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[NRDL]

So...what do I do now?  Support the Constitution?  Eagle Eye's sounds nice, very Republican(?). 

[UristMcWanderer]

A Bill of mine:

Firearm Purchase and Ownership Act:
- Any citizen 18 years of age or older is allowed to purchase a sporting rifle or shotgun, provided they have a permit to own a long gun on them at time of purchase; where as sporting weapon is defined as any long gun designed for hunting or target range use.
- Any citizen 21 years of age or older is allowed to purchase a handgun for self-defense or target shooting use, provided they have a permit to own a handgun on them at time of purchase.
- Any citizen who wishes to carry a handgun in public must keep the weapon concealed and must have a permit to carry a handgun in public places.
- If a household contains more than three firearms, the homeowner must have a permit to own more than three firearms in their household, otherwise all firearms will be confiscated until the homeowner can present a permit to the authorities.
- If any citizen is caught in public, with a handgun, without a public-carry permit, the firearm will be confiscated until the owner can present a public-carry permit
- If any citizen wields a firearm in public at all, unless it is done for self-defensive purposes, the firearm  will be confiscated and the owner placed in jail for a period of 30 days.
- Any citizen who owns a long gun must be ready to defend his or her homeland in the event of an attack from any enemy nation.
- Any military-purpose firearm, unless vintage surplus, may not be sold to civilian customers.
- Any firearm with any sort of automatic firing capability may not be sold to civilian customers.

Any section may be omitted or amended to fit the Citizens' Rights.

[Scelly9]

So...what do I do now?  Support the Constitution?  Eagle Eye's sounds nice, very Republican(?).

You can. Or you could add to it, or create a whole new bill. Once I have bolded actions from everybody, I will run the turn.

Eagle eye has suggested a modification to Proposition 1a!

Spoiler: Proposition 1b: The Constitution (click to show/hide)

The Legislature:
     -To be composed of five permanent senators and fifteen non permanent representatives
     -Each representative will have a term of six years, in staggered groups of five.
     -The remaining legislature will select replacement representatives, and replacement senators in case of death or resignation
     -The legislature may set law with a majority vote on any proposition
     -Amendments to this document may be made by a majority vote of both representatives and senators

The Executive:
     -The senators act together as the supreme executive
     -A majority of senators is required for any action outside of the country
     -Unanimous consent is required for domestic actions
     
The Judiciary:
     -Local governments may choose judges as they please
     -Juries shall be selected randomly , and any jury member with ties to any plantiff or defendant will be replaced
     -The judge overseeing a case may control sentencing, but not determine guilt or innocence
     -Cases may be appealed from state courts to the Legislature, which may or may not decide to hear them
     -At the creation of this constitution, all criminal laws of the prior government are considered to be in effect until otherwise determined by the legislature

The Military:
     -All military leaders are subordinate to the Senators
     -The military may not take action within the nation except in event of war
     -Military tribunals may be set up for use on military members who have violated the law while on duty

The Rights of the States:
     -States may control education policy
     -States may control local law enforcement and judiciaries
     -States may control local tax laws and business regulations
     -All state laws are considered secondary to national laws
     -States may control public transit within their boundaries
     -States may control the exploitation of their natural resources, except in the event of wartime

The Rights of Individuals:
     -No citizen can be deprived of the right to publicly speak when it does not present a danger to others
     -No citizen can be deprived of the right to hold their own beliefs
     -No citizen may enlist in the forces of another nation or act in violence against the nation
     -Any citizen may operate a commercial enterprise in accordance with existing regulation
     -No citizen may operate a private bank, where bank is defined as an organization profiting from interest on loans of any commodity or currency

8 people oppose it, on the grounds that there is no reason for the five of you to be elevated above the rest! If you where to become corrupt, it would be nearly possible to fix it! They agree to vote yes if you change it.

UristMcWanderer has drafted a new Bill!

Spoiler: Firearm Purchase and Ownership Act (click to show/hide)

Firearm Purchase and Ownership Act:
- Any citizen 18 years of age or older is allowed to purchase a sporting rifle or shotgun, provided they have a permit to own a long gun on them at time of purchase; where as sporting weapon is defined as any long gun designed for hunting or target range use.
- Any citizen 21 years of age or older is allowed to purchase a handgun for self-defense or target shooting use, provided they have a permit to own a handgun on them at time of purchase.
- Any citizen who wishes to carry a handgun in public must keep the weapon concealed and must have a permit to carry a handgun in public places.
- If a household contains more than three firearms, the homeowner must have a permit to own more than three firearms in their household, otherwise all firearms will be confiscated until the homeowner can present a permit to the authorities.
- If any citizen is caught in public, with a handgun, without a public-carry permit, the firearm will be confiscated until the owner can present a public-carry permit
- If any citizen wields a firearm in public at all, unless it is done for self-defensive purposes, the firearm  will be confiscated and the owner placed in jail for a period of 30 days.
- Any citizen who owns a long gun must be ready to defend his or her homeland in the event of an attack from any enemy nation.
- Any military-purpose firearm, unless vintage surplus, may not be sold to civilian customers.
- Any firearm with any sort of automatic firing capability may not be sold to civilian customers.

2 oppose it, on the grounds that weaponry should not be allowed! 1 opposes on the grounds that automatic firing weapons should be sold to civilians.

[Eagle_eye]

I think concealed handguns are going too far. shotguns and rifles, sure. But concealed handguns are dangerous. You can hide them and get them into places you shouldn't bring them, like speeches of congresspeople... I also propose that the draft potential be extended to all owners of anything more powerful than a pellet gun. I support the rest of it.

[Doomblade187]

I disagree with the thought of banning concealed handguns. While it may act as a deterrent to crime, criminals would carry their weapons concealed anyway if they choose to. Therefore, while not allowing concealed weapons may act as a deterrent to crime, the measure would make security content and not ready to search for concealed weapons, those which we have to fear.

[Eagle_eye]

Wouldn't open handgun carry be just as effective in keeping civilians safe?

Anyways, do all of you agree on the constitution?

[Doomblade187]

My Take on Proposal 1a:

The Legislature:
     -To be composed of twenty non permanent representatives We want there to be fresh blood. While I do not mind this position, I feel it would be better for the nation to keep fresh blood moving through.
     -Each representative will have a term of six years, in staggered groups of five.
     -The remaining legislature will select replacement representatives, but must act according to the votes that will be held for the area they represent- to facilitate this, 20 new wide voting districts (demographically equal if possible) will be drawn and votes held for replacements when needed. This is to facilitate fresh blood in the legislature and keep the people happy. I expect many of the legislature to be re-elected, but this should keep it from becoming a good-old-boys club.
     -The legislature may set law with a majority vote on any proposition
     -Amendments to this document may be made by a majority vote of both representatives and senators

The Executive:
     -The senators act together as the supreme executive
     -A majority of senators is required for any action outside of the country
     -Unanimous consent is required for domestic actions
     
The Judiciary:
     -Local governments may choose judges as they please Voting for this is suggested, but we should first see how the system works before we change it.
     -Juries shall be selected randomly , and any jury member with ties to any plantiff or defendant will be replaced
     -The judge overseeing a case may control sentencing, but not determine guilt or innocence
     -Cases may be appealed from state courts to the Legislature, which may or may not decide to hear them
     -At the creation of this constitution, all criminal laws of the prior government are considered to be in effect until otherwise determined by the legislature
The Military:
     -All military leaders are subordinate to the Senators
     -The military may not take action within the nation except in event of war
     -Military tribunals may be set up for use on military members who have violated the law while on duty

The Rights of the States:
     -States may control education policy
     -States may control local law enforcement and judiciaries
     -States may control local tax laws and business regulations
     -All state laws are considered secondary to national laws
     -States may control public transit within their boundaries
     -States may control the exploitation of their natural resources, except in the event of wartime

The Rights of Individuals:
     -No citizen can be deprived of the right to publicly speak when it does not present a danger to others
     -No citizen can be deprived of the right to hold their own beliefs
     -No citizen may enlist in the forces of another nation or act in violence against the nation
     -Any citizen may operate a commercial enterprise in accordance with existing regulation
     -No citizen may operate a private bank without a license, where bank is defined as an organization profiting from interest on loans of any commodity or currency This will allow us to control the economy better while maintaining a system of free enterprise.

[Doomblade187]

Wouldn't open handgun carry be just as effective in keeping civilians safe?

Anyways, do all of you agree on the constitution?

Yes, I agree on the constitution in general, but I have made some changes and presented them. About the handgun issue- open carry handguns wouldn't stop criminals from concealing them, so as long as we make security ready for concealed weapons of all types, we can implement open-carry. In essence, we have to keep the crime rate down- open carry handguns would be good for this, as long as we beef up security.

[Eagle_eye]

waitwaitwait. (all that follows is to be heard only by the other players, not the NPC delegates)

We have a chance to install ourselves for life... and you're turning it down?

[Doomblade187]

((Again, only to other players))

Yes- I'm turning it down. There are a few reasons here. Mainly, I trust the civilian populace to vote for good representatives. However, I would accept the offer of a life term perfectly fine, and I'm pretty sure 15 voting districts would be easier to draw than 20. I have no problem with the life terms- I just trust the civilians. So yes, I'm fine with the life terms.

[Eagle_eye]

I'm willing to compromise on the banks and voting districts, so..

for:
Me
Doomblade
NRDL
7NPC's
Against:
8 NPC's

Unvoted:
Knave
Urist

So, we have a majority if either knave or urist approve of the constitution.

[kingfisher1112]

Is there any slot open?

[Knave]

For the most part I agree with the Proposal.

Some thoughts though:

-If there is no 'ruler' or tie-breaking vote, a fear a 20 man body will lead to many stalemates. This country needs a leader, some sort of senior representative that has the final say in terms of deadlocked votes. Elected by the other representatives.
- The rights of individuals does not go far enough, something along the line of "No person shall be discriminated against based on their race, gender, sexual orientation, religious or cultural beliefs."

I would also like to include provisions limiting the power of corporations, lobby groups and private financing in elections and the government in general, but perhaps that can wait.

[Eagle_eye]

I was thinking that a tie would just preserve the status quo. As for the individual rights, I'm fine with that modification.

[UristMcWanderer]

I approve the Constitution.

As for the handguns issue in my Bill, I did say that handgun owners must have a public-carry permit on them if they wish to carry it in public for self-defense. Criminals carry firearms out in public without a permit most of the time, and they often forge permits if they do have one. They use their handguns for nefarious purposes, such as robbing stores. Non-criminals who carry a handgun stand by. A good citizen would use his to keep the criminal at bay until the cops show up; I personally would classify it as "self-defense".

As I said:

Any section may be omitted or amended to fit the Citizens' Rights.