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[Hapah]

Extend.

Dar: Alright then. You still didn't answer the question, though: Why did you misinterpret NF's first post D2 and vote him for (as best as I can tell) no reason?

I actually think the cult + noscum theory seems plausible. Not what I would have guessed coming in, to be sure, but there were a lot of cult references in the OP.

I'm guessing no-one got NK's and protected, or they would have claimed it by now. Is there ever a reason that someone wouldn't claim being protected?

More after dinner!

[Hapah]

ZU: So you didn't have any reservations about killing UI? I'm not saying your NK was a bad thing; but I'm not sure I'd kill N1 if I had the power. Were you that certain?

Dar: Can you confirm that you were blocked?

Book: True enough on the potential scum NK block. But like you said, SK+Lyncher+Cult+Scum, all in a 10-player game? Being creative with roles is one thing, but that would be downright cruel.

I'd guess there's actually no scum or no cult, with the former (imo) being more likely than the latter (There were a ton of cult references in the intro). So I guess it'd either be

-ZU vigi'd UI, and there are no scum
-ZU vigi'd UI, and the scum chose not to kill and/or got blocked
-ZU claimed a vigi when it was actually scum NK. This doesn't seem likely to me: What is there to gain?

[blackmagechill]

So, then, since ZU came out with being a vig, he's probably going to be a cult target, or, is a member of the cult himself and wants to avoid lynch targeting, which seems a bit unlikely. So, that being said, what did you guys get for night actions that happened to you? We might as well shell them out now, because the town doesn't get anything from secrets. I don't think we necessarily need to reveal items, but at least any night actions you receive.
I, personally, didn't get anything.

[zombie urist]

ZU: So you didn't have any reservations about killing UI? I'm not saying your NK was a bad thing; but I'm not sure I'd kill N1 if I had the power. Were you that certain?

No not really. Clearly I am a more hardened individual than you are. I was reasonably sure.

Interesting. What was your thought process in picking targets?

UI was the scummy because he was being passive and useless. To be honest if I could do it again I would have chosen Scelly, but he had only made 2 posts and I glossed over him.

Zombie: how did you vigkill Imiknorris? Please explain in detail.

During the day, I chose to take from the public pool instead of questing and received a ?oDeath. I used it to kill UI.

Scelly did not action anyone during N1.

This is ... worrisome. I can't think of a good reason why anyone would no action in this game.

[Tiruin]

Scelly did not action anyone during N1.

This is ... worrisome. I can't think of a good reason why anyone would no action in this game.

Before I post my thoughts on the game, I'll just say that I cannot answer on why Scelly didn't act as I do not know what his motives were.

Also, what reasons were you thinking, and why the word 'worrisome' instead of another?

[Dariush]

I used a ?o Door Creation last night, got randomised, and it landed on Dariush. His being blocked could also explain the assumed lack of a kill.

I indeed got blocked, but I was trying to use a Scroll of Tracking on BMC. I can confirm this by tracking the person of town's choice tonight.

Dar: Alright then. You still didn't answer the question, though: Why did you misinterpret NF's first post D2 and vote him for (as best as I can tell) no reason?

I didn't like his post and I wanted to apply pressure to him to see how he would react. He stuck to his story, so I changed targets.

The opening flavor strongly suggests a cult. However, Mr. D was 'working for the Guise of the Keeper' and was a SK, so its possible that there are 2 SKs.

That's... a really far-fetched idea. So far-fetched that I see no way it could have into your head without outside influence. Two SKs is just plain crazy, since if Mr.D didn't get lynched we would have two NKs per night without scumkill. With your vigkill (and without anti-town death), that would result in six players on D2 and an instalose for town. Here's my theory: you're SK, there's no scum, there may or may not be cult, though probably there wouldn't be to keep the game even remotely balanced. My vote stays.

[Tiruin]

Anyone with questions given to Scelly that can be answered by me, fire it off. (I may have missed some, I guess?). There are some that are addressed to Scelly, but they relate to his play-attitude - something I cannot answer.
So clarification:
Scelly did not act in any way in N1. Nothing acted on him on N1, so I'm relatively unharmed or untouched.

Hapah.

A few questions. This post.

#Spoiler 1:

IO: Please comment on the hammer you dropped on MrD, it felt out of character. I don't think you are scum, though. Maybe third party? I don't want to speculate more until you've said your piece.

What is meant by 'hammer' here?

Also, what is with the flow of thought when you related your suspicion on Irony's alignment here, and this:

IO: I think that my read was screwed because I didn't even consider third parties (I've been RIGHT ON THE MONEY determining alignments lately. ~__~) I figured if he had a scumbuddy, they would encourage him to at least fight back, if not try to give him talking points for his arguments (it's in the scumbuddies interest to have their partner live, even if he is new). The fact that he just threw his hands up and said "Fuck it!" told me that he didn't have that voice nudging him forward, and so I read it as town. Wrong now, obviously, but that's how I got there.

And yeah, in hindsight, that post is odd. You blowing MrD away just seemed really out of character for you.

You don't think IO is scum...why? He explained his part now, and you didn't hold up. Is there a basis of a difference in scumminess to non-scumminess?
And by really out of character, what do you mean by that, and is it connected to your suspicion on him?

The bolded statement, how does this relate to your scumhunting?

On Mr.D [3rd paragraph]:
What is your take on the difference of newscum and newtown? With scum pertaining to all anti-town roles?

#Spoiler 2:

As for who I think is scum? That's a hard question, I'm not really getting any scum reads so much as town reads. I don't think it's MrD, I don't think it's BMC, and I think IO isn't scum (least certain about that last one). I don't think Book AND NF are a scumteam, but I think either one could be scum individually. Need hard information to form hard opinions!

Followed by
#Spoiler 3:

If I had to vote right now (which I apparently do), I guess I'd go with Book. He's saying that MrD is making so many slipups that the case has merit, but in the same post

Splits hairs on MrD's alignment in the last RL (MrD was brother-to-a-townie, now said he was town last game, and Book call this "utterly awful").
Has to explain, to MrD, why what he did was wrong when he apologized for OMGUS'ing someone.
Encourages MrD to sign up for the BM that's in signups
Points out the resources in the thread title.

I mean, he gives out just about all the resources at hand, explains why what he did was wrong, but then goes on to say that "it's more than he can chalk up to newtells". I'm not trying to discourage you from giving advice, Book (it's good advice!), but your words and your actions don't quite match up to me.

You know that Book is a helpful guy, no matter what his alignment is, right? You vote Bookthras because he is pointing out Mr.D's slipups and his words on that case do not match up?

Are you using meta to scumhunt?


ZU

Interesting. What was your thought process in picking targets?

UI was the scummy because he was being passive and useless. To be honest if I could do it again I would have chosen Scelly, but he had only made 2 posts and I glossed over him.

Could you explain how he was being passive? Why would being useless (please quote or explain how he was being such), merit that vigkill of yours?

Who is the most scummy in your eyes right now, and why didn't you target those in your list below?

Spoiler: I mean, it differs, aye? (click to show/hide)

ZU: Why the pause?

What pause?

Zombie: please give me your thoughts on Dariush and Hapah, and whether you found Native's first post of the day kosher or not.

Both of them are acting pretty scummy. Native's first post is also pretty scummy, but I don't think its enough yet to be worthy of a lynch.

Let's see: you're voting Scelly, thus probably considering him scummy and you consider me, Hapah and NF scummy also. Without so much as stating why. Or proceeding to do anything about it. Yeah, you're scum, ZU.

Scelly is scummy because he pretty much did nothing D1 and seems to be actively ignoring this game.
Dariush is scummy because he stayed on the easy lynches D1. I also don't like how he switched votes in that post I pointed out earlier.
Hapah is scummy because of his strange numbers D1 and his last minute WoT and vote. Also because he hasn't done much scumhunting today.
NF is the least scummy of these only because of the 'nice' comment.

More after lunch...

PPE: ... Unvote Extend

Also,

This has been bothering me a lot so far.

What is this

[Toaster]

Vote Count:

Bookthras:
Hapah: Tiruin
NativeForeigner: IronyOwl
Dariush: Hapah, Bookthras
blackmagechill:
Tiruin:
zombie urist: Dariush
IronyOwl:

Not voting: NativeForeigner, blackmagechill, zombie urist


Day has been extended.   Day 2 will last until Thursday, 8/2 at 11 PM EST.

[Hapah]

Tir: I'm going to try to avoid a giant quote-pyramid thing, so I'll just address each question in your post in a new line.

Hammer: I didn't mean hammer as in hammer-vote, I meant hammer as in bash-in-your-face. IO's post was absolutely brutal.

IO's scummyness: I didn't think scum would want the attention that a loud post like that attracts. Certain third parties (Jester) want to draw attention and look suspect, while others (Lyncher) wouldn't mind the attention after the lynch because they've already won. Scum didn't make sense to me, so needed to be town or maybe third party (I don't typically try to paint people as third party). His post seemed very outside the usual for IO, I don't recall ever seeing anything quite like it from him.

"I've been RIGHT ON THE MONEY determining alignments lately.": It was just an observation: I was wrong about you and Shake in the BM, I was wrong about MrD in this game. I haven't been getting good reads lately, and I've been doing a poor job explaining the ones I do get.

Difference between newtown and newscum: The differences I outlined were relevant to "Mafia" scum, and could reasonably be extended to Cults. A newscum with a support network (scumbuddies or cultbuddies) shouldn't have just thrown in the towel like MrD did. Since I didn't think he was scum, I chalked him up as town. On a more general level, I'm not even sure how one would go about hunting "solo" third parties (Jesters, Survivors, Lynchers, SK's, etc).

Re: Book: Sure, he's always helpful. It struck me as odd that he would more or less acknowledge that MrD is newtown by providing all those resources, but at the same time lynch him for tells that could be either newtells or scumtells, when MrD was obviously capable of making newtells if he required all that information.

Did I miss anything?

[zombie urist]

Dariush:

I indeed got blocked, but I was trying to use a Scroll of Tracking on BMC. I can confirm this by tracking the person of town's choice tonight.

That doesn't confirm you were going to track BMC last night.

That's... a really far-fetched idea. So far-fetched that I see no way it could have into your head without outside influence. Two SKs is just plain crazy, since if Mr.D didn't get lynched we would have two NKs per night without scumkill. With your vigkill (and without anti-town death), that would result in six players on D2 and an instalose for town. Here's my theory: you're SK, there's no scum, there may or may not be cult, though probably there wouldn't be to keep the game even remotely balanced. My vote stays.

It was mentioned in the discussion thread. But if you think 2 SKs is far-fetched, then why are you subscribing to that idea? Also, it was pure luck I found a killing item.

Also, what reasons were you thinking, and why the word 'worrisome' instead of another?

What reasons? 'Worrisome' is what best describes how I feel.

Could you explain how he was being passive? Why would being useless (please quote or explain how he was being such), merit that vigkill of yours?

Read through his posts. He mostly asked and answered RVS questions.

Who is the most scummy in your eyes right now, and why didn't you target those in your list below?

Dariush. I didn't target those below because I didn't really think they were more scummy than UI at the time.

Also,

This has been bothering me a lot so far.

What is this

Lack of a scum-kill

[Dariush]

Yes, of course, bandwagon me with zero arguments. Unless you count OMGUS, that is. OMGUS brings the total up to a whopping one argument. Yeah, there's no doubt at all now that you're scum, thanks for claryfing that.

[zombie urist]

My reasons were stated earlier. Thanks for ignoring my replies to your arguments though. Also Dariush why did you not comment on IO's earlier arguments against Mr. D?

[NativeForeigner]

Do we get another extension? I'm in the middle of moving and won't be available until near the end of the day.

IronyOwl: Do you have nothing to say to my responses or have you just not had the chance to post?

[Hapah]

NF: We got one already. Day ends approx. 29 hours from the time of this post. Do you need another?

[Hapah]

Unvote.

The opening flavor strongly suggests a cult. However, Mr. D was 'working for the Guise of the Keeper' and was a SK, so its possible that there are 2 SKs.

That's... a really far-fetched idea. So far-fetched that I see no way it could have into your head without outside influence. Two SKs is just plain crazy, since if Mr.D didn't get lynched we would have two NKs per night without scumkill. With your vigkill (and without anti-town death), that would result in six players on D2 and an instalose for town. Here's my theory: you're SK, there's no scum, there may or may not be cult, though probably there wouldn't be to keep the game even remotely balanced. My vote stays.

I certainly don't think it's impossible. Didn't RL3 have two opposing 2-man scum factions? The fact that you dismiss it out of hand when the setup has already been shown to be outside the norm surprises me a little. 2 SK's isn't guaranteed or confirmed by any means, but I don't think it's as unlikely as you make it out to be.

Everyone: At a glance, ZU would have very little to gain from claiming either flavor (SK or Scum) of NK. He had to know it would invite scrutiny, and if he was an SK would probably want the town to operate under the assumption that the game is within normal bounds. I just can't see a solid reason to claim that kill like that unless you legitimately want to warn the town that the setup isn't typical. Anyone have thoughts on this?

ZU: Concerning no N1 Tir action: Could be that Scelly didn't even check in during the night (I had no action N1 in the last RL because Flandre vanished). It could be that he just didn't have any activate-able items. It's still unusual, sure, but I wouldn't paint it as too sinister.