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[ank]

Don't forget the incentive to buy more new games knowing that you'll be able to sell them later.

exactly! It's like people would buy less new cars if they couldn't resell them.
Historically speaking a lot of the money earned from reselling games, goes right back into new games.
Trading in old games and money for new games is the most common way to resell games today.

[EuchreJack]

Also historically many automakers sell cars explicitly by advertising high resale values.

[fenrif]

But video games are a special case where all previous laws and logic don't apply because of ill-defined reasons that make no logical sense mo' money, mo' problems!

If you question this in any way you're basically just setting yourself up for a future with no video games at all!

[pilgrimboy]

So the disagreement comes between those who see a difference between physical and digital items.

And those who don't can mock the other side. Sounds fun.

[G-Flex]

I don't believe any of my arguments even particularly relied on there being a difference, or no difference, between them.

[pilgrimboy]

The difference has been stated in multiple posts. Just because one doesn't agree with the difference doesn't mean that it doesn't exist. Go ahead and see if you can find it. It's been brought up multiple times. If you don't already know the argument from reading this thread, then it shows that you really don't want to hear the opposing view so badly that you don't even see the argument being made. Which makes discussing this pointless.

[Matz05]

The "difference" is really not a big thing. ank is right.

[fenrif]

The difference between physical/digital wares, the unstoppable unavoidable degredation of anything that isn't bits and bytes, and the innate and unmutable constant value of digital downloads has been brought up multiple times.

And I believe I've responded to all those points during the course of the thread. As far as I know noone responded to me past that point? If I missed it then I'm genuinely sorry. But I'm fairly sure that didn't happen. I'd reiterate my points but I've been drinking and that'd be way too much effort. 

And I mock the opposing point of view because I understand it, thankyouverymuch. (I just wanted to say "mo' money mo' problems" to be honest)

[Rose]

Thing is, you can keep second hand items in like-new condition anyway.

Doesn't mean it always happens, though.

[Shadowlord]

thing is, bits can be flipped randomly each time something is copied, leading to degradation over time, as well.

People in this thread keep saying this, but this is why error detection and correction routines exist, which are part of any reading/writing operation.

[alexandertnt]

When the newest os/console has been released and the game stops working, then it has suffered software-rot, and has degraded.

If the software-doesnt-wear-out argument was valid, we wound not need to purchase any new software again. But we do because the software does stop working, and also because a new version with shiny new features comes out and, in effect, "degrades" the old software (it now functions inferiorly to the new product).

The ones and zero's won't degrade though, keeping in mind that this is taking about digital downloads, and most downloads are many-copies-of-a-master-copy, as opposed to a copy-of-a-copy-of-a-copy.

[G-Flex]

thing is, bits can be flipped randomly each time something is copied, leading to degradation over time, as well.

People in this thread keep saying this, but this is why error detection and correction routines exist, which are part of any reading/writing operation.

Right, which is why this has virtually never been a problem for me or anyone else here, except maybe in extremely rare circumstances. Copying digital data is generally done perfectly each time, and if not, usually something goes disastrously wrong and it's fairly obvious.

[MasterFancyPants]

Right, which is why this has virtually never been a problem for me or anyone else here, except maybe in extremely rare circumstances. Copying digital data is generally done perfectly each time, and if not, usually something goes disastrously wrong and it's fairly obvious.

You've really never had any problems with electronic degradation? I've had quite a few Word, Excel, ect. files get corrupted after moving them enough times between different computers and flash drives. On a more extreme note; just last year I started taking DF to school, so it could run in the background. It was fastest to move the save to the computer and back when I was done. That save is now unplayable.

Also, if this is really going to break companies, couldn't services like Steam just start charging in order to download games off their servers? If you buy new you get unlimited DLs, if you buy used it costs a dollar or so for each download.

[NRN_R_Sumo1]

Right, which is why this has virtually never been a problem for me or anyone else here, except maybe in extremely rare circumstances. Copying digital data is generally done perfectly each time, and if not, usually something goes disastrously wrong and it's fairly obvious.

You've really never had any problems with electronic degradation? I've had quite a few Word, Excel, ect. files get corrupted after moving them enough times between different computers and flash drives. On a more extreme note; just last year I started taking DF to school, so it could run in the background. It was fastest to move the save to the computer and back when I was done. That save is now unplayable.

Also, if this is really going to break companies, couldn't services like Steam just start charging in order to download games off their servers? If you buy new you get unlimited DLs, if you buy used it costs a dollar or so for each download.

Using their wonderful "Backup" option one could easily back up the files onto disks, you remember those right?
not to mention how often things go wrong with games and files need to be re-downloaded.

As it is they sell  "Access" to the files opposed to the files.
and thats the way it should be.

Personally as an indie programmer I have no problem with people sharing games, the problem comes when they sell them to other people, as that takes away money from the developers. A lot of people are known to 'pirate' a game to try it instead of getting a demo, and then paying for it if they like it enough.
So as I see it, they might not want to send developers money since they bought it cheaper from a 3rd party. 

I'm imagining right now that I've released a game for 10$, and then someone buys a copy, and starts selling copies of that copy for 3 dollars.
Now the costs of making that game, are tossed out the window, as well as the ability to make any money now that someone is selling the game I made for 3 dollars.

[alexandertnt]

I'm imagining right now that I've released a game for 10$, and then someone buys a copy, and starts selling copies of that copy for 3 dollars.

No, that is illegal. They can sell their right to use it. So they can sell it to one person only, and never use it themselves again, in much the same way selling a physical-disc game would work (or a car etc).