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Author Topic: Mispronunciation  (Read 7694 times)

Siquo

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Re: Mispronunciation
« Reply #45 on: September 04, 2012, 05:33:55 am »

Losh Ness.
No, that kinda sounds wrong.
Ich is not ish :) It's a sound without english equivalent. A (northern) Dutchman would make it sound like he was tearing paper inside his mouth. The German, Scottish and Flemish/southern Dutch variant is a lot softer than that. Maybe the sound of a piece of silk being torn apart.

I have one friend who pronounces 'meme' not like 'gene', but as mee-mee.
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DJ

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Re: Mispronunciation
« Reply #46 on: September 04, 2012, 06:40:45 am »

I think I'd mispronounce ~90% of my English vocabulary because I have next to zero experience with spoken English. On the plus side, I sound like a James Bond villain when I speak English.
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Starver

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Re: Mispronounciation
« Reply #47 on: September 04, 2012, 07:02:15 am »

(Mild sub-thread necro. [Oh, actually the two replies (not counting an even newer one by Blofeld) that have happened since I started this are on this subject, too].)
It's pronunciation. That aside, the Scots word loch. The ch is pronounced as in the German ich. Not pronounced like lock.


How do you pronounce a German ich? It's a sort of silent C, right?

It's like the "ch" in the Scottish word "Loch". ;)


(Seriously... how about trying to voice "h(k)h", a "heh" sound running into (but not quite reaching) a hard "ck"?  Or perhaps better as a "hhh" sound with a bit of "nearly k" being attempted part way through.)

If you have any knowledge of Welsh, that "Ll" (double-L) is the "L" version of the above "K" one.  But Welsh also have "Ch", not too dissimilar from that of the various Celtic linguistic relations.  (And both of these, and some other digraphs like "ng"[1] and "dd"[2] and "ff"[3], technically being single characters in their own right within the Welsh dictionary.)


But, insofar as new content, my own bug-bears of others' pronunciation:
"Could(/should/would/etc) of" instead of "Could have" or the contracted "Could've" ("Cud'əv").  I can only really take heart that, typically being inner-city people, there's a higher than usual chance that someone who says this (and, worse, writes this![4]) may end up being shot.
"Aks" (for the word "ask").  With a similar passive acceptance of the likelihood of firearm death.


...and... I think that's it for my hate-list.  Except for some annoying (and continuing) mispronunciations of various local railway stations by the pre-recorded announcements, stresses in the wrong place and elongations and contractions all mixed around, even though the basic sounds are right.

Not bug-bears, but of note: An amusing near-local pronunciation is "boook" for "book", but they are probably as humoured by my pronunciation as "buck".  I can take or leave "Grarse" and "Barth" for "Grass" and "Bath", but I'm a 'short-a' person myself.  "Arse" is "Aarse", however, and "Ass" is only applicable (visually or audibly) to something donkey-like (not the butt, tuckus, backside, rear-end, etc), unless I'm lapsing into a Leftpondian accent or terminology for some obscure reason.

My Dad's currently complaining that a lot of people are saying "DE-scent" instead of "de-scENT" for "descent", e.g. Chris Boardman's commentary of the TdF and various Olympics road cycling events.  I'm not sure how legitimate that is.  I say the latter, except when I'm emphasising something like "First there was the A-scent, after which there was a DE-scent!"[5].  He also often picks up on "Mayoral" being said "May-ore-ee-al", to vastly rhyme with "Memorial".  I agree about the "-ee-al" bit being illogical, but can't make myself say "Mair-al", even though "Mayor" in my accent is pretty much "Mair", so end up saying "May-ore-al", on the few occasions I've ever needed to.

(BTW, a historic mispronunciation of mine was a misreading of the word "Jettison", as in "The first stage of the rocket is now jettisoned", as being "Jetonise" (i.e. to 'jet', or propel, the discarded item away from the rest of the rocket).  For probably the reason of that association with "jet", this never applied to non-spacecraft ships discarding items, whether water-based or balloons with their ballast or even (albeit typically pre-jet, WW2) aeroplanes, where I'd correctly parse and internally pronounce the word when reading about how a bomber crew would jettison their bomb load, etc...)


[1] Not terribly far from the N-tilde in the Spanish word for "Tomorrow", but not actually close enough to state this as fact, either.

[2] Pronounced "Th".  As in "The", not "Thing".  The actual letters "Th" is the "Th" in "Thing", and never "Th" in "The".

[3] Pronounced "F", with an "F" on its own actually being "V".  Oh, and "Y" is more like a "u"[3a], but less so than the vowel that is "W" ("Bws" is Welsh for "Bus", frexample, with very little audible difference outside of accent effects), while "U" is quite like "Ee".  And now I expect you to know how to pronounce both Cymru (Welsh name for "Wales", approximately "Cum-ree") and specifically the place name "Ystradfellte" (somewhere I was in the vicinity of, at the weekend, but which usually confuses visitors and amuses the locals who have to respond to visitors asking for directions). ;)

[3a] North and south regions of Wales differ on this point, in particular, so YMMV.  I've ended up with a bit of a mix of the two accents, however, whenever I'm tempted to effuse in the local lingo.

[4] Take note, forumites!  I've seen you do it, those that do.  And I try not to complain via PM (or publicly) when you write "could of" in anything I read here, but you've got to accept that it's just plain wrong and occasionally I can't resist mentioning it in passing!

[5] Emphasis is often gotten so wrong, however.  Every now and then you hear something like "The deficit was one million last year, but now it's three million."  (Should be more like "...now it's three million.", emphasising the changed bit.  We already had a "millions" figure.  Compare and contrast "It used to be three thousand, but now it's three million!", which is better.  Ok, so add a "misemphasis" cover-all to my only two real mispronunciation bugbears.
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Darvi

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Re: Mispronounciation
« Reply #48 on: September 04, 2012, 07:04:18 am »

How do you pronounce a German ich? It's a sort of silent C, right?
It's pronounced Ish. Don't let anybody else fool you.

^Me, on full sincerity mode.

Also, quoth wikipedia,  /lɒx ˈnɛs/ . So the two words have absolutely nothing in common except for the two letters that are pronounced differently.
« Last Edit: September 04, 2012, 07:07:13 am by Darvi »
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The Mechanical Man

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Re: Mispronunciation
« Reply #49 on: September 04, 2012, 07:11:52 am »

Essentially everyone I know pronounces the word "because" be-cuz and not be-cause.
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Starver

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Re: Mispronunciation
« Reply #50 on: September 04, 2012, 07:37:28 am »

I can't tell you how many times I've just tried to compare my pronunciation of "Ich bin" (with Scottish 'ch') and "Ish bin" (as in "Fish bin") and tried out a middle version that's more breathy than "sh", but not quite the grating "ch", all to see what I might sound like.  It's a good job there's nobody currently in the office to hear me. ;)

I've tended to go for the Scottish 'ch' when I've deigned to try to speak such things in Deutsch at all.  I'm sure I make far more erroneous pronunciation errors, however (e.g. not getting my ß to be the right sharpness of 's' as I should, and much apart from the general bad grammar and impromptu insertion of 'Deutschlisch' or even a few actually Nederlander words through my desperate lack of local lexicon), so that's probably why no native speaker has ever really complained about that aspect of my attempted discourse. ;)

I suspect I'm doing something in the same camp as orientals not having the ability to intrinsically recognise the difference between (and themselves enunciating correctly) the L and R sounds.  But I also imagine I'm slightly better in the aforementioned case than I am with the various clicks of the Xhosa language. ;)

(To the latest Ninja...  Personally, I'm more a "be-coz" person, but while I can hear "cuz" (the term that is short for "cousin") as lower, my "o" might be bent "u"-wards compared with any other accent, so give or take our relative understanding of the vowels involved.  Still, the ending (relative to the rest of my speech) is definitely like the entire word that is "cause" ("corz"?) but shorter, perhaps more clipped.)


Forgot to say...  All this mention of "Milk" being pronounced funny, anyone know what I mean by the "backwards-y" pronunciation of the "l" in the word?  (Sort of "Miyuk", a traditionally Londonesque way of saying it.)
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Hubris Incalculable

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Re: Mispronunciation
« Reply #51 on: September 04, 2012, 11:01:46 am »

You know, it would be easier to tell how the "mispronunciations" sound if you were to use the International Phonetic Alphabet. English is just too dialectally fragmented for anyone to effectively transcribe their pronunciation without it.

[jʌ nou ɪt wʊd bi 'i.zi.jɚ tə tɛɫ hau ðə ˌmɪs.pɹən.ʌn.si.'je.ʃunz saund ɪf ju wər tə juz ði ˌɪn.tɚ.'næ.ʃən.əɫ fɐn.'ɛt.ɪk 'æɫ.fɐ.bɛt]
['ɪŋ.glɪʃ ɪz dʒʌst tu daɪ.jə.'lɛk.tɫ̩.i fɹæg.'mɛn.təd fɔ˞ 'ɛn.i.wɐn tu ɛf.'ek.tɪv.ly tɹæn.'skɹaɪb ðɛɝ pɹən.ˌʌn.si.'je.ʃun wɪθaut ɪt]
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nenjin

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Re: Mispronunciation
« Reply #52 on: September 04, 2012, 11:09:00 am »

Every time I see the word Brazier, in my head it sounds like Brassiere.
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kaijyuu

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Re: Mispronunciation
« Reply #53 on: September 04, 2012, 11:09:44 am »

I'm pretty sure most people do that :P
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Leafsnail

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Re: Mispronunciation
« Reply #54 on: September 04, 2012, 11:26:57 am »

I'm not sure about the one you listed for "hemorrhage" because I don't know how to quite interpret your pronunciation there.
Don't worry, I have worked out exactly what he means.
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rhesusmacabre

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Re: Mispronunciation
« Reply #55 on: September 04, 2012, 01:05:11 pm »

What's the fastest cake in the world?
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

If you don't understand it, you're probably saying it wrong.

(Whether it's actually funny is up for debate. Or indeed, even a cake. I vote yes and yes.)
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Simmura McCrea

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Re: Mispronunciation
« Reply #56 on: September 04, 2012, 01:07:10 pm »

You know, it would be easier to tell how the "mispronunciations" sound if you were to use the International Phonetic Alphabet. English is just too dialectally fragmented for anyone to effectively transcribe their pronunciation without it.

[jʌ nou ɪt wʊd bi 'i.zi.jɚ tə tɛɫ hau ðə ˌmɪs.pɹən.ʌn.si.'je.ʃunz saund ɪf ju wər tə juz ði ˌɪn.tɚ.'næ.ʃən.əɫ fɐn.'ɛt.ɪk 'æɫ.fɐ.bɛt]
['ɪŋ.glɪʃ ɪz dʒʌst tu daɪ.jə.'lɛk.tɫ̩.i fɹæg.'mɛn.təd fɔ˞ 'ɛn.i.wɐn tu ɛf.'ek.tɪv.ly tɹæn.'skɹaɪb ðɛɝ pɹən.ˌʌn.si.'je.ʃun wɪθaut ɪt]
Except nobody knows how to read that shit. I'm pretty sure your last paragraph there is the first one in said IPA, but it could just as easily be Greek.
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kaijyuu

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Re: Mispronunciation
« Reply #57 on: September 04, 2012, 01:12:59 pm »

Yeah... I don't think any of us are Mr. Higgins and can actually read those.
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For, in order that men should resist injustice, something more is necessary than that they should think injustice unpleasant. They must think injustice absurd; above all, they must think it startling. They must retain the violence of a virgin astonishment. When the pessimist looks at any infamy, it is to him, after all, only a repetition of the infamy of existence. But the optimist sees injustice as something discordant and unexpected, and it stings him into action.

MetalSlimeHunt

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Re: Mispronunciation
« Reply #58 on: September 04, 2012, 01:19:46 pm »

Apparently you can use IPA to learn how to speak backwards.
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Starver

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Re: Mispronunciation
« Reply #59 on: September 04, 2012, 01:32:25 pm »

You know, it would be easier to tell how the "mispronunciations" sound if you were to use the International Phonetic Alphabet. English is just too dialectally fragmented for anyone to effectively transcribe their pronunciation without it.
I might do, except I always come across something that doesn't work, when I go to the effort of chucking the special characters in.

(You'll note I used the schwa character, though.  Hopefully correctly.)
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