Bay 12 Games Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

Author Topic: Testing foolproof(?) trade depot access method  (Read 1221 times)

ptb_ptb

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Testing foolproof(?) trade depot access method
« on: July 27, 2012, 06:51:01 am »

I had an idea (probably not a new one) for a truly foolproof trade depot access system. I thought I'd give it a try out and report the results here.  So here's the plan. I'll let you know how it works.

1. Create a normal trade depot on the surface next to your embark wagon. You will never use this depot.
2. Create trade depot at each corner of the embark zone. Make sure they have easy access from the side of the map and roof over  as soon as practical.
3. Forbid every depot except the one in the middle of the embark area.
4. Create underground access to each corner depot and install levers / bridges to block off access as needed as soon as practical.
5. Remember to create some trade goods for the first caravan!
6. As soon as a caravan turns up note where it is and un-forbid the nearest trade depot (while forbidding the one in the middle of the embark area).
7. Over time fine-tune trade depot location and access route based on where caravans actually arrive.

Start: 4 x 4 embark with some foothills, forest and river in a temperate climate zone. Not chosen - that was just where I turned up first. Planning on lots of trading and digging so 7 copper picks, two training axes, lots of food and drink, four cats, a few threads, 14 logs (so I can get building right away) and 13 bronze bars

Remembered to use 'fixdiplomats' and 'fixmerchants' from dfhack.

1. DONE
Built a 3-wide bridge across the river.
2. DONE
3. DONE
Dig out a 8 4x4 rooms for dwarves to live in.
Started tunnels to four corners.

Summer arrives!

Added more rooms and made beds in preparation for migrants.
Underground access to four corners now complete.
Wretched migrants arrive. Now have 15 mouths to feed.
3 out of 4 bridges+levers to secure depot access are complete.

Autumn arrives!

4. DONE

More migrants. I grudgingly greet them. At least they haven't brought any brats with them.
I set up a stockpile next to each of the four corner trade depots and start piling up craft items.

5. DONE(ish)

I decide to cut down trees while I can before the first lot of thieves and invaders arrive.
Suddenly discover we are all out of booze and the water has just frozen outside! The fools were leaving empty barrels in the wine cellar. Put everyone on collecting plants and start building stills. Breathe a sigh of relief when first barrel of wine is produced.

Caravan from Azuzton arrives in the SW corner. Build a wall to mark the spot.  Pull lever and un-forbid / forbid depots.

Strange behaviour noted - caravans continue all the way to the middle before setting back out for the corner depot. This doesn't bode well for my plans.
Realize bridge is too close to the trade depot. I can't close it without throwing a dwarven guard through the air and into the wall. Oops.

Winter Arrives!

Get some trading done, but find that two dwarves didn't make it through the alcohol shortage. Make mental note to always make a furniture stockpile for empty barrels to go.  Looks like a partial success this run. :-/

*************

Round 2. Made some changes to plan.

1. Create a normal trade depot on the surface next to your embark wagon. You will never use this depot.
2. Create trade depot at each corner of the embark zone. Make sure they have easy access from the side of the map and roof over  as soon as practical.
3. Forbid every depot except the one in the middle of the embark area.
4. Create underground access to each corner depot and install levers / bridges to block off access as needed as soon as practical.
5. Remember to create some trade goods for the first caravan!
6. As soon as a caravan turns up note where it is heading and forbid the other three trade depots. Hopefully the caravan will head to the nearest. Hopefully the caravans will also arrive at roughly the same time from roughly the same place so in future years you can prepare in advance which trade depot to use.
7. Over time fine-tune trade depot location and access route based on where caravans will actually arrive.

Start: 4 x 4 embark with foothills and forest. No river this time. 7 copper picks, two training axes, 20% more food and drink than last time, four cats, a few threads, 11 bronze bars (no points left for logs).

Remembered to use 'fixdiplomats' and 'fixmerchants' from dfhack.

Get four trade depots built, set up bridges but don't have time to connect the levers to all of them. So far I'm ahead of the game compared to last run.

Summer Arrives!

Dig out a bunch of rooms underground and build a handful of workshops. Make beds.
Build raising bridges to block off underground access to trade depots.
Migrants arrive. Don't have enough rooms / beds / furniture for them yet. And they brought a kiddie with them. Oh joy.
Belatedly dig out a large room for refuse and hide it behind two doors.
Finally have enough mechanisms to link up all inner doors to one lever.
Start digging out storerooms for trade goods.

Autumn Arrives!

More migrants arrive. Still have a good stock of food and alcohol around.
Make a bunch of training axes so they can make themselves useful.
Slaughter the two yaks that came with us. It's a pity, but they wouldn't be very happy underground anyway.
Finished digging out the trade goods storerooms. Not much to put in them yet.

Caravan from Mosus Zareth arrives in the North. Build a wall to mark the spot. The Wagons head East (for the NW depot) while the merchants without wagons head West! (>_<) Quickly forbid the NW, SW and SE depot.

Set all dwarves to 'trading' status (i.e. stop them from doing any other work). Pull NW, SW and SE levers. After the traders get in safely, pull the NE lever.
Realize there is still a route down from the embark wagon to the fortress and hurriedly set some dwarves to increasing the entrance area and putting a blocking bridge / lever in there, although it looks like this will not be finished in time for this season's trade.
Get some trading done - probably not enough to support 14 dwarves for a year. Hopefully we will have more goods to trade when the elf or human caravans turn up.

Pull the NE lever, so the traders can leave. Must remember to reset everything before the next lot of traders arrive.

It was pretty close, but we got the ingredients for brewing just as the last of the alcohol ran out.
Decide that bridges need to be at least two long so it's obvious whether they are up or down.

Spring Arrives!

Defences down when new season started. Hope nothing too drastic happens. ^ ^;  Everything is taking a long time - probably too much time wasted dragging stuff to stockpiles. Turned off all hauling jobs.

Elven caravan arrives from Ecanonemo! Arrives from the NNW, build a wall to mark the spot.
Reconfigured defences still aren't finished! I guess the motto is "Get it right the first time" or possibly "Don't be a perfectionist".
Get some trading done - really could have done with more bins, and better organized stockpile system. Then suddenly

Summer Arrives!

Elves leave without any fuss.
I suddenly think to check the list of civilizations in this world. Disaster! There are only two civilisations left. Dwarves and Elves. So no trading with humans. I guess I should have stuck with a medium sized world not small. This does mean that the caravans will probably always be coming from the North so I can dismantle the southern two trade depots.
I decide to keep the NE depot for the Dwarves and the NW depot for the Elves.
« Last Edit: July 27, 2012, 12:31:51 pm by ptb_ptb »
Logged
()==[:::::::::::::>

GhostDwemer

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Testing foolproof(?) trade depot access method
« Reply #1 on: July 27, 2012, 01:07:09 pm »

Eh, just run a tunnel to near the edge of the map, then use bridges to wall off access from the edge except for the three squares necessary to let in the wagons. You can create bridges right up against the edge of the map, and then raise them. If there is only one route to your trade depot, the traders will always show up where that route exits the map. You will get, at the very most, three enemies showing up inside your bridged-off entrance, as each enemy needs one square. But I've never seen even one thief get in this way.

I've never bothered with complex multi-depot set-ups or airlocks, bridging the edge let's you construct a perfectly safe depot in less than a month.
Logged

ptb_ptb

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Testing foolproof(?) trade depot access method
« Reply #2 on: July 27, 2012, 01:10:03 pm »

You can create bridges right up against the edge of the map, and then raise them. If there is only one route to your trade depot, the traders will always show up where that route exits the map.
I've seen it written that there's a bug / feature where a caravan will skip your depot as 'unreachable' by wagons if the non-wagon merchants arrive on a different edge.
Logged
()==[:::::::::::::>

Quietust

  • Bay Watcher
  • Does not suffer fools gladly
    • View Profile
    • QMT Productions
Re: Testing foolproof(?) trade depot access method
« Reply #3 on: July 27, 2012, 01:16:37 pm »

You can create bridges right up against the edge of the map, and then raise them. If there is only one route to your trade depot, the traders will always show up where that route exits the map.
I've seen it written that there's a bug / feature where a caravan will skip your depot as 'unreachable' by wagons if the non-wagon merchants arrive on a different edge.
You're thinking of something different - if your embark region is separated by some sort of map feature (such as a River), then caravans from certain civilizations will only arrive on one specific side of the map.
Logged
P.S. If you don't get this note, let me know and I'll write you another.
It's amazing how dwarves can make a stack of bones completely waterproof and magmaproof.
It's amazing how they can make an entire floodgate out of the bones of 2 cats.