Bay 12 Games Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  
Pages: [1] 2 3

Author Topic: Have you embarked into the caverns?  (Read 5113 times)

guitarxe

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Have you embarked into the caverns?
« on: June 19, 2012, 09:59:32 pm »

I'm wondering how many people embark and immediately dig down to the first cavern and setup a fort there instead of closer to the surface?
What kind of equipment and dwarf setups should I embark with? I'm thinking of having every dwarf have military skills since they can learn anything else useful later on, but I don't know how much armour is required to give adequate protection against cavern critters.

What else should I expect from caverns other than dangerous creatures?

And do caravans arrive in the cavern, or do I have to make a gigantic ramp for them from the surface down to the cavern?
Logged
Feeling down? Click Here!

Corai

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Have you embarked into the caverns?
« Reply #1 on: June 19, 2012, 10:03:20 pm »

If the surface is 100% UNREACHABLE, then they spawn in caverns, caravans do.





7 iron helmets, or steel. Keep helmets on dwarves at all times. Masons to get a wall built fast and herbalists to get the underground crops.
Logged
Jacob/Lee: you have a heart made of fluffy
Jeykab/Bee: how the fuck do you live your daily life corai
Jeykab/Bee: you seem like the person who constantly has mini heart attacks because cuuuute

Hanslanda

  • Bay Watcher
  • Baal's More Evil American Twin
    • View Profile
Re: Have you embarked into the caverns?
« Reply #2 on: June 19, 2012, 10:21:43 pm »

Also, cave in traps are your somewhat unstable, psychopathic friend. You've got plenty of roof to drop on steel giant lobsters with four tails, three eyes, and webs Uninvited Guests.
Logged
Well, we could put two and two together and write a book: "The Shit that Hans and Max Did: You Won't Believe This Shit."
He's fucking with us.

lcy03406

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Have you embarked into the caverns?
« Reply #3 on: June 19, 2012, 11:35:08 pm »

in 34.11, embark with armors is quite easy: ores are cheaper and require less labor to smelt.
Logged

Urist_McArathos

  • Bay Watcher
  • Nobody enjoys a good laugh more than I do.
    • View Profile
Re: Have you embarked into the caverns?
« Reply #4 on: June 19, 2012, 11:44:41 pm »

I'm wondering how many people embark and immediately dig down to the first cavern and setup a fort there instead of closer to the surface?
What kind of equipment and dwarf setups should I embark with? I'm thinking of having every dwarf have military skills since they can learn anything else useful later on, but I don't know how much armour is required to give adequate protection against cavern critters.

What else should I expect from caverns other than dangerous creatures?

And do caravans arrive in the cavern, or do I have to make a gigantic ramp for them from the surface down to the cavern?

You know, I just may try this for my next fort; my current one is giving me headaches and I can't find the culprit.
Logged
Current Community/Story Projects:
On the Nature of Dwarves

Hanslanda

  • Bay Watcher
  • Baal's More Evil American Twin
    • View Profile
Re: Have you embarked into the caverns?
« Reply #5 on: June 19, 2012, 11:48:15 pm »

I just did. I point to this topic as inspiration for Oceanfortune, deep in the caverns under a massive ocean that somehow didn't have an aquifer.
Logged
Well, we could put two and two together and write a book: "The Shit that Hans and Max Did: You Won't Believe This Shit."
He's fucking with us.

guitarxe

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Have you embarked into the caverns?
« Reply #6 on: June 20, 2012, 10:33:51 am »

If the surface is 100% UNREACHABLE, then they spawn in caverns, caravans do.

You mean, if the fort is 100% unreachable FROM the surface? Or the very surface is 100% unreachable some how? (Like, mountain embarks... which are not possible without modding anyway..)

Also, usually if I have a depot within my fort's walls on the surface, then when a caravan comes in they will just stand at the edge of the map until a path to the depot opens up.

What if my fort is in the cavern, and the depot is also within the walls. Will the caravan spawn at the surface and wait, or in the cavern and wait?
Logged
Feeling down? Click Here!

Kon

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Have you embarked into the caverns?
« Reply #7 on: June 20, 2012, 12:14:25 pm »

I'm wondering how many people embark and immediately dig down to the first cavern and setup a fort there instead of closer to the surface?...

I've done this before. One of the keys is to wall up access from the edges so Forgotten Beasts can't get to your dwarves. Sometimes walls have to be built 4 or 5 levels high to keep the flying FBs out. So, the priorities should be alcohol, food, and walls.
Logged
I can explain it to you, but I can't understand it for you.

Urist_McArathos

  • Bay Watcher
  • Nobody enjoys a good laugh more than I do.
    • View Profile
Re: Have you embarked into the caverns?
« Reply #8 on: June 20, 2012, 04:06:09 pm »

I'm wondering how many people embark and immediately dig down to the first cavern and setup a fort there instead of closer to the surface?
What kind of equipment and dwarf setups should I embark with? I'm thinking of having every dwarf have military skills since they can learn anything else useful later on, but I don't know how much armour is required to give adequate protection against cavern critters.

What else should I expect from caverns other than dangerous creatures?

And do caravans arrive in the cavern, or do I have to make a gigantic ramp for them from the surface down to the cavern?

You know, I just may try this for my next fort; my current one is giving me headaches and I can't find the culprit.
Logged
Current Community/Story Projects:
On the Nature of Dwarves

Loud Whispers

  • Bay Watcher
  • They said we have to aim higher, so we dug deeper.
    • View Profile
    • I APPLAUD YOU SIRRAH
Re: Have you embarked into the caverns?
« Reply #9 on: June 20, 2012, 04:49:57 pm »

The cavern is an odd one. Usually everyone dies immediately, or the fort becomes far too easy to hold. I don't know where I stand with them.

Dwarfler

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Have you embarked into the caverns?
« Reply #10 on: June 21, 2012, 10:12:37 am »

I'm wondering how many people embark and immediately dig down to the first cavern and setup a fort there instead of closer to the surface?

This has actually become my default modus operandi of late.  Caverns give wood, land suitable for grazing and farming, and there's something infinitely more dwarfy about a fortress centered around underground caverns than one built close to the surface.

Quote
What kind of equipment and dwarf setups should I embark with? I'm thinking of having every dwarf have military skills since they can learn anything else useful later on, but I don't know how much armour is required to give adequate protection against cavern critters.

You really don't need to do anything different embark-wise.  Starting with a bunch of military skills/equipment is not really that necessary for settling the first cavern layer (usually around z-levels 25-35).  You are unlikely to run into anything tougher than a couple of troglodytes or bugbats, especially if you dig down immediately.  What you will want to do is pick a good spot that you can wall off quickly and easily.  A lot of caverns have wide open spaces surrounded by little mazy passages.  These are perfect.  Build a statue in the middle of the wide open space and designate it as a sculpture garden.  Your livestock will congregate in this area and graze on the cave moss without having to be pastured.  Then just slap up a few well-placed walls in the mazy areas to isolate yourself from the cavern proper.  As your fort matures, you can always deconstruct a few of these walls and expand further into the caverns.  As another poster mentioned, be mindful of the multiple z-levels of the cavern - you will need to make sure your walls go all the way up to fully protect yourself from flyers.

Quote
And do caravans arrive in the cavern, or do I have to make a gigantic ramp for them from the surface down to the cavern?

This is really the one big hitch about cavern-based forts.  Caravans will not spawn in the caverns under normal circumstances.  What I usually do is build an airlocked trade depot on the surface with a nearby chimney that leads down to the cavern.  You still have to haul trade goods up to the depot (or build a burrow for a live-in craftsdwarf near the surface to make goods) but then you can designate purchased goods for dumping down the chimney into the cavern.  You can also dump ores down the chimney (since iron ore and fuel generally only occur near the surface).

In 34.11 you will need to take precautions with the chimney, as falling items will now do damage to dwarfs who might be standing at the bottom (in past versions they did not).  Also with the new minecart revisions, since ore is so much heavier, the chimney dump is probably less efficient than a good cart setup.
Logged
Why do I like Dwarf Fortress so much?  It's hard to learn, harder to play, and downright impossible to win.

...

I mean, what's not to like?

SmileyMan

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Have you embarked into the caverns?
« Reply #11 on: June 21, 2012, 10:27:59 am »

I build a spiral ramp wide enough for caravans, to a part of the caverns as far from my entrance as possible, then build the depot just inside the fortress entrance.

I might install windows so that the inhabitants can enjoy the show as the merchants take on the trolls.
Logged
In a fat-fingered moment while setting up another military squad I accidentally created a captain of the guard rather than a militia captain.  His squad of near-legendary hammerdwarves equipped with high quality silver hammers then took it upon themselves to dispense justice to all the mandate breakers in the fortress.  It was quite messy.

guitarxe

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Have you embarked into the caverns?
« Reply #12 on: June 21, 2012, 11:38:36 am »

Flying creatures... underground?  :o
Do those really exist?
Logged
Feeling down? Click Here!

Hyndis

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Have you embarked into the caverns?
« Reply #13 on: June 21, 2012, 11:41:03 am »

I find it a fun challenge to build the entire fort inside a cavern.

You will first need to sanitize the cavern with a strong military and an army of miners and masons. Once you've killed all hostiles in the cavern and walled it off so its safe, then move everyone down into the caverns and build your main fortress there.

Of course this means you still need to have access to the surface for trade and goblinite, but that isn't too hard to do. Build a citadel on the surface full of soldiers and a trade depot, then have stairs down into the cavern layer where your dwarves all live.

Building within the cavern layer forces improvisation rather than sticking with your usual building plans. Caverns are also very safe if you've walled off the edges of the caverns entirely. Nothing can spawn if you build walls all the way to the edge of map, which you can do underground. The masons will need protection while they do this, and you will need to rig up a clever system of drawbridges and pumps to provide protection in case of underground lakes that reach the edge of the map, but its very doable.

Downside to this is that you need to build a temporary fort while you're doing all this. It will probably take 5-10 years before you're ready to move into the caverns, but until you're ready to move into the caverns you need a place for all of your dwarves. The surface citadel is probably the best place to keep everyone temporarily. Cramped little citadel tower on the surface without any luxuries could keep them safe while you're sanitizing the caverns.
Logged

Hyndis

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Have you embarked into the caverns?
« Reply #14 on: June 21, 2012, 11:41:37 am »

Flying creatures... underground?  :o
Do those really exist?

Demons fly, some FB's fly, some cave creatures fly.

A zombie version of a flying creature will also fly.
Logged
Pages: [1] 2 3