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[darklord92]

I'm curious, there's never a direct explanation all I've seen so far is "eq2 sucks" or "WoW is better". To be honest eq2 has been my first mmorpg and i don't understand why it has such a hated reputation. The world looks nice, enemies are fresh and there have rarely been recolors of other models, each area has been unique, the world is huge. It seems like a decent game so far some of the quests do feel heavily weighted to do in a group but thats what a mmorpg is for.


I'm not sure why it's compared to WoW constantly in terms of graphics, both games look like they aim for two different styles; eq2 focused on a more realistic and "darker" fantasy world with more real textures and colors, where as WoW follows a cartoon like colorful attractive design. The art is eq2 is also more focused on the lore, the history of the game and it's world. Where as WoW focuses it's art into the characters and and monsters.


Can someone please explain why eq2 seems to be hated so much, let alone constantly compared with other mmorpgs as inferior despite the fact there is they are not compare able as both games attempt to convey different art styles. I want to avoid outright argument, or nonconstructive comments such as "eq2 is ugly" as they do nothing but add to the confusion and do not explain why that is an argument, why is it ugly, why is hated?

[Hanzoku]

Good question. I think EQ2's problems were:

* massively higher system requirements then EQ1. Yes, it looks pretty, but at the time it came out, its hardware requirements limited the number of users who could run it at decent framerates.
* EQ1's popularity. There's a large enough core that never made the switch and happily continues with EQ1 that expansions are still put out
* WoW happened to it. All debating aside, WoW siphoned a massive amount of the MMO market in its direction. People come and go from that number, but it does mean everyone else is working in the shadow of a colossus.

[Eek-A-Mouse]

I remember when I was really young and EQ2 had just come out. I had watched the hype closely and was really excited for it. I bought the awesome retail box that folded out and showed tons of information about the game. My computer ended up being too sub-par, so the box just accumulated dust on my shelf. I never played it, but I've always had a slight interest in the game because of how excited I was earlier.

tr;dr,
I'll be happy to be reading discussion on the game 

[darklord92]

I'm glad this has gone off to a good start, though i don't want to demonise WoW it is a huge player in the mmo and also the reason so many small "floped" mmos began when it's popularity soared, all wanting to cash in on the humongous cash cow a mmo can be.

[Heron TSG]

I liked it, though I stopped playing so that I'd have more free time. I don't play MMOs anymore. It was a startling change from EverQuest 1 to be sure, but mostly for the better. I've never heard anyone specifically hate it that didn't hate MMOs in general, actually.

[Flying Carcass]

"WoW happened to it" is pretty much the reason (and really, I wouldn't use the term hated). EQ2 and WoW released around the same time and while EQ2 took EQ1's model and added pretty graphics, WoW refined the MMO model by keeping computer system requirements low, refining the questing system and made it an integral part of game play complete with rewards in the form of loot and gold, making it solo-friendly, and built upon an existing non-MMO IP that attracted players who had never tried MMOs before.

[Sensei]

I don't really see much hate directed in EQ2's direction. Perhaps you're drawing impressions from some hive of WoW fanboys somewhere? I played it very briefly (it's free to play now, though you might better think of it as an unlimited time free trial) and it seemed fairly entertaining, not much wrong with it. It's certainly in direct competition with WoW though.

[Fikes]

I remember when I was really young and EQ2 had just come out. I had watched the hype closely and was really excited for it. I bought the awesome retail box that folded out and showed tons of information about the game. My computer ended up being too sub-par, so the box just accumulated dust on my shelf. I never played it, but I've always had a slight interest in the game because of how excited I was earlier.

tr;dr,
I'll be happy to be reading discussion on the game 

This statement really depressed me. You were really young when EQ2 came out? I am getting old.

EQ2 was my fourth MMO I think? Maybe 5th? Was it before or after Eve?

Anyways, I had a group of friends that played a lot of Dark Age of Camelot at the time and a little EQ1. We didn't make it very far in EQ 2, I am not completely sure why.

I think if suffered from being a sequel that changed too much. Very little about the game was familiar to long time EQ players. For instance, it used to be only monks had safe fall, and falling was very dangerous. In EQ2 it seemed like everyone had a spell or natural ability to lower fall damage.

It was also one of the first MMOs to really push instanced dungeons which I didn't think were executed very well. Some of my favorite EQ1 locations were now instances and as such had no players in them.

Finally I remember the classes in the game being a little odd. I played a Fury I think which was kind of a melee/healer hybrid. I always had mana but my abilities were always on cool down. It was backwards to most other MMOs (spam abilities until you run out of mana).

I wouldn't say it was terrible, but it captured none of the EQ1 flair.

[PrimusRibbus]

Anecdotally, everyone I knew that hated EQ2 and didn't hate MMOs in general hated it because it wasn't made by Blizzard. No logical reason (none of them actually tried EQ2), just the belief the WoW must be better because it had the Blizzard logo on the box.

[nenjin]

I chose not to play EQ2 because I'd played EQ1 and the differences were fairly stark to me. Yes the game got refined and modernized....at the same time taking away many of the things that make EQ so amazing. (And brutal.)

The game always struck me as a shadow of the previous title, in spirit and experience. (I think by then Verant was long gone and it was developed by SOE and anyone from Verant they'd managed to retain.) So I said no thanks. I know that's not entirely true, I know lots of EQ vets who enjoyed it. To me it didn't hold up the illusion of being a world though, not like EQ had.

[debvon]

I absolutely loved EQ2 and I played the hell out of it. I loved WoW as well, in fact I played both back and forth for probably 5 years when I was in school. I don't have time for MMOs like that anymore but if I could resubscribe to EQ2 I probably would. That game was amazing. I used to play a Fury healer back before you could just choose which 3rd tier class you wanted. I still remember my druid quest.  The Fury was a powerful healer, I think the only people who could outdo me with healing were Clerics. Also the Fury used to be able to solo green epic x2 creatures. Took a while.. but with lion form restoring mana and the HoT's, you could just go on and on. Unfortunately they used to reset after a certain amount of time.

I had an Illusionist friend who was soloing very difficult end game dungeons. It was amazing to watch him. He would let me come along but made me promise not to interfere with any sort of participation, because he had a very specific strategy for mesmerizing groups and killing things off one by one.

Good times..

[kaenneth]

There is some resentment among EQ1 players that EQ2 basically 'stole' their subscription money.

As in SoE neglecting their flagship title in favor of random MMO experiments that mostly fail in a couple years.

[Duuvian]

I chose not to play EQ2 because I'd played EQ1 and the differences were fairly stark to me. Yes the game got refined and modernized....at the same time taking away many of the things that make EQ so amazing. (And brutal.)

The game always struck me as a shadow of the previous title, in spirit and experience. (I think by then Verant was long gone and it was developed by SOE and anyone from Verant they'd managed to retain.) So I said no thanks. I know that's not entirely true, I know lots of EQ vets who enjoyed it. To me it didn't hold up the illusion of being a world though, not like EQ had.

EQ1 was my first mmo and I agree with the above. I was also disappointed with EQ2 because of the way the backstory was way different from EQ1 as well. Especially since my first EQ1 char was a Paladin of Marr from Freeport. In EQ 2 the Marr temple in Freeport was a smoking, inaccessible ruin when I tried it.

In addition I still think EQ1 is just a better game all around. Especially since they are both F2P now.

[nenjin]

EQ1 was just very raw and unstructured...and it made for some amazing (and hilariously broken) things. I really miss the madness of a rampaging train of mobs that never wiped its hate list, in particular. It was like watching living, animated, computer-driven chaos in action. It was fucking terrifying. (As a rogue I liked to hang out invisible and just lawl at the carnage. Then offer to drag corpses once the mobs reset. Even made platinum doing that.)

EQ2 was a much more structured game with the traditional safeguards and developed features we take for granted now. And that to me was why I didn't play it. EQ1 (which I logged into as F2P last month and was dumbfounded by its appearance) will never really be recreated; I don't think anyone except someone who lacks experience and has no connection to the industry. Because no dev would stick with a game that performed the way EQ1 did....and it's debatable if it would survive with today's gamers in the AAA market. Even the guys who made EQ1 didn't really capture it's spirit in the real successor to EQ1, Vanguard.

[Matz05]

I keep hearing all these stories about EQ1...

So it was more emergence-based than a lot of 'modern' MMOs? Fewer safeguards against 'exploits' or 'unintended behaviour'? I remember hearing about the internal logic of the world (for example, the roguelike-style dividing slimes) being used to hatch diaboliocal plots, instead of the boring, mechanical, creatively dead play you see even amongst griefers in other MMOs.

I can see a game like that being very popular with all the improvement in computing power, procedural generation, and AI over the years; but the concepts of 'balance', 'progression', 'sequence/rails', etc. need adjustment to fit with a simulated, instead of written world.

I think some MMOs try this to varying extents, but I think that as long as it remains fun, the more a world is simulated instead of written, the better.

Written: Red dragons spawn at X500 Y250 Z300 every time the minutes reach two (00:02, 00:12, etc.); unless there are more then 2 on the map. They cannot leave the Dragon Mountains map.

Simulated: Electric blobs eat Rodents of Unusual Size, and like damp, dark conditions. As a result, they should be generated alongside ROUS infestations in places like the NoobTown sewers. If the rat population is displaced, they will be too.