, or for a 1x1 shaft (for some reason)

                            | <- drill shaft
                            |
                            |
                            |
                            |
                            |
                           [|] <- this provides rotation, needs to be hooked up to power source, does not move
                            |
                            |
                            |
                            |
                           \/ <- drill bit, moves down with shaft

So you'd have to build all the shaft pieces and a drill head, and drag them over to the rotating piece to assemble the drill.  As the drill goes through the layers, gravity pushes the shaft down another level.  Maybe you'd need a cap piece at the top, to prevent the thing from just falling out of the rotator piece at the end.
Once you've dug your hole, the dwarves pull the drill up and dissassemble it piece by piece.  It could also be run manually, like a pump, with a dwarf at the rotator piece.

It's way less efficient than just using dwarves, but useful for digging through water/magma/open spaces, for example, to dig down to cavern water for a well.  Can a magma forge be powered by magma more than 1z level down? For !!FUN!! purposes, it could also be used to drill creatures...  Take that, stupid bronze collosus...

I suppose a horizontal version could work, but then you'd need something pushing on it, since gravity wouldn't be helping you.

I think a long drill was mentioned a while ago.

Anyone have any ideas that don't require a long drill or are we resigned to waiting for more multi-tile constructions to be added before this has a chance?

[Damiac]

Well... As you pointed out, there's not much point to it if it can only be a single tile.

And hey, wells are multi-tile... replace the rope with a shaft, and the bucket with a drill...

[GreatWyrmGold]

A very long drill.
Probably requiring a lot of metal.

[Damiac]

Yeah, no doubt about that, it would take a lot of metal.  But that's why I was saying you could dissasemble it. At least you only have to build the pieces once.

To be honest, although I can think of a few limited used for it, I doubt I would ever build the thing.  I've never really come across a hugely problematic body of water or magma I just had to drill through.  And then, from a technical standpoint, it really drags down your FPS if you go trying to drain large bodies of water into the depths...

But then, something being inefficient are largely useless has never stopped dwarves from building it before...  And it might be worth it just for the satisfaction of drilling an annoying FB in the head.

The spinning drill hits the forgotton beast in the head, piercing the skull and tearing the brain.

You know you want to...

[10ebbor10]

Then again, it's not a good thing hard coding features that are never going to be used. If that's the only uses you have, better wait till the framework is implemented.

[Damiac]

Yeah, once the moving fortress stuff gets implemented, we might just be able to assemble all sorts of custom machines.  It'd be cool to just be able to put together basic elements, like shafts, rotors, drill bits, pushrods, whatever, and make your own machine.  Instead of hard coding each and every possible machine. 

I wasn't really arguing that such a thing should be a priority, just that it wouldn't have to completely defy physics, nor would it be completely useless.

[Revanchist]

While drills don't seem entirely useful compared to a dwarf, what about the other half of the topic "and elevators"? Are there any unique thoughts on those?

[10ebbor10]

While drills don't seem entirely useful compared to a dwarf, what about the other half of the topic "and elevators"? Are there any unique thoughts on those?

Pathfinding hell, and not that usefull.

I mean, dwarves can wander hundreds of meters of stairs just fine. They'd spent more time waiting for the elevator than it would take to walk up. Minecarts elevators might be usefull, but it's not that hard to create a roller assembly.

[Starver]

For elevators vaguely relevant to the era[1]?  Some form of self-pulled dumb-waiter construction.  A vertical shaft with a "moving room" normally at the bottom of the shaft[2] with a rope in it for a dwarf so inclined to heave him or herself (and their load) up the shaft.  If they want to get on at the top (or bottom, if so configured that it 'rests' at the top), then it's a matter of rope-pulling first from their intended starting point, then coasting to the other (or another) exit point aided by gravity/counterweighting, assumed dampened or retarded for safety.  Really can't see much of an advantage to that (given the other options for moving up and down, without any apparent need for mechanical advantage) but maybe I'm missing something.

For a powered elevator system, I suggest a Paternoster.  Two tiles wide, one with a perpetual upwards movement of anything that enters, the other with a perpetual (controlled, and same speed) downwards movement.  Problems of getting stuck if the power cuts while the paternoster-riders are riding through a level with no exit?  I expect so, although with a "manual option" a slower progress could perhaps be made as any riders resort to rope-pulling themselves, or somesuch.




[1] Not that this stopped the drilling part of the thread being discussed.

[2] And or at the top, depending on whether counterweighted to excess.

[GreatWyrmGold]

Elevators are planned with the rest of the moving fortress stuff...