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Author Topic: Getting a puppy, internet advice  (Read 6773 times)

Caz

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Re: Getting a puppy, internet advice
« Reply #30 on: June 25, 2012, 03:50:30 am »

Most dogs in shelters actually don't have severe behavioural problems, and if they do the shelter will probably know already and inform you beforehand. What's more common are attachment and anxiety problems. Anyone with a brain can train a dog, it's not that bloody difficult tbh.
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Neonivek

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Re: Getting a puppy, internet advice
« Reply #31 on: June 25, 2012, 03:55:45 am »

it's not that bloody difficult tbh.

Depends what it is you are trying to do. The hardest things to do is to train your dog OUT of a trained action.
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forsaken1111

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Re: Getting a puppy, internet advice
« Reply #32 on: June 25, 2012, 05:24:30 am »

Breeding more dogs as pets when there is such an overpopulation of them is, in itself, a mistake. How do you think overpopulation happens?
Perhaps dog breeders should be forced to visit the animal crematoriums a few times a week so they can see all the dogs and cats which are killed and burned so that the breeder can make some more money selling a unhealthy 'purebred'. But by all means, continue defending the silly business model while I enjoy rehabilitating rescue animals and finding them good homes.
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Andrew425

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Re: Getting a puppy, internet advice
« Reply #33 on: June 25, 2012, 03:51:29 pm »

Breeding more dogs as pets when there is such an overpopulation of them is, in itself, a mistake. How do you think overpopulation happens?
Perhaps dog breeders should be forced to visit the animal crematoriums a few times a week so they can see all the dogs and cats which are killed and burned so that the breeder can make some more money selling a unhealthy 'purebred'. But by all means, continue defending the silly business model while I enjoy rehabilitating rescue animals and finding them good homes.


Maybe for puppy mill owners, but many dog breeders don't do it to make money. They do it because they like the breed.
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kilakan

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Re: Getting a puppy, internet advice
« Reply #34 on: June 25, 2012, 04:08:43 pm »

Ok I just wanna toss this out there, I am a dog breeder in conjunction with my mother.  We have 4 breeding dogs, which are bred AT MOST once a year so none of them are being abused with constant litters.  Frankly this constant discussion of 'all breeders are evil' is incredibly insulting.  We don't make any money off of the enterprise, we thoroughly check out the people we place with to make sure they are GOOD homes, and the dogs we are breeding is of a species nearly extinct, and has great health.  Also those tossing it around that mutts have less health problems is just plain lies, mutts can either inherit the good genetics of the parents or all the bad, so like 1/4 the time you get a better dog, 2/4 it's the same as the parents, 1/4 its twice as worse.  Honestly the biology behind it isn't even that hard, and there is numerous other problems with mutts like the muscles growing too big for the bones, joints being mis-matched, brain too large for the skull, ect ect. 

I suppose the bottom line is, the tossing around 'all breeders are bastards' and the resulting discussion is incredibly offensive.  Now if we want to actually give this person advice on the puppy let's do that, otherwise stop the derogatory derailments.

Edit*Also to be fair, older mutts may be in better health simply because they are that 1/4 of those born I discussed, otherwise they were probably put down or died before you saw them.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2012, 04:10:52 pm by kilakan »
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G-Flex

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Re: Getting a puppy, internet advice
« Reply #35 on: June 25, 2012, 04:17:44 pm »

Breeding more dogs as pets when there is such an overpopulation of them is, in itself, a mistake. How do you think overpopulation happens?
Perhaps dog breeders should be forced to visit the animal crematoriums a few times a week so they can see all the dogs and cats which are killed and burned so that the breeder can make some more money selling a unhealthy 'purebred'. But by all means, continue defending the silly business model while I enjoy rehabilitating rescue animals and finding them good homes.


Maybe for puppy mill owners, but many dog breeders don't do it to make money. They do it because they like the breed.

If you actually, genuinely like dogs, why would you breed ones that are drastically more likely than others to have health problems, and why would you want to enable the abandonment and eventual death of many of them by contributing to their overpopulation?

I suppose the bottom line is, the tossing around 'all breeders are bastards' and the resulting discussion is incredibly offensive.  Now if we want to actually give this person advice on the puppy let's do that, otherwise stop the derogatory derailments.

Here's the thing: You're saying a lot there, but you haven't actually addressed any of the legitimate concerns I've raised. So please, stop pretending that I'm calling you "evil" and, if you want to challenge people's points, actually challenge them.

You did specifically mention health and genetics, though. First off, purebred dogs, especially show breeds, tend to have fairly specific health problems because their bodies have been bred to various extremes which are not themselves very functional, and because breeding in a low-diversity gene pool is in itself problematic. These problems do not exist as much in mixed-breed dogs, and there are many health problems which mostly affect, and are linked to, specific breeds. Yes, mutts can still be unhealthy, but not generally as often as with purebreds, and the fact remains that many harmful genetic conditions are the direct result of dog breeding, some of them done intentionally because people liked the way it looked or because it helped them adhere to some kennel club standard.

I have no idea what's up with your probability-breakdown there, but in reality, an offspring of two organisms with more dissimilar genetics (e.g. a mixed-breed dog) is usually better off with less a chance of genetic disorders than an offspring of two organisms with very similar genetics (e.g. a purebred dog). Consider this effect over the course of many, many generations of the same breed of dog, especially considering the effects of close inbreeding (not that all breeders do this, but it does affect the genetics of the breed).

So... yeah. I'm not calling people "evil" or "bastards". I'm saying I disagree with what they do, and consider it wrong, and am giving reasons why.
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Andrew425

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Re: Getting a puppy, internet advice
« Reply #36 on: June 25, 2012, 04:35:31 pm »

Breeding more dogs as pets when there is such an overpopulation of them is, in itself, a mistake. How do you think overpopulation happens?
Perhaps dog breeders should be forced to visit the animal crematoriums a few times a week so they can see all the dogs and cats which are killed and burned so that the breeder can make some more money selling a unhealthy 'purebred'. But by all means, continue defending the silly business model while I enjoy rehabilitating rescue animals and finding them good homes.


Maybe for puppy mill owners, but many dog breeders don't do it to make money. They do it because they like the breed.

If you actually, genuinely like dogs, why would you breed ones that are drastically more likely than others to have health problems, and why would you want to enable the abandonment and eventual death of many of them by contributing to their overpopulation?

Because I want a certain type of dog? And not all pure breeds have health problems.

I'm all for adopting dogs and cats. I just think that I should have a choice of which dog I want.

As for dog advice, make sure to hide your cables and to protect your chair legs.
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G-Flex

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Re: Getting a puppy, internet advice
« Reply #37 on: June 26, 2012, 12:55:23 am »

Because I want a certain type of dog?

Understood, though mixed-breeds are diverse enough that most people should be able to find a dog they like.

However, I understand wanting a dog with certain qualities a whole lot more than I understand wanting a certain breed out of some sort of principle.

Quote
And not all pure breeds have health problems.

I'm not sure what your point is here. Is it that it's okay to breed purebred dogs even though they're more prone to health problems, just because not all of them will have those problems? Also, when buying a dog, you can't necessarily predict whether you'll get unlucky or lucky with its health, because you can't tell the future. You can only act on the information available on what a certain dog's history is or what a certain breed might be susceptible to.
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DrPoo

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Re: Getting a puppy, internet advice
« Reply #38 on: June 26, 2012, 05:04:03 pm »

Breeders are the evil. You should've picked up a dog from a shelter. :(

Train it well. A dog's behaviour is only a reflection of the owner. Clickers are valuable tools in training too.

Breeders arent evil! Atleast not the one i got my Belgian Shepherd from. She didnt care for anything but her god damn dogs, and they seemed like they had the best life ever.

Generally, Shepherds need alot of outside stuff, and training. They are work dogs and needs something to occupy their time with.
Its seems like your will be fine. But be sure: That you agree with any family members/your partner, given you have one, what the names of the commandos will be.
That you never yell at it, its traumatising to a dog.
That you understand its an animal with a personality, not a little plushie, this thing dosent survive running dry of batteries.
PRIORTISE THE "COME" COMMAND, You want your dog to come when you call, regardless of situation. Dogs are ran over because they decide to ignore their owner and run out on the country road instead.
Teach your dog to stay with you, make sure that running away is a bad idea, make it loyal to you.
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Neonivek

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Re: Getting a puppy, internet advice
« Reply #39 on: June 27, 2012, 12:33:14 am »

Plus don't forget that people who intentionally buy breeds that cannot be created safely are also just as much to blame (and the Dog Breeders society of America who are the ones who outright define what a pure breed is and the qualities that make a pure breed acceptible)
« Last Edit: June 27, 2012, 12:35:11 am by Neonivek »
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