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Yes!

14 (93.3%)

No!

1 (6.7%)

Total Members Voted: 14

Voting closed: December 25, 2012, 01:15:00 pm

[Girlinhat]

I really like the idea of PVP, but it'd have to be orchestrated.  Minecraft is a game that makes it entirely too easy to raid your enemy at midnight when no one is online.  I'd suggest some form of plugin protection here, like to raid someone you must formally declare war, and when you've declared war you may only send as many people into the enemy nation as they have online.  Something to prevent rampant afk raids and roflstomps.

We also don't have a massive player base, so I question how well it would work to fragment players inside the server.  It turns from "No one's on the server" to "No one's on my nation" pretty quickly.

[forsaken1111]

I really like the idea of PVP, but it'd have to be orchestrated.  Minecraft is a game that makes it entirely too easy to raid your enemy at midnight when no one is online.  I'd suggest some form of plugin protection here, like to raid someone you must formally declare war, and when you've declared war you may only send as many people into the enemy nation as they have online.  Something to prevent rampant afk raids and roflstomps.

We also don't have a massive player base, so I question how well it would work to fragment players inside the server.  It turns from "No one's on the server" to "No one's on my nation" pretty quickly.

Good points. I'm still working out the details on pvp/raiding. For now, and with our smallish player base, we'd probably only have a handful of towns and not whole nations though as I said I intend opening this to the public as well so we may get some walk-ins. In fact until we get a decent population I may disable nation creation altogether.

Fragmentation happens anyway, I mean look at our current server. We have 3-4 distinct groups of people with bases in the overworld, water world, and mining world. Even if we didn't have those extra worlds, these people would have fragmented and forcing them to stay together would just result in unhappy people. Instead on the new server these people will be able to establish bases in the overworld by claiming and building towns. These towns will be visible to anyone because I'll be installing dynmaps so you can find your way around the server easily. The map will point out town borders, see who is online and allow you to chat with people on the server from the web, and will show protected zones among other things. It will be part of the server website and the site will have event announcements, etc.

By the way, is there a good webmaster out there who would like to assist? or a bukkit coder? or anyone really? This is a lot to do for one person but I'll get it done eventually.

Regarding Raiding, possibilities I can think of:

1. Raiding/pvp between towns/nations happens only on mutual declarations of enemy status. The Towny plugin allows towns to declare others as allies or enemies.
2. PVP, ie the killing of players by players, could happen at any time between mutual enemies.
3. Raiding, ie the destruction of property and stealing of lewts, is more complicated. I'm undecided between scheduled time slots and open raiding so long as a member of each town is online.
3a. Scheduled time slots are good because you know in advance when the raiding is enabled.
3b. Open raiding any time a member is online is alright, but what if that member is off mining or AFK? Its a touchy thing and would require some work.

Either way, raiding would be limited in destructiveness. You'd probably be able to break things like gates/doors, windows, 'soft' blocks like wool but I don't want one town totally leveling another. I'll give it more thought but it's certainly something I want in. If I had a dedicated bukkit coder I could do some cool stuff with this.

[Sergius]

If you don't want people to power a massfab with a solar panel, just remove the "advanced solars". Force people to build nuclear plants

[Girlinhat]

People will still use solars, they'll just use a LOT of them, and it'll cause server drag.  One big reason for advanced solars is to reduce the stress on servers, only have to handle 1 item instead of 500+.

Raids should be relatively soft aggro, I think.  Certain wood blocks might need to be destroyed.  But then you may have people guarding their loot by placing one cobblestone block over the door that the plugin won't let them break.  Full war should be possible though, TNT cannons don't get enough love.

[forsaken1111]

If you don't want people to power a massfab with a solar panel, just remove the "advanced solars". Force people to build nuclear plants

The advanced solars just make it physically more compact and less server intensive, its still easy to make large solar arrays. And that doesn't remove the issue, turning electricity into unlimited iron/copper/gold/tin. Its the same problem I have with transmutation, it destroys rarity and depresses overall economic value of the items. Who cares if you can find diamonds? Who would even look? Just make a lot of solar panels and/or a nuke plant and make unlimited diamonds once your massfab makes 12 chests full of uumatter over the next 2-3 days. Sure it takes an initial input of material to make the nuke plant/solar array but our server had a nuclear generator up on day 1 and someone was in full quantum by day 3.

PVP is ridiculous between people in quantum armor, and if full quantum suits are commonplace why would you even PVP? You'd have to bash each other for hours to deplete the charge before you could do any damage.

In fact I'm starting to think that the OP armors have no place in the server at all, but we'll see. The point here is to get people to socialize, play together, fight each other or whatever they enjoy, not sit in a house building a nuke reactor then making unlimited uu matter then making spires of diamond blocks all alone. I mean you can do that in singleplayer.

Oh and I added one thing to the list of planned features... a creative world. You can flip to the creative world and build whatever with the caveat that inventory does not transfer in and out of the creative world.

Raids should be relatively soft aggro, I think.  Certain wood blocks might need to be destroyed.  But then you may have people guarding their loot by placing one cobblestone block over the door that the plugin won't let them break.  Full war should be possible though, TNT cannons don't get enough love.

Agreed, I really like TNT cannons. The problem with raiding comes when they just make a stone wall, you can't get in without breaking some blocks. We could adopt the TN method of using TNT cannons to blow a hole in the outer wall only, then raiding by hand afterwards. We'll see.

[The Darkling Wolf]

I don't think you really need restrictions like that, just let people mine through the wall, straight into the corridor of Tesla coils that make them not be alive any more. We've got dozens of ways to defend ourselves with mods, I could have my entire wall lined with head height dispensers firing musket shot, using inverters to trigger them, so as soon as someone mines out a block of wall, they get shot in the face with something that can instakill a player with no armour.

[forsaken1111]

I don't think you really need restrictions like that, just let people mine through the wall, straight into the corridor of Tesla coils that make them not be alive any more. We've got dozens of ways to defend ourselves with mods, I could have my entire wall lined with head height dispensers firing musket shot, using inverters to trigger them, so as soon as someone mines out a block of wall, they get shot in the face with something that can instakill a player with no armour.

True that, I could just leave defense in the hands of the towns. I would still want to restrict raiding/war to only when members of both towns are online.

That still leaves the problem of nano/quantum armor. They really don't cost that much to make, especially nano, and they're incredibly OP in a pvp environment. Hm..

[The Darkling Wolf]

Oh yeah, definitely for only allowing raiding if both parties are online, just saying that you probably don't need any really restrictive rules, as for Quantum, disable it completely, and Nano, disable the helmet.

Nano armour, minus the helmet, allows Muskets to do 3 hearts of damage to you in one hit.

[Girlinhat]

I do just fine without fancy armor.  It's the jetpack/batpack that I really go for.  Iron armor is good enough for common use, for me at least.  Especially with bronze type armors available, it shouldn't be a huge deal to arm yourself.  Although all these armors DO break.  Nano/quantum does not.  That adds a bit of value to new items, for better or for worse.

It also means weapons still work.  IC2 armor is OP, made for single player people who are scared to die.  Although I do like that Quantum is effectively diamond armor with cheap repair.  Still costly, energy won't be free, but it does allow for some reusability and that may be important.

Also: People who want to avoid musket dispensers will understandably TNT the walls from a distance.  Let the defenders set up their modded defenses, and let the attackers set up their modded siege engines.

[The Darkling Wolf]

But while you're out there setting up your TNT cannon, I'm standing on my walls taking potshots at you.

Giving people a legitimate reason to breach the walls from a distance is much nicer than saying "Thou must do it this way for it is my command!"

I generally like giving the player as much freedom as possible, especially in Minecraft, a game all about freedom of choice.

Quantum is effectively diamond armor with cheap repair.  Still costly, energy won't be free, but it does allow for some reusability and that may be important.

Wanna know how many blocks you have to fall to die in Quantum?

[forsaken1111]

I like the idea of musket dispensers.

And now that I think about it, it shouldn't be a problem so long as raiding and war depends on mutual declaration, so really you'd have nothing to cry about.

Now I need to ensure I can allow raiding parties to break through lockette protection.

BTW I made lockette protecting your stuff cost money. o.o

I generally like giving the player as much freedom as possible, especially in Minecraft, a game all about freedom of choice.

Quantum is effectively diamond armor with cheap repair.  Still costly, energy won't be free, but it does allow for some reusability and that may be important.

Wanna know how many blocks you have to fall to die in Quantum?

I do. Also can anything actually kill you through quantum without depleting it?

[The Darkling Wolf]

Quantum is effectively diamond armor with cheap repair.  Still costly, energy won't be free, but it does allow for some reusability and that may be important.

Wanna know how many blocks you have to fall to die in Quantum?

I do. Also can anything actually kill you through quantum without depleting it?

2500 blocks, and nope. Not even Void Damage, that can kill you in Creative Mode, can get through Quantum.

[forsaken1111]

Yeah Quantum is probably going to be disabled then unless it can be altered. o.o

[Girlinhat]

Sorry, I typo'd NANO there.  Yes Quantum is OP.  Nano not quite as much.

[The Darkling Wolf]

Nano + Diamond helmet took 1 heart of damage from a musket. So a group of 3 or 4 players firing on a person would probably be able to take them down, Nano Sabre tears through Nano Armour like butter too, IIRC.

Sorry, I typo'd NANO there.  Yes Quantum is OP.  Nano not quite as much.

Oooh, my bad.