Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Hapah]

Oh yeah, one of you is definitely talking out of your ass. I'm fine with that, though. What this means is that MrD now cannot be the Ext, yes?

If Toaster is telling the truth, then Tir must be lying about his N1 action and is almost certainly the Ext.

If Toaster is lying, then he's the Ext himself.

[Tiruin]

The user of a Mind Shield knows if a psychic action was attempted on them. Not what action, only that an action was attempted.

Meph: Is there a difference, in general, between a natural mind shield and a tech mind shield?

When it is stated that the user knows that a psychic action is attempted, is it given in PM directly, or through flavor in Night Action result PM?

[Mephansteras]

The user of a Mind Shield knows if a psychic action was attempted on them. Not what action, only that an action was attempted.

Meph: Is there a difference, in general, between a natural mind shield and a tech mind shield?

When it is stated that the user knows that a psychic action is attempted, is it given in PM directly, or through flavor in Night Action result PM?

There is no functional difference between a natural mind shield and one taken through tech.

If someone with a mind shield is targeted by a psychic effect they will receive notification in their night result PM of that fact.

[Toaster]

Well, that settles it.  Tiruin is lying scum.

[Hapah]

I still think it's you, Toaster. If it's between you and Tir, you're the better lynch anyway.

[Tiruin]

Lying scum? No, you're the one lying Toaster.

You're the only one to have claimed Mind Shield before I said anything of the sort - you received information on the matter and chose to hide it, taking the 'neutral' Spore Spreader to implicate yourself in our graces.

Why?

Re-read my PM'd questions.

The difference between a Mind Shield and an Advanced Mind Shield is that the latter always gives a working result, while the former blocks the effect but informs the psychic character that it was blocked.

I know it was blocked, doubly confirmed that one.

Did we just run into a mess up on what would happen?

Hapah states that the user of a Mind Shield knows if a psychic action was attempted on them. Not the specifics, but that a psychic action in general occurred.

Toaster states the complete opposite. But agrees that he would know, and that nothing happened.

Now I know that Meph cannot lie, but how in the world did these two events split at what happened?

Let me state the truth without any nebulous ideas on why (lying about PM, for one, which cannot be confirmed):

You insert the dopp-kill-no-kill idea on Dariush, yet considering the state of things, you paint him out as an obvdop when rational thinking clearly makes his movements a total waste.

Let's say that no kill was performed, how would that benefit the dopp team? You inserted that idea without thinking it through. Now let's say Dariush is scum, he spends the NK on himself, hitting his buddy body thereby wasting a whole damn life that could be wasted against the ext or a lynch.

Then more speculation on trying to draw a case on Dariush with feeble reasoning.

I'm just guessing... and it really doesn't matter where your team's kill went; doesn't change your alignment.

[quote from Dariush]
Dopp team no-killing has happened before, so it'd be silly to rule it out.

Now, I may be blind, or stupid, or a combination of both, but tell me the benefits of a dopp team not killing at this situation and how it would balance the field in their favor?

Then

I have no issue with finding the exty, but I'm sure you're the dopp and unsure on who the exty is, so why not use my vote on the known scum till I have a better target for it?

I'm wondering how you're putting the dopp label on Dariush, and giving no worry on finding the exty at all.

Then you link the idea of being NK'd//Blocked (relative to this game) to another game which has different style and patterns. Alright, assuming Dariush is a dopp again. Only the exty can kill him (no town killing roles), and...also waste a stun orb on him?

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Stun Orb: Allows the Alien to stun another player, preventing them from taking any actions that night or using any active abilities the following day (Role-block another player). 1 Use. Does not trigger War Vet/Turret response.  Can be taken as a two-use item for a Medium tech slot.

I've missed this:

Tiruin:  Are your inquiries into the night kills/lack thereof going anywhere?  Usually that's a waste of time.

And perhaps you now know why I was delving into the matter.

Lastly, something I missed.

Third, why do you think it's important to last-vote me?  Thinking about that deadman bomb you considered replicating?  For someone who's claimed lack of knowledge on a lot of alien tech, you suddenly remembered all about that one.

I don't get how that applies to my condition, as the deadman bomb is an offensive-death item. Scumslip? I bet so, because if I was the ext with a deadman bomb, I cannot activate it while alive, considering you a Spore Spreader, you won't affect me as I last-voted you, yes?

And that would put it at a 1/2/2 as I posted somewhere up there.

[Tiruin]

Next, you were voting Mr.D for the whole entirety of today and yesterday. Guess how that shifted away?

Your defense (see last link) on his case was based solely on flavor. Meta flavor, to be exact.

IIRC, people who have died the night they were blocked in the past have been found doing what they normally would have been doing- blocking, guarding, whatever.  Do I need to go dig up examples?

Now I'm unsure if this is a concrete variable, but I do know that the psychic will not be doing anything else but their action, based from trying to breach your mental defenses, leaves psychics tired after their attempt. ((I mean, I had to sleep on the darned couch on N1 because of that!))

Toaster: I'd like to know what Meph's response is, not verbatim obviously, before he replies, if that could be gleaned.

Not sure what you mean here- are you wanting me not to comment on this until Meph says something or say what he told me before Meph rules in-thread?

And what I meant was what answer you got from Meph, in your own words and understanding obviously as it deviates from Hapah's PM.

Unless you both asked the same question worded differently...

[Tiruin]

Toaster, could you give examples on the difference between psychics who've died when roleblocked as compared to psychic actions who've lived? And psychics who've lived and died without a roleblock?

IIRC, people who have died the night they were blocked in the past have been found doing what they normally would have been doing- blocking, guarding, whatever.  Do I need to go dig up examples?

[Mr. Dwarfinton]

I am away from the Internet for two days and all of this happens. I'll make a post later when I have caught up.

P.S. Tiruin do you still want that thing about BMC? It seems to have literally no point to it and Im really lazy.

[Hapah]

Have a good weekend, folks! I'll be back in ~48 hours. If you have any questions about anything, just leave 'em here and I'll try to answer when I get back.

[Tiruin]

P.S. Tiruin do you still want that thing about BMC? It seems to have literally no point to it and Im really lazy.

Yes. I still do want that thing about BMC (and suggest you try going in the next BM to know what to do in a forum Mafia), laziness isn't a good trait for any player of Mafia. (Refer to Toaster's #1 scumtell on the reasons why).

Like for now, I cannot get why there seems to have no literal point to it, but from your viewpoint it doesn't, hence my asking on why.

[Toaster]

Tiruin:  I was under the mistaken impression that mind shields didn't get notified, which is why I didn't immediately catch your lie.  They used not to know:

http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=45614.msg931560#msg931560  (And the following post)

Cliff notes:  ExKirby is an ExtOp with a mind shield whose mind shield foils a block from ToonyMan on N2.  His PM mentions nothing about it.

Toony's PM:

ToonyMan   
  You stare into the lantern in your tent, a small brass chain wound around your hands. You cast your psychic energy off into the night, focusing on ExKirby. You feel the chains of power surround him, but each time you try to tighten them they just slip off! Again and again you cast the chains, but to no avail. Eventually, tired and defeated, you give up and go join the others for the night's feast.

ExKirby got no PM at all.

Next, you were voting Mr.D for the whole entirety of today and yesterday. Guess how that shifted away?

-snip-

And what I meant was what answer you got from Meph, in your own words and understanding obviously as it deviates from Hapah's PM.

Unless you both asked the same question worded differently...

You're right that I thought Mr. D was scum.  So?  Looks like I was wrong, since things make far more sense in a "Dariush is scum" context.  I have a bad habit of misreading new tells as scum tells.


Anyway, I asked Meph this, verbatim:  "Does the holder of a mind shield or tech field know when they disrupted an effect on them?"  He said yes, so I then asked to confirm my lack of N1 PM, which he also verified.

Toaster, could you give examples on the difference between psychics who've died when roleblocked as compared to psychic actions who've lived? And psychics who've lived and died without a roleblock?

Sigh... now I have to dig this up too?

Spoiler: Spoilering this since it's a waste of time (click to show/hide)

From Para16, here's Jim the Detective dying after being blocked:

Jim Groovester Human Detective    Inspect Solifuge Blocked, Killed

  After scarfing down a sandwich you start gathering your things. You'll need to be careful if you're to discover what Solifuge is up to without him catching you at it.

  But as you start going through your drawer you feel a strange sensation. A tightening around you, as if invisible chains had wrapped themselves around you. You stand up and struggle against the chains, trying in vain to break the paralysis settling into your muscles. But it is no use. Your struggles grow weaker, and you thoughts begin to slow.

  Then, as you are slumping against your desk, you see the door open. You can only look on with bemusement as Jokerman steps through and rises an Uzi in your direction. The bullets barely even hurt, and your mind has slipped into darkness before you even hit the floor.

And the day start flavor:

  Jim's house is next. There you find the door unlocked, and Jim's bullet-ridden body lying in a pool of blood on the ground. He must have been surprised, since there is no sign of a struggle. Looking through his desk you find that he was working as a Detective for the militia. No information from any discoveries he may have made last night, however.

It's a point of reference of some point, I guess.


Same game, Web the warden blocking and living:

  You sit at your table once again, the iron chain in your hands and candle burning before you. Your breathing slows and your mind casts off the shell of your body and reaches out into the void. You latch onto the spark that is Jokerman-EXE's soul and cast the chains of submission around him. He struggles, of course, but it is no use. After many long moments his soul is still and silent. He will go nowhere tonight.

  You awaken and head off to the kitchen to get some food. All this work really drains you!

Para15, Org the warden blocking then dying (he's not blocked)

  The flickering light of the candle glints off of the crystal. You stare at it for a while before finally finding your center and allowing yourself to go into the trance. You send out your spirit, this time seeking Pandarsenic. Unlike last night, your chains have no trouble binding him. You smile as you feel the chains wrap around him, bind him, and draw off his energy. You then release the power and slip back into yourself.

  You stretch your arms up and arch your back, trying to work out a few kinks. You wanted to get practice on this vacation, but constant nights of using your abilities is starting to exhaust you. Before you can finish that thought, however, a pair of hands grabs your head. You hear a sharp crack, and everything goes dark.

And day reveal:

  Only three of you left today. Org, it seems, was not lucky enough to survive through the night.

  You go to his house, dreading what you might find. There you find a table with the stub of a melted candle, a crystal, and a small chain lying on it. Next to Org's head, which has its eye's propped open staring at the crystal. It's...really pretty creepy. Seriously, this doppelganger is messed up.

Okay, that's similar to this game's flavor and he WASN'T blocked in this case.  Hm.  Guess it's not much of a tell.

TLDR Never mind on the flavor cue.  I'll have to rethink- this took too damn long already.

[Tiruin]

Thanks for that then Toaster, but I am truly sure that UI investigated you, and hit your mind shield.

Hapah, what did you even ask Meph? Surely, questions on the same tangent of thought cannot deviate if they're asked in the same fashion. "Hey Meph, suppose I've a Mind Shield and a Telepath hits me, do I know about it?" Or something like that?

[Hapah]

Looks like I didn't miss much?

[Toaster]

Hapah:  Except the question to you in the post prior.  Since I have your attention...

I still think it's you, Toaster. If it's between you and Tir, you're the better lynch anyway.

How am I the "better lynch?"