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Trinimac

Malacath

Gork

Mork

Morgoth

Saruman

Bhall

Father Sky

[smakemupagus]

Well guys im back uncucessful, damn elfs killed me!
im just experementing with some different setups atm but i have a question, is it better to rush raiding then to make your own weapons?

I don't think so, not for early defense.   On average raids *use up* weapons.  Of course it works out in the long run because you send them out with a kit of five crummy copper daggers and hope they bring back a Runic warhammer or a bayoneted rifle.

*  If you're going for heavy archer defense, absolutely a good idea to rush for Elf raids, the steel bodkins are great and the rare Enchanted arrows are deadly.  Whenever you score a greatbow give it to your elite archers.  But it'd take you a long time to get enough greatbows for the whole squad, so get your fletcher workshop going too.  Looted elven wood lets you keep making more longboats non stop too.

*  Raids on Dwarves and Drow yield also some nice bars of metals, so those are great to grab supplies to feed your regular weapons industry. 

*  Looted weapon quality scales with your [SKILL:SIEGECRAFT] (I think), so you'd probably get better quality weapons from an Artisan orc working your forge or factory.  Unless you happen to somehow have a master siege operator migrant ...

*  Rushing Raids on Ruins to get the Ancient foundry blueprints is really powerful (a little bit OP at the moment to be honest) but that is a long term play, you need a mature metal industry to supply the raw materials for the Foundry. 

[Meph]

Why not make a nice, rare caste of orks that are good at doing raids ?

They should look like this:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

[smakemupagus]

Yeah that's a fun idea, fast learn rate for appraiser and siegecraft makes him a master freelancer and raider. 

don't suppose you have a 16x16 pixel version of that Ork pirate?

[Wrex]

Honestly, I found unit skill is more important that weapon quality. Orcish weapons can hardly compete with dwarven armour, so oftentimes the skill of the warrior to deliver the skull crushing shot through the helmet is more important. Or the ability to lop off unarmoured limbs, either way.

[Meph]

You know, downsizing the pic to 16 pixels might decrease quality a bit. (besides, you cant use custom sprites on castes) ^^

[smakemupagus]

After the last update focus on non-combat stuff like shaman and looters, it's time to give some attention to later game gear upgrades for our Uruks. 

Here is a preview of Orcish Warrior Society arms.  These are Weapon items that represent dualwield or weapon/sidearm pairings.  They have some nice extra attacks, but especially add some flexibility.  For example you can give your elite boworcs a katana for close combat defense; or give your warchief bladed claws which add some piercing strikes to his macuahuitl sword hack & slash techniques. 

Some Society arms require foreign knowledge and exotic weapons to unlock (like the human-inspired rifle Lifeguards and the elf-inspired greatbow Assassins).  Others are always available such as Jaguar Warrior or Seawolf Buccaneer. Feedback welcome as always, nothing set in stone yet. 

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

##########
## Society Arms Kits
##########

[ITEM_WEAPON:ITEM_WEAPON_JAGUAR_ARMS]
# represents a macuahuitl and war-claws dual wielded
[NAME:jaguar warrior arms:jaguar warriors arms]
[SIZE:700]
[SKILL:SWORD]
[TWO_HANDED:57500]
[MINIMUM_SIZE:52500]
[MATERIAL_SIZE:9]
[ATTACK:EDGE:60000:6000:slash:slashes:macuahuitl blade:2500] like a MWDF longsword slash
[ATTACK:EDGE:80000:2000:rake:rakes:macuahuitl blade:1800]
[ATTACK:BLUNT:50:1000:strike:strikes:macuahuitl pommel:1000]
[ATTACK:EDGE:80000:3000:feint a jab then viciously rake:feint a jab then viciously rakes:macuahuitl blade:3000]
[ATTACK:EDGE:5:1000:stab:stabs:claws:100]
[ATTACK:EDGE:500:800:slash:slashes:claws:1100]
[ATTACK:EDGE:10:10000:follow up a parried slash with a vicious uppercut:follows up a parried slash with a vicious uppercut:claws:1800]
[ATTACK:EDGE:6000:6000:unleash a furious assault:unleashes a furious assault:blade and claws:6000]

[ITEM_WEAPON:ITEM_WEAPON_SEAWOLF_ARMS]
# represents a scimitar and pistol dual wielded
[NAME:seawolf buccaneer arms:seawolf buccaneers arms]
[SIZE:600]
[SKILL:SWORD]
   [RANGED:BLOWGUN:BULLET_S]
   [SHOOT_FORCE:25000]
   [SHOOT_MAXVEL:20000]
[TWO_HANDED:57500]
[MINIMUM_SIZE:32500]
[MATERIAL_SIZE:9]
[ATTACK:EDGE:50:2000:stab:stabs:scimitar:1000]
[ATTACK:BLUNT:200:2000:whip:whips:pistol butt:1250]
[ATTACK:EDGE:30000:4000:slash:slashes:scimitar:2500]
[ATTACK:EDGE:30000:4000:sidestep and slash:sidesteps and slashes:scimitar blade:2500]
[ATTACK:EDGE:20000:22000:whirl around with outstretched arms and slash:whirls around with outstretched arms and slashes:scimitar blade:3000]
[ATTACK:EDGE:10:10000:blast with a point blank volley then runs through:blast with a point blank volley then runs through:pistol and blade:6000]

[ITEM_WEAPON:ITEM_WEAPON_DRAGON_ARMS]
# represents a composite bow and katana dual wielded
[NAME:dragon samurai arms:dragon samurai arms]
[SIZE:700]
[SKILL:SWORD]
[MATERIAL_SIZE:9]
   [RANGED:BOW:ARROW]
   [SHOOT_FORCE:4000]
   [SHOOT_MAXVEL:4000]
[TWO_HANDED:200000]
[MINIMUM_SIZE:52500]
[ATTACK:EDGE:20000:6000:cut with a lightning fast strike:cuts with a lightning fast strike:katana blade:2500]
[ATTACK:EDGE:20000:6000:slash:slashes:katana blade:1250]
[ATTACK:EDGE:20000:6000:feint and slash:feints and slashes:katana blade:1250]
[ATTACK:EDGE:30000:9000:attack with an exquisite form:attacks with an exquisite form:katana blade:4250]
[ATTACK:EDGE:100:9000:riposte with a piercing blow:ripostes with a piercing blow:katana blade:2500]
[ATTACK:EDGE:1000:4000:fires at close range and follows with a quick cut:fires at close range and follows with a quick cut:bow and blade:1250]
[ATTACK:BLUNT:2000:6000:slap:slaps:katana flat:1250]

[ITEM_WEAPON:ITEM_WEAPON_FALCON_ARMS]
# represents a bola and jagged spear dual wielded
[NAME:falcon knight arms:falcon knights arms]
[SIZE:600]
[SKILL:SPEAR]
[MATERIAL_SIZE:6]
   [RANGED:THROW:WHIP]
   [SHOOT_FORCE:2400]
   [SHOOT_MAXVEL:1350]
[TWO_HANDED:57500]
[MINIMUM_SIZE:32500]
[ATTACK:EDGE:20000:4000:slash:slashes:bladed spear edge:2250]
[ATTACK:EDGE:30000:2000:rake:rakes:toothed spear edge:1250]
[ATTACK:EDGE:20:5000:stab:stabs:spear point:1000]
[ATTACK:EDGE:20:10000:impale:impales:spear point:2000]
[ATTACK:EDGE:10:10000:entangle and lance:entangles and lances:bola and spear:4000]
[ATTACK:BLUNT:10000:6000:strike:strikes:spear shaft:1000]

[ITEM_WEAPON:ITEM_WEAPON_BLADEMASTER_ARMS]
# represents a pair of katana dual wielded (orcs learn this technique from Drow)
[NAME:blademaster arms:blademasters arms]
[SIZE:1800]
[SKILL:SWORD]
[TWO_HANDED:200000]
[MINIMUM_SIZE:50000]
[MATERIAL_SIZE:9]
[ATTACK:EDGE:60000:10000:hack:hacks:daikatana:1700]
[ATTACK:EDGE:20000:6000:feint and slash:feints and slashes:offhand blade:1250]
[ATTACK:EDGE:60000:10000:slash:slashes:daikatana:1700]
[ATTACK:EDGE:60000:12000:hew:hews:daikatana:4250]
[ATTACK:EDGE:100:9000:riposte with a piercing blow:ripostes with a piercing blow:offhand blade:2500]
[ATTACK:EDGE:90000:12000:attack with an exquisite form:attacks with an exquisite form:paired blades:4250]
[ATTACK:EDGE:90000:18000:unleash a rapid onslaught of strikes:unleashes a rapid onslaught of strikes:paired blades:6000]

[ITEM_WEAPON:ITEM_WEAPON_LIFEGUARD_ARMS]
# represents a polehammer and rifle dual wielded (orcs learn this technique from Human)
[NAME:lifeguard elite arms:lifeguards elite arms]
[SIZE:1200]
[SKILL:SPEAR]
[TWO_HANDED:200000]
[MINIMUM_SIZE:50000]
   [RANGED:BLOWGUN:BULLET_L]
   [SHOOT_FORCE:50000]
   [SHOOT_MAXVEL:50000]
[MATERIAL_SIZE:9]
[ATTACK:BLUNT:10:200:puncture:punctures:polehammer hook:5000]
[ATTACK:BLUNT:100:5000:hammer:hammers:polehammer:5000]
[ATTACK:BLUNT:10:3000:drill:drills:polehammer tip:1200]
[ATTACK:BLUNT:200:2000:strike:strikes:rifle butt:2250]
[ATTACK:BLUNT:100:10000:release a perfectly timed blow:releases a perfectly timed blow:polehammer:6000]
[ATTACK:BLUNT:10:10000:fire the chambered round point blank:fires the chambered round point blank:rifle:9000]

[ITEM_WEAPON:ITEM_WEAPON_CAVEBEAR_ARMS]
[NAME:cavebear berserker arms:cavebear berserkers arms]
# represents a battleaxe and mattock dual wielded (orcs learn this technique from Dwarf)
[SIZE:1800]
[SKILL:AXE]
[TWO_HANDED:200000]
[MINIMUM_SIZE:42500]
[MATERIAL_SIZE:9]
[ATTACK:EDGE:40000:6000:hack:hacks:axeblade:1250]
[ATTACK:EDGE:40000:12000:relentlessly hew:relentlessly hews:axeblade:2000]
[ATTACK:EDGE:40000:6000:emphatically slice:emphatically slices:honed axeblade:1800]
[ATTACK:EDGE:50000:10000:make an undercut swing at:makes an undercut swing at:axeblade:2000]
[ATTACK:EDGE:1000:5000:strike:strikes:mattock point:1500]
[ATTACK:EDGE:15000:18000:whirl around and cleave:whirls around and cleaves:axeblade:2500]
[ATTACK:EDGE:1000:18000:follow a feint with piercing overhand blow:follows a feint with piercing overhand blow:mattock:4250]
[ATTACK:EDGE:25000:6000:assail furiously:assails furiously:mattock and axe:6000]

[ITEM_WEAPON:ITEM_WEAPON_ASSASSIN_ARMS]
[NAME:assassin society arms:assassin society arms]
# represents a greatbow and dagger dual wielded (orcs learn this technique from Elf)
[SIZE:1200]
[SKILL:DAGGER]
   [RANGED:BOW:ARROW]
   [SHOOT_FORCE:6000]
   [SHOOT_MAXVEL:6000]
[TWO_HANDED:87500]
[MINIMUM_SIZE:25000]
[MATERIAL_SIZE:6]
[ATTACK:EDGE:1000:800:slash:slashes:dagger:1250]
[ATTACK:EDGE:5:1000:stab:stabs:dagger:1000]
[ATTACK:BLUNT:20:600:strike:strikes:dagger pommel:1000]
[ATTACK:EDGE:1000:800:sidestep and slash:sidesteps and slashes:dagger:2500]
[ATTACK:EDGE:50:6000:catch opponent off balance and run through:catches opponent off balance and runs through:dagger tip:4100]
[ATTACK:EDGE:1000:4000:fires at close range and follows with a quick cut:fires at close range and follows with a quick cut:bow and blade:4100]

I know the attack "verb" phrases probably need some work, on this pass I was just getting a rough outline for the ATTACK tag numbers and may not have paid the right attention to the grammar

>> P.s. @Meph, Yeah that guy might have to represent all our appraisers, not just the Looter caste.  He's clearly in the middle of bartering with the fanatic Elf diplomat for a bag of fisherberry seeds in that photo ...

[fire1666]

Why not make a nice, rare caste of orks that are good at doing raids ?

They should look like this:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

said ork pirate is achualy called captain bluddflagg of the free booters, he stars in dawn of war 2 retribution *fantastic game* and hes foking hillarious to play along side. example.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o8zsdCuqTko skip to 3:08 and watch till 3:48 and laugh

[fire1666]

BUMP
Sorry for the double post but i haz idea for the ork raiding partys but i dont know if its possible.
mabe you can possibly capture say an elf farming expert who can work on your farms?
like a captive system or you can convert them between pets and civilians to trade them or use them for target pratice

[smakemupagus]

Thanks, unfortunately yeah I think taking captives like that is not possible, summoning pet creatures are just barely possible although unreliable and has some odd side effects.  but I don't think there's any way to make them laborers.  In the next version you can think of the looted 'blueprint' that unlocks the Treesinger's Pagoda (or whatever the looted Elven building turns out to be) as a caged elf if you like

Yeah I sorta remember Bluddflagg, he's the guy who agrees to save the galaxy but only if that Inquisitor lady gives him her swank hat.

[OREOSOME]

WH40k: Its all about the hats.

[Ishar]

Thanks, unfortunately yeah I think taking captives like that is not possible, summoning pet creatures are just barely possible although unreliable and has some odd side effects.  but I don't think there's any way to make them laborers.

MDF has concubines, those are technically pets, and they give birth to dwarfs and can do labor. They have ridiculous profession tags like "stray mason" and things like that.
Yes, summoning creatures is unstable, but if it's a random reaction anyway (you are not GUARANTEED to get captives during a raid after all), I don1t think it's that much of a problem. Masterwork DF's summoning problem comes from the fact that the spawn location takes the valuable resources (like turret cases with clockwork parts) with 100% certainty, and produces results... sometimes. That's not an economically sound investment in that case, but it may work here.

[smakemupagus]

I also don't really care for the way that it makes your dwarf explode, lose his clothes, etc.  It's one thing for a magmamancer-in-training to drop trousers once or twice for the oil ceremony, but the Raider works here full time, he'd be berzerk within a season.

I also don't really understand how concubines work.  You buy them and then their children are a caste in your creature, right?  I don't really want "concubine elf" and "slave elf" to be castes of the orcish creature, and then interbreed with orcs, etc. -- edit, also, lack caste level graphics is a bit of an issue.

[Ishar]

you make them sterile if that floats your boat, but it's your call. Blowing up the workshop is a problem, true.

[Wrex]

It's the person doing the reaction going insane from lack of clothing. And it's also the issue of, you know, Most of those reactions always taking resources but not always returning with them.

[Stronghammer]

Could you possibly add raiding goblins and kobolds. The goblins and kobolds would be low quality items and materials though with a high chance of success cause you know.... they suck in comparison to orcs anyways.