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[LoSboccacc]

it is also a mechanical device, an awesome film, a slang for methamp, and it works as a verb too

[ank]

We are arguing over different things:
Others and I are arguing:"Gnomoria is a DF-clone with graphics."
I'm not arguing whether this is a good or bad thing, just that it's a fact.
If you would like a simple DF with graphics and "better" interface, then Gnomoria is a good thing.
If you don't like that idea, it's a bad or meh thing.

But accept the fact of Gnomoria being extremely similar to DF, and then we can go on to argue whether it's a good or bad thing.

And mind you, he may be charging for the Alpha, but it's just 1$...

I really hope that he will branch out his ideas away from DF, possibly just in small ways like fields not growing in the winter.

If anybody have confused me with a rabid copyrightist, I can say I am nothing of the sort.
In fact if this game had better features than DF i would be playing Gnomoria instead, and hailing that.

I am glad that so many new games are looking to DF for inspiration, but some designers actually build their game from the ground up, like Towns. While on the surface also being similar to DF, Towns does everything in it's own (sometimes idiot) way.

[Andir]

We are arguing over different things:
Others and I are arguing:"Gnomoria is a DF-clone with graphics."
I'm not arguing whether this is a good or bad thing, just that it's a fact.

It's also a fact that COD, Halo, Quake, et al are clones of Doom.  It's also a fact that Starcraft is a clone of Command and Conquer (I'm sure there's a much older comparison to make).  It's also a fact that hamburgers served by McDonalds are clones of hamburgers sold by Burger King.  Except, Burger King flame broils (graphics) their burger to flavor it up.  (I'm not really sure if they do this anymore...)

I don't understand why you dislike Gnomoria for adding sauce.  Is it because Uncle Herbert isn't charging for his Hamburger where Joe Smith down the road is charging for his?  If you don't like it, don't buy it.  I don't see the problem.  In this case, even Uncle Herbert allows Joe Smith to advertise on his restaurant.  Otherwise he wouldn't have a place to post "Other Food Places" on his hamburger stand.  Instead, he'd place a "No Soliciting" sign up and expect all his patrons to not talk about other food places.

[nenjin]

I think it's the fact that the "sauce" also bears striking resemblance to DF's sauce. If Burger King started suddenly offering a burger with Thousand Island Dressing and called it "Whopper Sauce" they'd probably be getting sued by McDonalds in short order.

[TripJack]

Burger king already makes whoppers... If someone else made something and called it a 'whopper' they would be infringing on burger king's trademark yeah. If someone made a burger the exact same as a whopper but called it something else, there would be no problem.

This is all quite irrelevant of course.

[LoSboccacc]

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

When Burger King expanded into the San Antonio area, it was prevented from utilizing the name Whopper in its local advertising and stores due to a prior state registered service mark owned by a local chain known as Whopper Burger.[37] The chain, owned by Frank and Barbara Bates, prevented the company from using the name in Bexar County for several years until Mrs. Bates, the CEO of Whopper Burger after the death of her husband in 1983, retired and sold the chain with its related trademarks to then-corporate parent Pillsbury in the mid-1980s.[38]

I had to check and now I wonder who came first

Edit: turns out burgher king was second.

[nenjin]

Burger king already makes whoppers... If someone else made something and called it a 'whopper' they would be infringing on burger king's trademark yeah. If someone made a burger the exact same as a whopper but called it something else, there would be no problem.

This is all quite irrelevant of course.

I think you're misunderstanding what I'm saying.

McDonalds has a burger called the Big Mac. It comes with this stuff called "Big Mac Sauce" which is really just Thousand Island Dressing.

If Burger King started putting Thousand Island Dressing on their burger and calling "Whopper Sauce", they'd likely be getting sued by McDonalds for infringing on their product.

The real take home is that only people with enough time and wealth to sue will do so. And whether Gnomoria really infringes on DF or not, it would take Toady suing, which he won't do. Unless he could prove Gnomoria is using actual code from DF.

[Andir]

Burger king already makes whoppers... If someone else made something and called it a 'whopper' they would be infringing on burger king's trademark yeah. If someone made a burger the exact same as a whopper but called it something else, there would be no problem.

This is all quite irrelevant of course.

I think you're misunderstanding what I'm saying.

McDonalds has a burger called the Big Mac. It comes with this stuff called "Big Mac Sauce" which is really just Thousand Island Dressing.

If Burger King started putting Thousand Island Dressing on their burger and calling "Whopper Sauce", they'd likely be getting sued by McDonalds for infringing on their product.

The real take home is that only people with enough time and wealth to sue will do so. And whether Gnomoria really infringes on DF or not, it would take Toady suing, which he won't do. Unless he could prove Gnomoria is using actual code from DF.

But in the case of DF/Gnomoria ... DF is the hamburger patty, and Gnomoria added a bun so it's easier to eat.  It may not have all the special spices in the burger itself... but you currently may choose to add your own bread to eat the DF burger, where the chef over at Gnomoria decided to just include it and ask for a small upfront cost to keep cooking.

[nenjin]

I don't necessarily disagree, but I think it's debatable. I generally don't get bothered by DF knock offs anymore unless it's known that they're using code from DF.

[TripJack]

I think you're misunderstanding what I'm saying.

McDonalds has a burger called the Big Mac. It comes with this stuff called "Big Mac Sauce" which is really just Thousand Island Dressing.

If Burger King started putting Thousand Island Dressing on their burger and calling "Whopper Sauce", they'd likely be getting sued by McDonalds for infringing on their product.

Ah, I gotcha.

[Fikes]

I really thought these arguments died when someone claimed Delve Deeper was copying Dwarf Fortress because the king wore purple, but I guess the DF Cult of Purity lives on.

Can anyone explain to me why it would be a bad thing to see this genre (I'll even call them DF-Likes) grow?

Does anyone here honestly believe that this has a negative impact on the development or success of Dwarf Fortress? If so, how?

Personally I think having several successful games in a genre generally positively impacts what ever one you prefer. For example, DOTA was very popular, so Riot Games came out with League of Legends and spent a few years on the top. Now DOTA 2 is in beta and LOL is taking some of the lessons from them to refire their product. Specifically, LOL added a timer to accept games so you aren't stuck with AFKers at champion select. They learned that trick from DOTA2.

Now I feel like a putz for extending this argument with a post that said nothing about the game.

[jocan2003]

Im sorry to say that, and i mean no disrespect to anyone, but seeing the last couple page i feel like im browsing a minecraft forum bashing anything that has a resemblance with minecraft..... Really guys.... dont bash the game or the author that crappy, yeah it look like DF but i would call it a DF-Lite with graphics thats it, there is no bad in that, and he wants to make a living too i understand it. If you think it worth what he ask go for it, if not dont. But please do no insult the game/author its not like he will surpass DF anytime soon, maybe in handling and *ease of use* but freack we dont need those...

[Leatra]

I'm totally cool with this game. But...

Creator of Gnomoria is selling the game.
Creator of Dwarf Fortress is only accepting donations.

It's kinda... I don't know. If it was the other way around... meh. Whatever. More games like DF can only be a good thing.

[The Rookie]

I'm totally cool with this game. But...

Creator of Gnomoria is selling the game.
Creator of Dwarf Fortress is only accepting donations.

It's kinda... I don't know. If it was the other way around... meh. Whatever. More games like DF can only be a good thing.

To be fair, adding graphics on top of being a DF-like isn't easy, neither is adding a GUI.

[jocan2003]

Not everyone can live up with only donation and thats his right, he is using a genre, and last i know of genre cannot be copyrighted and bashing the game/author is acting like fanboys are we REALLY fanboys? Its not like he made a direct attack to DF or stole a copy of the source and sold it or nothing like that, he used a genre, like RTS FPS DF just dont stick to any predefined genre, maybe some GOD genre?

Heck everytime a game break the mold and then another game pop-out using the same genre the second get BASHED for exploring the genre altogether with the other, ok it might make competition between the 2 game but HECK without competition a genre can die pretty quick. With competion come innovation.

Minecraft came first, then lets take an easy example terraria, minecraft bashed terraria real hard just because it had the same spirit, sandbox-ressourcegathering-survivalish-buildyourhouse type of gameplay.

Now let be civilized say that you are angry, that you dont like the fact he is using the same genre right, but for god sake dont bash the game or the author mindlessly like a *insert your favorite insult here*