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I ATTAC

8 (15.4%)

I PROTECC

6 (11.5%)

Waiting on the third one

2 (3.8%)

Waiting on the third AND fourth one

1 (1.9%)

GET WELL SOON ZYGARDE

5 (9.6%)

I am a concientous objector and abstain from taking up arms

30 (57.7%)

Total Members Voted: 51

[Sirus]

D'oh!

So, why was there so much fervor over Protean Froakies way back in the X/Y days? Were a lot of hacked ones getting around or something?

[MagmaMcFry]

Nah, Protean was just a ridiculously good ability.

[Sirus]

But how did people knowwwwww

That's what I don't get. If you can't get HAs by breeding without the mother having the HA, then how did the first Protean Froakie come about?

[Greiger]

Think it was an event thing.  Some lucky bastids got females on their event pulls, people shortly realised how rediculous they could be, and then the folks who had a female bred them for their weight in gold platinum shinies, and then enough people had enough female protean froakies that supply could increase at a faster and faster rate.

[umiman]

Because of the compromised nature of the 3DS, we can datamine the Pokemon games from day 1.

So if you're asking how people knew about protean, they looked at the data. After that it's pretty obvious to tell that 50% bonus damage to any attack you can use is crazy strong. Also being able to change typing. And being pretty frigging fast.

It's also why we already have movesets and shit for these Sun and Moon mons.

[Oneir]

But how did people knowwwwww

That's what I don't get. If you can't get HAs by breeding without the mother having the HA, then how did the first Protean Froakie come about?

Friend Safari had the gen 6 second stage starters.

[Culise]

Think it was an event thing.  Some lucky bastids got females on their event pulls, people shortly realised how rediculous they could be, and then the folks who had a female bred them for their weight in gold platinum shinies, and then enough people had enough female protean froakies that supply could increase at a faster and faster rate.

We can thank Friend Safari for that one, actually.  This was the X/Y unique feature which allowed you, among other things, to catch Gen 1 and Gen 6 starters with hidden abilities.  If you were lucky enough to befriend someone whose Friend Code corresponded to a Water Safari with Froakies, you could catch all the Protean Froakies you wished.  As such, simply linking up with certain people was in huge demand: Froakie, sure, but also Eevee and Ditto. 

Also, I'm not sure it was entirely clear from the early data mining for X/Y; I don't believe we knew right away if Protean took effect before or after STAB calculations were made, which is where the 50% boost comes from.  I believe that came from direct experience.

EDIT: Ah, beaten by Oneir.  Also, Frogadiers, not Froakies.

[umiman]

I personally think protean Kecleon is scarier than Greninja.

Knock off, shadow sneak, power up punch, drain punch, sucker punch, etc.

It's so much harder to deal with and the priority moves are killer. I guarantee you almost no one expects the shadow sneak Kecleon. People always forget it has it.

Whereas everyone knows what Greninja is going to do. And it's so squishy too, so you can just smash it with an earthquake or something. Kecleon is much harder to kill not only because of protean type swapping, but because it's just tankier in general.

----------



Since you guys are only just getting into the game, let's talk about the new pokemons.

I didn't play too much since I found it pretty boring after awhile but I have played with the new mons on smogon for what it's worth.

I found that a lot of these new gen guys are pretty tanky. Many of them have above average HP and defensive stats.

To avoid spoilers I'll start with some of the mons you get right off the bat.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

1. Toucannon = I think it's okay. It's tanky, but has pretty high attack and really good offensive abilities in skill link and sheer force. That being said, its typing is pretty shit for skill link as it only has access to rock blast and bullet seed. Similarly, it doesn't have any good moves for sheer force either due to being normal / flying.

2. Gumshoos = It's kinda like a tanky Raticate?

3. Vikavolt = This thing with choice specs is nuts. At least that's what I want to say but its coverage is so garbage. It basically only has two STAB moves in lightning bolt and bug buzz. After that is... what? energy ball? air slash? hidden power? If you could find a way to overcome the 50% accuracy of its signature move zap cannon, that would be pretty strong.

4. Crabominable = Another "tanky" physical attacker. What is this? League of Legends? Is everyone a tanky bruiser now? That being said it is ice / fighting so it's a lot more fragile than its stats may suggest. Hits hard though, especially with iron fist.

5. Oricorio = I imagine this would be great in multi battles and worthless otherwise.

6. Ribombee = I think it's cute but otherwise meh. Typing is alright though.

7. Lycanroc = Hmm... it's really rare to have pure rock types (prior to this generation). I've always liked them as rock is actually really hard to kill. A fast pure rock type is nonexistant until now. Basically the difference between these two is a faster but more fragile version or a slower but tankier one. I'd choose the faster one personally. Also it has sand rush, which will make it nuts. Rock STAB moves are always strong, so no problems there. So I think it's pretty good.

8. Wishiwashi = Uhh... this one is kinda interesting. It's tempting to call it worthless like a certain prehistoric bird but the ability is not as bad as it seems. In schooling form this thing is insane. Seriously, look at its stats. 140 attack, 130 defense, 140 sp attack, 135 sp def. However, it has ludicriously low HP and speed. And once it goes below 1/4th health, it's dead. I'd imagine this would be absurd under the right circumstances like trick room or multi battles.

9. Toxapex = This thing is ultra tanky and has regenerator. GGWP. My new favorite pokemon. It's also poison / water in case you wanted something even tankier due to typing. But wait, there's more. Its signature move is basically protect, except if you attack it while its protecting, you get poisoned. LOL.

10. Araquanid = Another tanky water type. Typing is great in water / bug to make it extra tanky. Its abilities are stupid strong in water absorb and water bubble (2x water power, can't be burned, takes 1/2 fire damage). Also has a really potent moveset with unique moves in liquidation (20% chance to reduce enemy def by 1, water STAB with 85 damage) and lunge (100% chance to reduce enemy attack by 1, bug STAB with 80 damage).

I'll stop here for now.

[Cerol Lenslens]

I'm running behind compared to you guys - I keep taking longer breaks to charge the battery or something. I'm just finishing up the first island. Accidentally found the cave in the flower area that it seems fairly clear I will need to come back to with surf later, moved on and went through ten-carat hill.

And I am starting to dread encountering Hau and Lillie almost as much as I did Cheren and Bianca. The game's insistence on all these mini plot events and forcing you into a linear storyline is really starting to grate. In a game series that's generally all about exploration and hunting for pokemon in new and different ways, being told "You can't go through those gates! The... uh... the paint's wet! Maybe after you eat Malasadas and punch that pink-haired guy's Smeargle or whatever it'll be dry!" is absolutely atrocious.

I mean, take this anecdote, for example.

Spoiler: Anecdote (run-on-sentences intentional) (click to show/hide)

I was toying around with the QR code thing, and finally realized how to activate the island scan thing, and what it actually did. Bam! I was suddenly tasked with hunting down a Cyndaquil on Route 3. "Woah, another starter to hang out with my Torracat!?!" I exclaimed. "And it's just one route over!" Then I realized I was on an hour timer. Well, no problem. It was just one route, right? So I rush out of the cemetary, head north, stop to grab an item or two, and am immediately accosted by a Delibird. "Quick! You have to go have the mandatory berry tutorial!" insisted Rotom, so I grudgingly went in and rescued the guy's sorry butt from some rappers.

"Okay, now that that's over, I just need to head a little ways north, and bam! Route 3 and Cyndaquil is as good as mine!" I rush north, dodge a few trainers, get accosted by a couple of others and another aggressive F.O.P., and then Hau demands I have a cutscene with him and drags me inside the Pokecenter. I skim the text and run out. I still have 40 minutes or so! All right, looks like Route 3 is right... there... behind that hastily-assembled barricade... Goddammit! Oh, hey, fence-painter guy! Blocking my progress again? Oh, before I'm allowed on Route 3, I have to do this island trial? Man, Sabrina and Blaine never pulled this nonsense. Fine! I go in, beat two rats, and the third one decides to make me chase it in circles for five minutes, and then more rappers show up and force me to mash A to burn through their dialogue and then beat them up again. Normally I wouldn't be so rude, but I'm on the clock, here! 30 minutes left! Fight the third rat, talk to the guy, run up to the pedestal, swipe the jewel like an inconsiderate jerk because Cyndaquil's waiting and get jumped by Totem Raticate for not switching the Z-Stone with an equally-weighted bag of sand or whatever. Set the rat and all his cronies on fire, and... dammit pink-haired guy! He soliloquies at me for a bit and then tells me he's reactivated random encounters in the cave on the way out.

Seven trillion zubats and angry rats later, I stumble out of the blasted trial cave aaand get accosted by pink-haired Captain fence-painter again. This time he decides to explain to me all about how sometimes guys like him put up barricades for no good reason to force people to take the trials before they can get on with the main focus of the game, as if I hadn't figured that out when a mysterious barricade blocking Route 3 forced me to take his blasted trial and then he makes it vanish in a burst of white light with his powerful obstruction magic and now I can get through except here comes the professor to force me to watch him demonstrate Z-Powers! He drags me over to witness as he takes an inordinately long time to obliterate some poor Growlithe, pausing for an unnecessarily long time over each selection so I can memorize exactly what he's doing before he uses what is effectively a Final Fantasy cutscene summon to finish the job.

"Oh hey! By the way, we need you to find Lillie!" No. Lillie can wait, cold and alone, shivering wherever she's fucked off to, wondering why nobody's coming for her. There's a Cyndaquil with my name on it, I only have like five minutes to get it, and there's a trainer with an annoyingly durable Psyduck in the way, and Cyndaquil had better be in this patch of grass somewhere. And after a few trash mons I find it and use way too many balls catching it, and all is well in the world and I am now willing to put up with Lillie's bullshit, but goddamn was that a stressful hour or so. And not in a good way.

Was there any reason to make the 'Find Lillie' plot temporally dependent on the trial? Why couldn't I just go onto Route 3, do that, and come back to handle the trial later if I felt like it? It's not like Brock, where the game really wanted to force you to use a limited selection of early-game mons so that his rock-typing would mean something. This trial was already restricting you from going to the rest of the game by dint of needing to do it before you could challenge the Kahuna, and from there leaving the beginner island. It felt like it was hamhandedly preventing any kind of exploration or other goals until you dealt with this trial, so if you wanted to go catch a Spearow for that lady who wants to trade you a Machop for it? Too bad.

Other than that, it's been fun so far. 

[RekkaAtsuma]

All in all, I hate the very fact they use those barricades at all, Earlier Generations never used Man-made barriers to anywehre near this extent.
And as this is the Pokemon+Humans together Generation, it's way outta theme.

My progress has been Slow. I chose Rowlet, which has been both Boon and Bane.(Seems to me Poplio is most Ideal for easy-mode starter.) I have also been semi-powering through, to gain access to Clothing Shops, but I'm almost always 2 or 3 levels above my foes, yet somehow, their 1st 2 Attacks do 12 to 14 dmg, then their third use of the exact same move does OHKO level damage and only that first use of said attack was critical. WTH Pokemon?.
---However I've had this happen both being attacked and attacking them. (And my Rowlet's Refresh affection has saved my scalp from going bald a few times.)

The only real thing bothering me: How exactly do you set up a Dye-Shop in the Festival Plaza. As of this Post I'm Plaza level 7, and all I can do is re-arrange what I have set up and wait for level-ups and hope Game-BOI guy gives me a Dye Shop.
And even then I pray it's the right colors: I need Red, Pink and Purple Dyes.

[Yoink]

Am I the only one that sees the nurse flipping me the double bird every time I step into a pokecenter?

Relevant.   

[Greiger]

I'm telling ya she is.  Clearly that's just how nurses do it.  They do it so that you still get the message yet noone can say they actually disrespected you!  Wake up Sheeple!

Seems they made bulk breeding easier and harder at the same time.  On one hand the nursery will send an egg to your box for you if your party is full, or allow you to have the egg replace a hatchling.  Massively convenient.  On the other the path outside the Nursery is much shorter than the ones in other games, leaving less room for riding back and fourth.  Also if yer not careful you'll talk to the miltank instead.  Maybe there's a place like Lumiose later though with a looping city later though.

Also I've hit a wall at the nursery.  I can't stop breeding bagons and starters for things I want.  I'm currently sitting on something like 10 salandit eggs as I try to get a female with a + sp atk nature. And I don't think I'm anywhere near where I'm legitimately supposed to be able to catch the things.  With a bagon in GTS desperately looking for something with flame body. I've already traded for vulpix and a turtle dragon.  I can't stop.  Send help.

[Sirus]

Well. There's some feel-punchy stuff going on in the world of SuMo if you pay attention and explore some. Real-life stuff that might be familiar to some people.

Spoiler: I'm sure this stuff is common knowledge but it only makes sense to not spoil a week-old game (click to show/hide)

On Melemele Island, there's a house in which some guy laments the fact that his kid basically took off without much of a word. He says "I was the one that got beat". The kid's room is covered in a fine layer of dust...and there's a golf bag in the corner that contains "a great number of broken and bent golf clubs".

Also on Melemele, you've got the graveyard. Graveyards and people mourning their pokemon in them are nothing new to the series, but on a revisit (I discovered that Misdreavus could be found there and I've never had one before, so I went a-running) I found an old woman being carried around by a Machamp. Turns out her husband is buried in that same graveyard. He died in a traffic accident and the Machamp (who spent most of the scene weeping) would have died as well had the husband not returned Machamp to its ball just before impact. The widow entreats you to be very careful while riding pokemon around so you don't suffer a similar fate.

I'm...not used to feeling depressed while playing Pokemon. I found both of these in quick succession.

[Neonivek]

Wow... Congratulations Pokémon! Actual drama without twirling mustache villainy.

It is like we are in Generation 1 all over again.

This is a VERY strong contender for best Pokémon...

[Culise]

Seems they made bulk breeding easier and harder at the same time.  On one hand the nursery will send an egg to your box for you if your party is full, or allow you to have the egg replace a hatchling.  Massively convenient.  On the other the path outside the Nursery is much shorter than the ones in other games, leaving less room for riding back and fourth.  Also if yer not careful you'll talk to the miltank instead.  Maybe there's a place like Lumiose later though with a looping city later though.

Also I've hit a wall at the nursery.  I can't stop breeding bagons and starters for things I want.  I'm currently sitting on something like 10 salandit eggs as I try to get a female with a + sp atk nature. And I don't think I'm anywhere near where I'm legitimately supposed to be able to catch the things.  With a bagon in GTS desperately looking for something with flame body. I've already traded for vulpix and a turtle dragon.  I can't stop.  Send help.

Well, I can help, but it won't help you stop.  Just south of the nursery on the other side of the path is a small area inside a broken fence (also has some hay bales, a shovel, and a small box).  Walk in there, call the Tauros, hold B, and just spin spin spin.  It counts for steps, you don't need to worry about watching where you're going, and you can always see the nursery worker to ask her for Pokemon eggs (she crosses her arms when she has one).  Be gentle on your poor analog stick if you do this, though. ^_^

Also, correcting some erroneous information I posted earlier.  You can check EVs by going into the summary screen, as I mentioned, but you also need to press the Y button to switch the radar display to EVs.  Oopsie.  My own EV distribution without training was already so erratic that I didn't parse out that I had flubbed up there.