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[Sergius]

No, Adams does NOT get to be thrown a bone on this.  The plot is flimsy as f$#k.

Who's Adams? You mean Abrahams?

I don't think he actually wrote the plot of the movie tho.

[Neonivek]

It's illogical from any point of view.

Some aspects of it are, some aren't.

I mean I can understand Krypton itself being like... the golden city that no one REALLY wants to leave unless it is their duty or job and the more villainous Kryptonians really can't settle for anything less. There aren't too many Americans flying out to 'uncivilized' parts of the world to kill their population and take claim of them for their own gain (and I mean... living there). But why aren't there diplomats? Deep space scientists? anthropologists?

I mean they are described as scientists and they cured every disease and ailment ever afflicted on them... So it isn't like they need any medical scientists anymore.

People do go out and exploit the boonies however. That's how the countries both of us are living in got started. And clearly with Krypton tech + superpowers the boonies wouldn't stay boonies for very long. Presumably Kryptonians live a LONG time too, and the race should be frikkin ancient, so this just should have happened. The fact is they only exist as a thin premise for where Superman came from and why there aren't any more.

Yeah if they could. But I'll put it like this Reelya

Kyptons are so advanced that as long as they are on Kypton they have a magic box. If they want it they can reach inside and pull it out with absolutely no effort.

There is no materials, labor, devices, or anything they need from anyone else. They want for nothing. If they want power, they only want power for the satisfaction of lording it over others.

The Shuttle Superman came in... is the equivalent of a rocket ship someone built in their garage and it is still one of the most advanced spaceships in the known galaxy.

[Rolan7]

It may be a bit like the Nine Princes in Amber series.  Someone who can walk the shadows (multiverse, essentially) can find an ideal world to live and hide there almost indetectably.  Some Princes did so for many years, being revered as Gods or living in relative humility according to their preference.

But there was only one world that actually mattered to them...  Amber, the light which casts the shadows.  Even those who didn't plot for the crown, eventually got bored anywhere else.

Probably similar:  Time lords caring about Gallifrey, and the D'ni caring about their home (Myst).  They all could have escaped and lived as gods, but that was unthinkable (for most of them).

It's partially a narrative device to make a more interesting story, but it also makes some sense.  They treasure their sacred homelands.

[Reelya]

The problem with all of those is that it has to apply to everyone in those settings. e.g. English people who went to America should have all gone back to Mother England by that logic. It's really just a literary device used by these sorts of sci-fi/fantasy settings to keep things simple. But nobody would ever buy a story where Earthlings could leave Earth but literally everyone went back. So other civilizations created from that sort of template just never look very realistic.

[Neonivek]

The problem with all of those is that it has to apply to everyone in those settings. e.g. English people who went to America should have all gone back to Mother England by that logic.

There was the possibility to make a better life for themselves in America, as well as the promise of a LOT more land then they could ever get at home (EVERYONE was essentially a land owner in America)

England wasn't exactly a golden city where all their dreams could come true was it?

There was a clear effort to reward ratio. I am saying that there is no reward for leaving Krypton.

[Reelya]

But if we're talking the level of tech available to Gallifrey or Krypton, it's also unbelievable that you couldn't create the same quality of life virtually anywhere. Actually more so with Krypton since it's canon that they're a lot more robust away from that planet.

No reward ... except having the same level of tech + the superpowers with no downside. Which (nonsensically) not a single colonist made use of in the now-canon hundreds of thousands of years of Kyptonian advanced civilization. It would only take one family of colonists in all that time ... then you'd have second-generation people who would lose the superpowers if they went back to Krypton. So, yeah it just doesn't work. Because it takes ALL people to never have thought about settling elsewhere or wanting the superpowers.

[Neonivek]

But if we're talking the level of tech available to Gallifrey or Krypton, it's also unbelievable that you couldn't create the same quality of life virtually anywhere. Actually more so with Krypton since it's canon that they're a lot more robust away from that planet.

Technology supporting other technology built over many decades or even centuries (as they were reaching the apex of their technology).

But WHY would they want to? That is a lot of work for no real purpose. Your just separating from the home planet, and the support system built there, for no reason then "Because I can".

No reward ... except having the same level of tech + the superpowers with no downside. Which it makes no sense that not a single colonist made use of in the now-canon hundreds of thousands of years of Kyptonian advanced civilization. It would only take one family of colonists in all that time ... then you'd have second-generations people who would lose the superpowers if they went back to Krypton. So, yeah it just doesn't work. Because it takes ALL people to never have thought about settling elsewhere or wanting the superpowers.

They are Kryptonians... if they want super powers they can give themselves super powers. They already have super powers in the form of technology.

I am not exactly going to chose to go without internet for 40 years laboring away to build a log cabin... Just so I have laser vision.

Heck it was already long since proven that if the Kryptonians REALLY wanted to... they could have turned their red sun into a yellow sun.

Once again if they really want something, they can do it from home. (outside things you HAVE to leave home for... which is where MY Nitpick comes in... Seriously no diplomats?)

[Sergius]

Unless Kryptonians have a hive mind, it makes no sense for ALL Kryptonians to want/not want the exact same thing.

There are people who exactly choose to go without internet for 40 years to labor away to build a log cabin.

Neo, this seems to me more like being puzzled that other people want... to get stuff that you aren't interested in or wouldn't be interested in in a fictional setting?

[Neonivek]

Unless Kryptonians have a hive mind, it makes no sense for ALL Kryptonians to want/not want the exact same thing.

Well Hive Mind or not being human... >_> (but ignore this point the Kryptonians are basically human and to my knowledge there is no genetic aspect that makes them HAVE to be in Krypton like say Vulcans... nor an overwhelming technological requirement to return to Gallafry like the Timelords)

What I mean is that whatever they want... Kypton has it. Want super powers? You can give yourself super powers. Want Gold? You got gold. Want lots of land? BOOM!

The only thing a Krypton might want that the home planet doesn't have is, for example, power over the weak. Which has happened quite a few times before, but they usually deal with it by sending them to the Phantom zone.

Neo, this seems to me more like being puzzled that other people want... to get stuff that you aren't interested in or wouldn't be interested in in a fictional setting?

Well no the major argument I am arguing against is "Of course Kyptonians would have Colonies! Why wouldn't they? There is so much for them out there".

And my counter argument is "No, there is nothing for them. Everything they could ever want is back on Krypton"

[Sergius]

Very well, explain why they don't want additional superpowers on top of everything that they already have at a marginal extra cost (and potentially lowering the "cost" of everything else that they already have by having said superpowers)?

[Neonivek]

Very well, explain why they don't want superpowers on top of everything that they already have?

Because they don't care and even the Yellow Sun super powers is inferior to their technology.

It is a bit extreme for something you already have. It would be like driving 10 hours to McDonalds to get a BigMac... when you have a McDonalds in your kitchen

[Reelya]

No that can't be right. Since yellow sun superpowers would have allowed them to get out of the way of the exploding planet, and their technology didn't allow that.

[Neonivek]

No that can't be right. Since yellow sun superpowers would have allowed them to get out of the way of the exploding planet, and their technology didn't allow that.

Sure... Just fly right up into space with no oxygen, warp speed, or navigation... and survive a huge radioactive planet exploding with the one material that can outright kill you.

[Sergius]

Very well, explain why they don't want superpowers on top of everything that they already have?

Because they don't care and even the Yellow Sun super powers is inferior to their technology.

It is a bit extreme for something you already have. It would be like driving 10 hours to McDonalds to get a BigMac... when you have a McDonalds in your kitchen

That would work if Kryptonians never left their homes and had everything inside, never went out at all, never met with other Kryptonians. Never had to walk. So, basically, all Kryptonians are hermits and happy about it?

Who says they have to drive 10 hours? You just said they could turn their sun yellow, to have the benefit for the entire homeworld forever. Then, they never have to drive again, ever. They could use super-vision and super-speed and super-smarts to make their technology a million times better.

[Neonivek]

They could just wear clothes that block out Red sunlight and filters yellow sunlight into them Sergius...

Who says they have to drive 10 hours? You just said they could turn their sun yellow, to have the benefit for the entire homeworld forever. Then, they never have to drive again, ever.

Yeah, they just don't care. Mostly because there is no mystique to super powers like we have... mostly because they have access to it anyway.