Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Hapah]

Under the weather, will try to post later today.

[Toaster]

I owe a better post, but it'll have to wait till later.

[Bookthras]

Toaster: why are you lurking like lurkscum? what do you make of Tiruin & Dariush's vote on TolyK?

IronyOwl, Jim: do you have any reads so far? Please get more involved.


PPE: Heh, you came as soon as I typed your name. Oh well, the vote and comment stand until you deliver on that promise.

[Urist Imiknorris]

Technical difficulties, post tomorrow.

pfp

[Jim Groovester]

XCOM is awesome, homework takes forever if you're an idiot, will post after dinner.

[Hapah]

Sorry, folks. I'm sick as a dog and having a very real...crisis of perspective, for lack of a better word. It's not been a good day.

Now, see, that's not quite how I read it. What I saw it as was an attempt to provoke Dar to give a "wrong" answer by being his usual self. I mean, that'd be an easy enough sell to quite a few people here, wouldn't it? Keep feeding Dar inane lines like this:

Dariush:  If you were a woodchuck, what would your favorite color be?

until he gives you some acidic comment in return, and then hold it up for the world to see as "proof" of his scummy-ness. Did you think it'd work? Dar might be a raging asshole most of the time, but give the guy a little credit, he's not stupid. Alternately, maybe you just kept on that line of questioning because you were asked where you were going with it. What did you expect besides the terse sort of response that he's given you?

Hapah ... Think about what you wrote there for a second.  If Dariush, who is "a raging asshole most of the time", responded to my questions in the manner of a raging asshole ... then what would I have to vote him about?  I dare say that I would claim that the lack of an adicic comment would be grounds for suspicion in that situation, yes?

 
So people haven't ever been lynched for things that were taken out of context, things that weren't necessarily unusual? Is that what you're driving at? Because you know damn well that Dar would be an easy fucking lynch to people not familiar with him if he snapped at you.

Also, that last question of mine to Dariush was more of a joke, son. 

A joke? A joke? Nobody's laughing, are they? If you're going to make a joke, at least make it funny like Jim did.

Are you going to tell me your first two questions to Dar were jokes too? Hm? Because they all look like trivial bullshit from where I'm standing, and you claimed you had a reason for the first two. What makes this one different? Did you hope to get some deep goddamn insight from asking if QT is working? I think you didn't have a reason for either of the first two, and said the third just to keep up appearances.

Shakerag:

Hapah: Fair enough; you pass.  Unvote.

That was a pressure vote based on someone else's definition of a scumtell?

No, I voted him with a straight face and questionable reasoning to see how he'd react.

Questionable my ass; you were clearly in the wrong.

[zombie urist]

Although I'm wording it my own way, I'm doing my best to preserve the original meaning in the post. You are defending Shakerag because you are questioning my arguments instead of him. Yes I've been serious this entire game so far.

So you want to deflect onto Shakerag because of the fact that I'm questioning your arguments? How does that make sense?

I want Shakerag to answer my arguments and not you. This is not a deflection onto Shakerag.

Perhaps that is why he asked, right?

Haha no. I really doubt it.

Also, please read carefully next time.  To quote myself from earlier: "[...] then they won't be potentially effective anymore."  Emphasis added.  There's no RVS strategy that's foolproof or guaranteed at getting results.  In so far as just the RVS phase was concerned, I don't recall anything terribly significant sticking out to me.  Post-RVS, Deathsword is sticking out for not scumhunting, and Dariush is lightly pinging on my radar for having not started TUNNEL TUNNEL CHUNNEL TUNNEL on someone yet.  PPE: Whoops, maybe spoke too soon. 
RVS can most certainly be a part of scumhunting, grasshopper. 
So ... in your native language, what does 'earlier' mean as compared to English?  Think about how many days a typcal game runs ... now think of how 'earlier as opposed to later' would apply relevant to that ...

"Potentially effective" has no meaning. Lurking all game can be "potentially effective." Eating ice cream can be "potentially effective." I still don't quite agree on the RVS sentiment, but I don't want another theory discussion. Earlier refers to occuring slightly before in a timeframe. Even assuming a 4 day game, suggesting it to mean D1 and D2 is kinda extreme. Its entirely possible to even mean early in the day as opposed to late in the day.

I'm concerned that Bookthras has only made one post despite usually being very vocal on not lurking.

[Jim Groovester]

In this very post you express a strong anti-RVS sentiment. Which I support, by the way. RVS is a tool for getting discussion going, not for trying to get a miraculous insight on someone's alignment. So why the hell do you care whether someone knows his wincon when he answers about his favourite colour or the amount of wood a woodchuck could chuck or not?

I'd rather the answers be pointless by nature of the question rather than pointless by lack of knowledge of alignment.

Shakerag: Okay, I'll admit: my scumhunting is being almost none so far, and what I did wasn't very good.

Since you admit to it, why shouldn't you be hanged speedily and ruthlessly?

Jim: I am hunting scum, even if you may not think so. How would you end RVS on the second post of a game, assuming the first wasn't someone confessing 'LOOK AT ME I'M SCUM'?

As the person who made the second post of the game, that's your problem, not mine.

When I'm in your position and I come up with a way to do it, you'll be the first to know.

Unvote.

Ahhh, but that wasn't the question, was it? I asked if two was always worse than three. And if some questions are by your own admission trivial (though keep 'em coming, that was actually pretty funny), how can you say Think asked too few questions? They both looked like legitimate questions to me. It looks like you had three to his two, which is hardly miles above, yeah?

It was exactly 50% more scumhunting based on a quantitative analysis.

Or maybe I asked a bullshit question, knowing full well that it was bullshit, to see Think0028's response.

And can you elaborate on the Book/Org bit?

Org asks virtually no questions. Bookthras asks too fucking many. It's like his scumhunting style is that of a dissertation defense, but from the perspective of the thesis committee, i.e., a bunch of old, stodgy, self-important, niggling little fucks who are more interested in ensuring their name shows up in a paper than they are bestowing the title of 'doctor' to someone they think is undeserving.

But it's still preferable to Org's style. It gets stuff done now and then.

Except that this game, Bookthras is quiet, which is unusual.

But not scummy enough to vote, I guess?

I commit to my RVS votes, at least until I get a satisfactory response. Which I have.

Its a strawman because Shakerag is misrepresenting Penngo's argument. Penngo said that he thinks an early massclaim is better than a later one. Shakerag shifted this to mean a D1 or D2 massclaim. More importantly, why are you defending Shakerag?

How is that a misrepresentation? Day 3 is virtually the endgame, especially for a game like this.

I also note that Shakerag asked you this same question, which you ignored.

Haha no. I really doubt it.

Then elaborate on his intentions instead of laughing about it knowingly to yourself.

zombie urist.

[Dariush]

Dariush: Are you just voting TolyK because you're angry about being called out as a lynch candidate? What about his actions is scummy, rather than just seemingly contradictory? Your argument so far only shows to me that you do not like what TolyK is saying, not that what TolyK is saying is wrong or scummy.

Stating something and then changing your mind immediatly after being asked about it is both scummy and contradictory. Calling someone a lynch candidate and expecting him to ignore the accusation is scummy and scummy (thus double-scummy). Finally, I don't like what Tolyk is saying and I consider what he is saying to be scummy.

I'd rather the answers be pointless by nature of the question rather than pointless by lack of knowledge of alignment.

And what's the difference between those two kinds of pointless?

[Urist Imiknorris]

Posting from class.

Deathsword:

You misunderstood what I said there, I wasn't very sure about my suspicions, thus didn't want to act on them. When called on that I admitted that my scumhunting up to that point was indeed pretty bad, almost none.

Yeah, no. See the bolded parts:

UI:

Deathsword: For someone who claims not to have any real scumpicks, you sure don't seem to be interested in finding any.

I am terribly sorry that the way I like to scumhunt doesn't fit into your standards of scumhunting. I like to be sure about something before I do it, no matter what it is.

You're defending yourself by saying that you're scumhunting. Which you later admitted you weren't. Why did you lie to me, Deathsword?

Zombie:

"Potentially effective" has no meaning. Lurking all game can be "potentially effective." Eating ice cream can be "potentially effective."

Please explain how lurking all game can be potentially effective. Please explain how eating ice cream can be potentially effective.

Book: State your main suspects, and explain why you've only been going after lurkers, as well as why you yourself have been lurking.

[Teneb]

Shakerag: Okay, I'll admit: my scumhunting is being almost none so far, and what I did wasn't very good.

Since you admit to it, why shouldn't you be hanged speedily and ruthlessly?

Because I'm trying to change that.

Deathsword:

You misunderstood what I said there, I wasn't very sure about my suspicions, thus didn't want to act on them. When called on that I admitted that my scumhunting up to that point was indeed pretty bad, almost none.

Yeah, no. See the bolded parts:

UI:

Deathsword: For someone who claims not to have any real scumpicks, you sure don't seem to be interested in finding any.

I am terribly sorry that the way I like to scumhunt doesn't fit into your standards of scumhunting. I like to be sure about something before I do it, no matter what it is.

You're defending yourself by saying that you're scumhunting. Which you later admitted you weren't. Why did you lie to me, Deathsword?

At the time I thought that I'd be lynched for not doing anything constructive to the game if I admitted that I wasn't scumhunting.


Still waiting for Shakerag to explain how he got the idea that I accused him of OMGUSing me.

[Tiruin]

PFP -- working on an art project.

Deathsword: So in all that, you weren't scumhunting, then?

And if so, you're 'making sure' on only one person -- Shakerag, judging from your previous posts. You scumhunting...on one person who you're voting?

zombie urist

Although I'm wording it my own way, I'm doing my best to preserve the original meaning in the post. You are defending Shakerag because you are questioning my arguments instead of him. Yes I've been serious this entire game so far.

So you want to deflect onto Shakerag because of the fact that I'm questioning your arguments? How does that make sense?

I want Shakerag to answer my arguments and not you. This is not a deflection onto Shakerag.

Perhaps that is why he asked, right?

Haha no. I really doubt it.

@First: But I didn't. Did I?
@Second: And you did nothing about it but attack him.

Lastly, is your concern going anywhere other than you pointing it out?

I'm concerned that Bookthras has only made one post despite usually being very vocal on not lurking.

While you do have an opinion, back it up with something useful other than just pointing out others' words.

Checked the Lurker Tracker [Yes it works, though I'm not sure how as proceeding tries fail.]
Bookthras has 6 posts which match with IronyOwl, Jim Groovester, penngo009 while Think0028 has 4.

Though, you are right at the fact that Bookthras has only one other post in-game, I'd like to know why you're just putting out that concern while not asking him anything about it.

Also, what are your reads on everyone?

[Toaster]

Unvote Irony for now because he posted, though he really needs to do it again.


Dariush:

I don't believe in them. I'm an ascumbuddieist.

Oh, so you just don't believe in the ones you have?  Noted.

Dariush:

Why are you ignoring obvious sarcasm?

Because I want to hear his response to my response.

And... ignoring obvious sarcasm is supposed to somehow make it more likely for him to make a serious answer?

Irrelevant.  If I want his response, I want his response, sarcasm or not.  His response with a truckload of sarcasm is sufficient for now.

Was this the question you wanted answered?  I didn't see any others.


Think:

Tiruin, Toaster: Why are the two of you so quick to leap to my defense? I'm awfully curious why the two of you felt that RVS questions to me were something worth answering on my behalf.

Are you talking about the bottom of this post?  If so, two problems.  First, I'm not defending you- I'm attacking Jim's crappy question.  Second, I didn't actually answer the question.

Why are you saying I did something I didn't do?

Also, is your waiting on my response why you're hardly doing anything?


Hapah:

Toaster@124: Shakerag's Law - As the length of a mafia game grows, the odds that someone will accuse someone else of rolefishing goes to 1.  If Toaster is in the game, the odds of this happening D1 are greater. 

To answer your question, no, it was not intended to be any sort of rolefishing. 


Dariush:  If you were a woodchuck, what would your favorite color be?

Given RVS isn't unpredictable bullshit, what other unpredictable bullshit besides his role would he have seen?

Speaking of RVS, aren't we a bit late for that?


Deathsword:

Shakerag: I am acting on it. Unless my questions and answers to Tiruin and my question to you (now answered) are somehow invisible. And why are you voting Hapah's on Toaster's #1, if he delivered the vote he promised at 118 on 121? And since you are not willing to share your strategy behind that question to Dariush, I'll have to assume you asked that burden-of-guilt question to make him overreact and get lynched.

Twitchy knee-jerk vote much?


Penngo:

Shakerag, could you throw anything less at Deathsword?

What does this mean?

Also, why are you voting Irony for calling you out on your non-contributions?  What is the scummiest thing you've seen so far and why aren't you voting that person for doing it?


Book:

Toaster: why are you lurking like lurkscum? what do you make of Tiruin & Dariush's vote on TolyK?

Blame work, my wife, a bottle of wine, and a bucket of paint.

Tiruin's vote is based on TolyK's poorly-worded statement that is put in orange here, ironically making it into a sort of self-fufilling prophecy if TolyK is town.  I wouldn't vote TolyK over it because I get what he's trying (and mostly failing) to say.

Dariush's vote was initially ill-explained, but he did come back and clarify later.

What's your view on those votes?  Does TolyK deserve them?

Also, to answer the question you hid there (Is TolyK scum?) :  Maybe- see below.

Further, I notice you didn't respond to any of the answers to your starter RVS post.  You've, in fact, accused no one of anything except me of lurking.  I'd say it is equally you that needs to post more reads and get more involved... and hell, stop lurking like lurkscum.  Seriously, calling someone out for lurking on your second post of the game which occurs nearly 72 hours after game start is pretty flagrantly bad.


TolyK:  I've noticed you're responding to questions/attacks on you in lieu of scumhunting.  I agree with you that most D1 lynches are mislynches, but what effect does that have on your D1 scumhunting?

[Shakerag]

Okay, I'll rephrase it a bit. What would have been your reaction had I said in response to your second question 'I don't have scumbuddies, now what's up with the crappy questions, [VERYRED]Shakerag[/VERYRED]?'

I believe my reaction would be along the lines of "as expected". 

That last part is becuase Tiruin accused me of OMGUSing you. I don't know where you got the idea that I am accusing you of OMGUS.

As for the second point, you may claim otherwise, but I still believe you were trying to find a BS reason to vote Hapah and drive it into a lynch.

Ahh, reading comprehension for the win. 

That's your opinion, and you're entitled to it.  I think it's silly and a bit ironic, as I feel you're trying to find a BS reason to vote me and drive it into a lynch. 

Also, saying you're "trying to change that" and following up with "Still waiting for Shakerag" means you're doing exactly zero scumhunting in the meantime. 

Under the weather, will try to post later today.

I owe a better post, but it'll have to wait till later.

Technical difficulties, post tomorrow.

pfp

XCOM is awesome, homework takes forever if you're an idiot, will post after dinner.

This was an amusingly odd series of posts. 

So people haven't ever been lynched for things that were taken out of context, things that weren't necessarily unusual? Is that what you're driving at? Because you know damn well that Dar would be an easy fucking lynch to people not familiar with him if he snapped at you.

Sure people have been lynched for things taken out of context.  Hell, I think Dariush is still butthurt about that happening to him back in RL4.  But I still fail to see how Dariush acting like Dariush would get him lynched.  What reaction would I get, do you think, if I said to everyone here "Hey gaiz, Dariush just reacted to my RVS question in a totally angrey way!  He's gotta be teh scumz!"  I mean, seriously.  Also, Dariush is in practically every game, so who here isn't familiar with him?

Also, that last question of mine to Dariush was more of a joke, son. 

A joke? A joke? Nobody's laughing, are they? If you're going to make a joke, at least make it funny like Jim did.

Are you going to tell me your first two questions to Dar were jokes too? Hm? Because they all look like trivial bullshit from where I'm standing, and you claimed you had a reason for the first two. What makes this one different? Did you hope to get some deep goddamn insight from asking if QT is working? I think you didn't have a reason for either of the first two, and said the third just to keep up appearances.

The first two questions were reaction test questions.  Nothing came of them.  The third was inspired by post #138.  I suppose the only thing I was expecting out of it was a colorful insult thrown my way.  My disapointment is overwhelming.

It's your opinion that it was all trivial bullshit.  It's my opinion that it was worth throwing a question and seeing if he would be caught off guard.  You seem to be getting awfully worked up over this.

No, I voted him with a straight face and questionable reasoning to see how he'd react.

Questionable my ass; you were clearly in the wrong.

My Understatement skill is at High Master. 

Or maybe I asked a bullshit question, knowing full well that it was bullshit, to see Think0028's response.

Careful.  Apparently that sort of thing will get you lynched in this game, Jim.

Given RVS isn't unpredictable bullshit, what other unpredictable bullshit besides his role would he have seen?

Speaking of RVS, aren't we a bit late for that?

To be fair, for all we know there could have been unpredictable bullshit happening during RVS.  Jim could have, to pull an example out of air, been targeted with a day ability that turned him into a fish.  In hindsight, it may have been ever so slightly tongue-in-cheek as well.

And, again, it was a joke.  A bit of banter, if you will.  A playful ribbing aimed at our dearly beloved Dariush. 


Speaking of Dariush: I think you're voting TolyK for stupid reasons.  His response says to me that you asked him a question to which he couldn't provide a stellar response, due to not knowing a number of players in the game.  And you're making scumtells out of thin air.  Convince me otherwise.

[TolyK]

Buh, so much posts to go over...
I'm extremely sorry for inactivity, it'll rise this weekend...