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[Shinotsa]

Thanks for all the replies.

So, is CC not as bad as my parents think? :S It seems that taking one or two years in CC to cut costs, then take specifics at a four-year university sounds reasonable, but I don't know if I could convince my parents, nor if the CC will provide a good education >.>

Deferred education might be an OK way to present it, since I'm basically accepted at a college that way ... hrm.

Is it possible to take just one year of CC and then three of univ? :-0
For working, I think the F visa lets students work to help pay tuition and living costs. Not a permanent work permit, sadly.

Can you apply for a permanent work visa after graduating, citing your schooling in the United States as a connection to the country?

Anyhow, like I said before: there is no notation on your diploma that you took credits at a community college. This is what I would explain to your parents. If there is anything of the sort than I have been lied to repeatedly by friends, alumni, and faculty. As long as you are in some way guaranteed to get into the school you want to after doing a year or two of CC there really isn't a reason I can think of as to why you wouldn't want to save the money.

[mainiac]

Is it possible to take just one year of CC and then three of univ? :-0

Yes it is, CCs are flexible to whatever you want.  Many american high schoolers will take community college classes in their junior or senior years of highschool and some 4-year college students take community college courses over the summer.  You can also take courses that wont contribute to your 4-year degree but are simply very interesting or useful to take.  I took a machine shop class at night along with my dad and brother and we found it was interesting and fun even though none of us needed to take it.

nor if the CC will provide a good education >.>

It's just that the intro level courses in american colleges aren't as hard or prestigious as the upper level stuff.  The foundation courses don't get the same attention or resources as the upper level courses.  They are covering material that a lot of highschool students learn through the Advanced Placement program.  A CC can handle this stuff just fine.  It's important to have broad horizons but for basic material it's overkill to insist that a respected PhD teach the lectures on bio 101.  If you need something to tell your parents then it basically boils down to "everyone says that the first year of american college is a waste of time."  I think most americans are going to agree with that sentiment.

You might suffer whiplash from going from a very low pressure environment into upper level courses though.  It shouldn't be as bad if you only do one year at CC but for me it was jarring to go from getting my AA to senior year of college in a few months.  So that's a good reason to consider only getting one year of CC.

[nenjin]

I'm agreement with maniac. The first year of college is a lot like your last two years of highschool. The difference, for those that struggle with certain disciplines, is that failure isn't really an option anymore. Like, I struggled with College Algebra. So I had to give the math course at the community college my undivided attention, because getting a C- or D+ wasn't going to cut it. (Your Grade Point Average, the average of all the grades you've gotten, means little in American high school other than honors. But for getting accepted to college and meeting the requirements set forth by your diploma, it's VERY important. The bar isn't terribly high in most disciplines, but if you fail to meet the requirements, you ain't graduating. Nor can you continue to enroll in the courses you need to graduate, until you raise your GPA back up.)

And yes, doing too much CC can give you a false expectation of how difficult a 4-year university can be. Each class at a 4-year university beyond the 100 level courses tends to act as though you have no other responsibilities (even though your professors are aware you have TONS of other things to do.) So they will pile on to the degree the professor thinks is warranted, and sometimes, that can be a very nasty shock. Like I said above, CC's are generally focused on getting people through the curriculum and the overall workload and the depth of the curriculum usually reflects that. Universities aren't quite so forgiving, nor are they as concerned with your absolute success.

[Skyrunner]

Are the 100s courses at a 4 year and a CC very different? Is that a nasty shock too, goingfrom a CC freshman course to a sophomore course? :s

[Tellemurius]

Are the 100s courses at a 4 year and a CC very different? Is that a nasty shock too, goingfrom a CC freshman course to a sophomore course? :s

Not really unless you move to a different state. In my case i took my 100s classes in colorado and when i moved to utah they didn't want to transfer my credits over so im starting all over again even though both schools participated in the WUE which means they should have transferred fine :mad:

[nenjin]

Are the 100s courses at a 4 year and a CC very different? Is that a nasty shock too, goingfrom a CC freshman course to a sophomore course? :s

Not especially. Generally I'd say a college will require more reading for the same material, charge you more for the same resources (textbooks ect...), and might require more lectures and in-class time than a CC.

Going from freshmen CC to sophomore college can be a bit of a shock though. 200-level courses are where the exceptionally lazy/weak start to struggle because the training wheels have come off and no one is gently reminding you of the price of failure anymore. Really, upper level university courses are as much about self-discipline as they are about the actual content. If you're a disciplined student who knows how to respect deadlines and knows how and when to sacrifice fun for work...you'll be fine. Stressed, but fine.

[Mephansteras]

My personal experience is a pretty good example of this working.

I had been going to a 4 year university (the Rochester Institute of Technology), but decided to move with my Family to San Diego when my dad got a job out here.

That stuck me in  rather bad spot, school-wise, since trying to transfer to a California University from out of state doesn't work too well. However, California has this nifty system where if you go to a community college they have programs that give you guaranteed admission to either a University of California school or a California State University (yes, those are two completely different things). Since I was going into business, I went for the San Diego State University track. Oh, and once I counted as being a resident of California (after the first year of living here) I got extremely low tuition fees for the CC courses.

I did two years of community college, which while not hard was actually pretty decent as far as preparing me for the Univeristy. I learned a good bit and had absolutely no problems adjusting to the University classes. I got a good degree, landed a good job even before I got out of the University, and eventually went back and got my masters.

So, no, depending on where you go it is very far from a dead-end path. In most states that I'm aware of the community colleges often work as a dedicated route to a 4 year university.

It may not get you into an Ivy League school, but depending on where you are and what field you want to go into it's a good solid track.

The only thing I'm not sure of in your case is how Student Visas work with all of this.

[Shinotsa]

I cannot verify whether or not the 100 level courses at CC are easier/harder than at a University, but I do know that my University offered advanced 100 level courses for those specialized in that field. (Bio 151/152 vs Bio 101/102) I'm not sure if CC offers the same variety as universities, but I do know that mine has various honors courses through the Honors College and a few different levels for most underclassman courses.

I can however, verify that professors don't care much about your workload. I just had my biochem (Chem 403) professor tack on memorization of all 20 amino acids and their structures, type, and three letter abbreviation to a 3 chapter quiz that we are having next class. And that's just me getting lucky. Most professors don't offer quizzes to prepare their students for tests.

[GlyphGryph]

Again, the issue is that the "quality of education" simply /doesn't matter/ for the stuff CC is teaching, to a large extent. It's all stuff you are not only perfectly capable of learning yourself, given the right opportunity and materials (which most CCs manage to do), but which you need to be ABLE to learn yourself or you've basically got no chance in the harder major-specific classes or life after university (which expects you to have mastered all the many things your university didn't teach you or even mention to you, ESPECIALLY in computer science).

University serves 2 purposes - learning opportunities and social connections. You're only really missing out on the second with a CC, but most of your Uni connections before 3rd year have a tendency not to last anyway.

I guess if you're more of a social person or a leader type, you can start in University - but most of the people I know who did that dropped out after 2 years because they got everything they needed out of it and were ready to move on to the big time.

So I feel like 2 years in a real University (ignoring masters and PHDs) is really all you need.

[mainiac]

I can't believe I forgot about CLEP!  If you think Community College is a good idea then CLEP is a freakin' fantastic one, especially for an international student like yourself.

CLEPs are tests in subjects taught in high school or the first year of college that allow you to receive equivalent credits to a college course.  You take a single 90 minute test and if you score high enough you receive 3 college credits.  Taking a CLEP is even cheaper then taking a community college course and a lot faster too.  Seeing as you will have no American educational history CLEP tests will allow you to get credits for some of the coursework that you took in Korea that has an American equivalent.  They only cover fairly basic stuff and CLEP tests do not impact your GPA but still it's very helpful for getting credits out of the way.  Sadly it seems like the only CLEP testing centers in Korea are on US army bases.  But you could still take the CLEP tests once you get to the US.  They aren't all that hard and only take 90 minutes IIRC so if you arrive a bit early for school they should be pretty easy.

If you are looking to accelerate your education and save on money then CLEP is definitely going to be relevant to your interests.

[GlyphGryph]

Wait... it isn't standard procedure for every student to try and test out of ever single class?

People are really missing out, then! (okay, maybe not every class, but every one I could. And usually a few days of self study are all you need)

[mainiac]

CLEP isn't quite the same thing as testing out of a class.  CLEP gets you credits towards the number needed for your degree.

[GlyphGryph]

...ah, I see. That makes sense I guess. Though now I'm struggling to understand why you wouldn't get credit for a class you've tested out of, though...

I assume we're talking general credits, here? Rather than credits in those specific courses, which I'm pretty sure testing out gives you...

[mainiac]

I am unaware of any schools that give credits for placement tests.

[Tellemurius]

Its only for general education courses