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Author Topic: Ubisoft finally shows reason? And the Horsemen Ride.  (Read 5530 times)

alexandertnt

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Re: Ubisoft finally shows reason? And the Horsemen Ride.
« Reply #45 on: September 07, 2012, 07:35:13 am »

my guess is that they just recived the bill for their drm servers. never trust a press statement.

*Ubisoft exec gets DRM bill* "My god, thats alot of 0's" *next day* "Behold gamers, we have listened to you and removed the DRM. We are great."
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Starver

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Re: Ubisoft finally shows reason? And the Horsemen Ride.
« Reply #46 on: September 07, 2012, 07:49:46 am »

Though I doubt it would happen, it'd probably be a bit more of a shock if it were a whole lot of zeros in their sales figures.  Just zeroes, that is.
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lavenders2

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Re: Ubisoft finally shows reason? And the Horsemen Ride.
« Reply #47 on: September 08, 2012, 06:42:51 am »

PC gamer logic:

Ubisoft implements bad DRM: Screw you Ubisoft, you suck! Remove DRM!
Ubisoft removes always online DRM: You still suck!

Honestly, if they removed it, it should be ok to buy their games again right? Pretty sure it was the number one complaint, and they just removed it. What happened is the PC community literally told them to F off and just stay away anyway. PC gamers are entitled, elitist people that are incredibly pessimistic and will stuff developers heads in regardless of actions, judging them on past movements.

I don't blame developers for shutting out the PC community.

What? This statement is somewhat ignorant.

People are still complaining because they don't like their games, that is why some people are telling them to F off. They have every right to do so and should do so if they do not like their games. If there is one thing that has always annoyed me about claiming people to be entitled, or elitist is it is often used:

A) Regardless of their opinion. It is not elitist to dislike Ubisoft, nor is it elitist to talk about disliking Ubisoft. It is not  a form of "entitlement" to dislike DRM, it is not "entitlement" to not want DRM.
B) Applied to every-single person. Here, you have lumped every single PC gamer into one blob and called all of them eitist and entitled. Some of "us" might take offence to having all our opinions ignored, and instead mashed into one gigantic blanket-statement applied evenly to every single one of "us". Your statment seems to imply that there is no such thing as a non-elitist or non-entitled PC gamer.

Its not OK to buy their games for some because said games suck, and these "elitist" PC gamers are under no obligation to spend their money on Ubisoft. It is not elitist, nor does it imply any sence of entitlement to complain and criticize them or their games.

You also seem to have confused developers and publishers when you stated that "PC gamers ... will stuff developers heads in regardless of actions, judging them on past movements." (Again, with the no-exceptions-all-PC-gamers). Ignoring this, 2 Points:

A) This "past movement" only passed a few days ago, you can't honostly expect everyone to go "oh good, I completely forgive them for any issues I had with them in the past and no longer expect that they could do anything similar ever again. Now to start purchasing their games again"
B) It is perfectly reasonable to judge devs/publisers on their past movements. For the same reason we study history. It can be useful to extrapolate what can happen in the future.

So no, its not elitism or any sense of entitlement, just alot of unhappy potential customers which Ubisoft are now only realising are not obligated to hand their money over. Ubisoft must listen to us entitled, elitists because its our damn money, we wont give it to them unless we want to, and they have to make us want to give them money.

Okay, I admit it. The statement was probably incorrect. I should have said MANY PC gamers are entitled.

Let's talk about being entitled for a minute though. Based on personal experience, I have found that gamer's are after nothing less than perfectionism. Some people expect the very best from developers, often more than they can actually deliver. I understand wanting to make a better game, and I also understand constructive criticism, but when some people bring nothing but "fix game plox!" it drives me a little insane. This is even worse when the complaints are minor, such as a typo or small bug (like an animation not working) and they claim that the game is terrible until said bug is fixed.

So complaining about a game when it has many bugs, or major bugs (like the gaming actually not working) would not be entitled. You have every right to get your moneys worth by actually playing the game, and if the product is not working as advertised, then you should fight for it.

Ubi have removed the painful parts of the DRM because people asked them to do so (It was probably impacting their profits too). Now people are complaining at Ubi still for.... some reason. I actually don't know. Just past grudges I guess. There really is no need to whine about them anymore. If you don't want to buy their games because they were idiots towards the PC community, that is OK. If you still hate them over what they have done, that is OK. But Ubi are doing something, and perhaps encouraging them to keep this up rather than barking at them would work better?

My point is that complaining about something that was fixed upon your own request is pretty... dumb. It is working as intended, yet some still can't seem to appreciate it. Surely if you still hate it after so many months and you hate the games associated with this DRM, you would have left by now...

Let's just let it settle and see if Ubisoft can keep up the good work.
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alexandertnt

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Re: Ubisoft finally shows reason? And the Horsemen Ride.
« Reply #48 on: September 08, 2012, 09:53:55 am »

Okay, I admit it. The statement was probably incorrect. I should have said MANY PC gamers are entitled.

Probably incorrect? Are you saying that is only probably at least one non-entitled PC gamer out there?
Ugh, again with the blanket statements. "Many" is a word with meaning... Now apparently if you meet a PC gamer, changes are that they are entitled. Lovely. Statistics? Nope. They just are, because you think so. End of story.

Let's talk about being entitled for a minute though. Based on personal experience, I have found that gamer's are after nothing less than perfectionism. Some people expect the very best from developers, often more than they can actually deliver. I understand wanting to make a better game, and I also understand constructive criticism, but when some people bring nothing but "fix game plox!" it drives me a little insane. This is even worse when the complaints are minor, such as a typo or small bug (like an animation not working) and they claim that the game is terrible until said bug is fixed.

So you read some reviews on Metacritic and decided that that reflects most PC gamers? Gamers don't demand perfection, they are sour at Ubisoft because they have not been able to play their games. Or they have, and lost hours of gameplay because of the DRM breaking for whatever reason. DRM which served no function and accomplished nothing other then to bump up the price or detract away from the game. How many people complain about a small typo? An animation not working can be more than a small bug depending on the game system (since some games use the animation info to determine event info). I think it is reasonable that if you charge 90$ for a game, that at least the animations work properly. As for the "Fix game plox!", they are geneally kids/trolls, and you can't possibly take their crude compaints and act as if they somehow reflect the majority of PC gamers (again, statistics?)

Ubi have removed the painful parts of the DRM because people asked them to do so (It was probably impacting their profits too). Now people are complaining at Ubi still for.... some reason. I actually don't know. Just past grudges I guess.

Ubisoft, being a company, removed the DRM because it was not profitable. Because those "entitled" gamers were refusing to buy their games, and/or the DRM was costing too much. They did NOT do it because people asked them to do so. Thinking that would be egotistic.

Perhaps people hold a grudge becase they produce mediocre games? Or perhaps past experiences have led them to suspect that Ubisoft have something else up their sleeve. Surely these point remains valid even after they abandoned this DRM. For some reason, your statement seems to suggest that there are no other valid reasons to compain about Ubisoft.

There really is no need to whine about them anymore. If you don't want to buy their games because they were idiots towards the PC community, that is OK. If you still hate them over what they have done, that is OK. But Ubi are doing something, and perhaps encouraging them to keep this up rather than barking at them would work better?

That would be true if the DRM was the only issue people had with them, as there would be no more issues with Ubisoft. Then there would be nothing to whine about. But some people had and still have other issues with Ubisoft. This statement assumes that most PC gamers either

A) are still sour for no reason (statistics?) OR
B) Now, for some reason have had other compaints they may have invalidated for some reason somehow.

Imagine someone that did not like Ubisoft because their games were mediocre, and their DRM was awful (me, for example). Now the DRM is not an issue... they still suck. Perhaps a little less, but in this case all the DRM-removal did was remove the barrier to play mediocre games. Horay. So there is reason to "whine" about them for some. Valid reasons.

Ubisoft is not a child. Saying "Keep up the good work!" wont give them the self-esteem they need to make better games.

My point is that complaining about something that was fixed upon your own request is pretty... dumb. It is working as intended, yet some still can't seem to appreciate it. Surely if you still hate it after so many months and you hate the games associated with this DRM, you would have left by now...

Let's just let it settle and see if Ubisoft can keep up the good work.

No one is compaining about the now-nonexistant DRM (only perhaps speculating about what-next). Show me someone complaining about the now fixed DRM (Except, you know, the people who are still suffering it because they haven't actually removed it yes, since it's just words at this point)? You seem to have decided that all critism directed towards Ubisoft was solely over the DRM. That would have been the "flag-ship" issue, but it was not the only one.

Imagine buying some-Ubisoft-DRM-Game, and not being able to play it reliably because your internet is imperfect/Ubisoft servers are having a bad day. Now imagine that they have now removed it, years later. You would not "appreciate" that. Your $90 game should have been playable from day 1. The removal of the DRM is good, but it should not have been there in the first place. I dont consider it "good work", I consider it "about bloody time, now perhaps they may also start making decent games".

When people form groups in their heads such as "PC gamers", the criteria for being part of this group tends to be also formed by the same person. Since that person has decided that "All X are Y", most people they see acting as Y become X. Without a proper definition of what is a PC gamer (facebook game once a week? 18 hours/day, where imbetween etc), a definition of what an entitled/elitist one is, and statistics from that group, your statement that "MANY PC gamers are entitled" is pretty much meaningless.

When I said "Now apparently if you meet a PC gamer, changes are that they are entitled" It should probably have read "Now apparently if you meet someone who you judge to be entitled/elitist and may play PC games, they are a PC gamer. But if you meet a pretty-good-guy and they may play PC games, they are not, because the human brain does a pretty good job of silently ignoring anything that goes agains't it's conclusion (this is one of the reasons we have this wonderful discipline called statistics)".

tl;dr: Still ignorant, and without any real meaning. Not a shread of evidence. Too much time on Metacritic's User Score.
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This is when I imagine the hilarity which may happen if certain things are glichy. Such as targeting your own body parts to eat.

You eat your own head
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LoSboccacc

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Re: Ubisoft finally shows reason? And the Horsemen Ride.
« Reply #49 on: September 08, 2012, 10:11:01 am »

I tend not to get near ex murderers because 'it is ok now they stopped'

Is it a form of bias? Absolutely. But UBI track record is one of the worst, on par of CA selling fixes and EA wanting to pwn your PC.

They may one day stop altogheter being bad companies, but it will take time to regain 'street credits'
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Zangi

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Re: Ubisoft finally shows reason? And the Horsemen Ride.
« Reply #50 on: September 08, 2012, 10:40:59 am »

I don't know man...  I'd think most if not all of us browsing this forum is a PC Gamer...  that your opinion of the lot of us too?
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timferius

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Re: Ubisoft finally shows reason? And the Horsemen Ride.
« Reply #51 on: September 08, 2012, 11:05:16 am »

I tend not to get near ex murderers because 'it is ok now they stopped'

Is it a form of bias? Absolutely. But UBI track record is one of the worst, on par of CA selling fixes and EA wanting to pwn your PC.

They may one day stop altogheter being bad companies, but it will take time to regain 'street credits'

I worry about how youre world works.... Sure, Ubisofts DRM was bad, but murder?
I'd more equate it to being near a reformed pick pocket. Sure, I'll hang around with him, but it's going to take years of hanging out before I take my hand off my wallet.
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TripJack

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Re: Ubisoft finally shows reason? And the Horsemen Ride.
« Reply #52 on: September 08, 2012, 12:17:48 pm »

call me when they start making quality games that are actually worth playing
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Alkhemia

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Re: Ubisoft finally shows reason? And the Horsemen Ride.
« Reply #53 on: September 08, 2012, 12:22:04 pm »

What about assassin's creed and the soon to be watchdogs though I play my PS3 more then my PC for games so I'm not in the whole PC master race thing.  ::)
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Zangi

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Re: Ubisoft finally shows reason? And the Horsemen Ride.
« Reply #54 on: September 08, 2012, 12:31:21 pm »

You don't have to be part of the Master Race to play PC Games...
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timferius

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Re: Ubisoft finally shows reason? And the Horsemen Ride.
« Reply #55 on: September 08, 2012, 01:04:46 pm »

I have to say, I've enjoyed most of the Assasin's creed games, and am looking forward to watchdogs and the New Assassin's creed. Also, the latest settlers game does look like great fun.
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Alkhemia

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Re: Ubisoft finally shows reason? And the Horsemen Ride.
« Reply #56 on: September 08, 2012, 01:19:19 pm »

I liked From Dust as well.
@Zangi most of the hate for Ubisoft is on the PC side I've had no trouble with any of my PS3 Ubisoft games the Online Pass thing is easy to get around PSN saves it to your downloads so if your friends have your PSN and you lend them the game they can use the pass put yeah uplay a bitch, steam much better.                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                 
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"Hiken: Tsubame-Gaeshi" -Sasaki Kojirou (Grand Order}

"Please touch me. Without lying, wherever you want to touch. That is my wish." - Kiyohime (Grand Order)

"Tyranny, violation, genocide. Those are the things that I detest above all else." - Amakusa Shirou Tokisada (Grand Order)

Shadowlord

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Re: Ubisoft finally shows reason? And the Horsemen Ride.
« Reply #57 on: September 08, 2012, 01:44:24 pm »

DRM? There's no DRM in my Ubisoft games - I only ever played the XBox 360 versions, because they didn't (and couldn't) stuff those full of DRM like they did the PC versions, and neither could the 360 versions of their games turn out to be bad console ports

That's not to say I avoid all PC versions of 360 games. I've bought some. Skyrim was a disappointment (too many technical difficulties and crashes) where the XBox version just worked, Red Faction: Guerilla was great, and EA's Dead Space 1 was a bad console port and Dead Space 2 had DRM (haven't tried it to see if it was a bad console port too).
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LoSboccacc

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Re: Ubisoft finally shows reason? And the Horsemen Ride.
« Reply #58 on: September 08, 2012, 03:19:44 pm »

you'd think? I see an increasing trend in forcing users to play trough proprietary servers even on xbox skipping the built in networking (EA does this).

Ubi still doesn't do it, but don't feel secure just because of xbox.
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Draco18s

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Re: Ubisoft finally shows reason? And the Horsemen Ride.
« Reply #59 on: September 08, 2012, 04:13:15 pm »

I'm sorry, but any argument that says I should go out and pay $400 for a separate piece of hardware in order to play games is a poor argument.
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