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[Mr S]

Only in DF is working with Magma in the nude safer less un-safe than fully clothed.  Fantastic.

BTW, is there any !!Science!! on flamability of Beards as it relates to Magma tap mining safety?

[Vodrilus]

I've been trying to challenge mysekf (and my dorfs) with a 2x2 breach of the volcano wall for extra flow. Sadly, it's only resulted in 1x2 openings and crispy miners (and "ghosts of the magma pipe"). It gets really dangerous, really fast.

[Mr S]

Try the sneaky under bridge method.  Should be able to mine it out as wide as you can designate a bridge.  Bonus points for multiple bridges in tandem side by side!  Dump the entire caldera in 10 ticks!!!

[GhostDwemer]

These are bad solutions. You don't have to bother with a pump or with letting your miner catch on fire in the first place. Either dig stairs up to the top of the caldera and channel the final square from above magma level, and let it flow down the stairs to where you want it, or build a magma-safe bridge right up to the side of the volcano at any level with a channel under it and a separate hallway leading there one z-level below. Block access to the top hallway and then designate the wall to be mined. The miner will go under the bridge in the bottom hallway and mine the wall from the ramp through the bridge from below, and the magma will just flow over the bridge and never touch him.

No, THIS is a bad solution, as the magma at the top will replenish slowly, and falling magma now creates magma mist. Door+diagonal fortifications FTW.

[Vodrilus]

Try the sneaky under bridge method.  Should be able to mine it out as wide as you can designate a bridge.  Bonus points for multiple bridges in tandem side by side!  Dump the entire caldera in 10 ticks!!!

Oh yeah, that one. I recall reading about it in some other thread. Haven't tried it yet, though. Are you sure that doesn't create magma mist in the newer versions?

[Sabreur]

These are bad solutions. You don't have to bother with a pump or with letting your miner catch on fire in the first place. Either dig stairs up to the top of the caldera and channel the final square from above magma level, and let it flow down the stairs to where you want it, or build a magma-safe bridge right up to the side of the volcano at any level with a channel under it and a separate hallway leading there one z-level below. Block access to the top hallway and then designate the wall to be mined. The miner will go under the bridge in the bottom hallway and mine the wall from the ramp through the bridge from below, and the magma will just flow over the bridge and never touch him.

No, THIS is a bad solution, as the magma at the top will replenish slowly, and falling magma now creates magma mist. Door+diagonal fortifications FTW.

Strongly disagree. Magma mist is irrelevant, your dwarves won't be standing anywhere they can be misted. Magma replenishing is a good thing for most applications, and doesn't hurt others. Most importantly, it allows for fast magma flow, which is very helpful for anything requiring large volumes of magma. Diagonal fortifications are faster to set up and work fine if you're just setting up magma forges and such, but for high-volume applications the bridge method is the way to go.

[jhxmt]

Another option is channelling out from above, with an escape sluice level below connected by stairs (i.e. channel from Z-0, with magma flowing both horizontally and down stairs to Z-1).  It looks like Rakushun's first mentioned method is similar.  Has always worked well for me, with no casualties (except when I grew too greedy and tried to breach at multiple places at the same time, confusing my miners' pathfinding and causing one of them to try and path down the same stairs as the magma).

Link in my sig gives a more detailed explanation.

[GhostDwemer]

These are bad solutions. You don't have to bother with a pump or with letting your miner catch on fire in the first place. Either dig stairs up to the top of the caldera and channel the final square from above magma level, and let it flow down the stairs to where you want it, or build a magma-safe bridge right up to the side of the volcano at any level with a channel under it and a separate hallway leading there one z-level below. Block access to the top hallway and then designate the wall to be mined. The miner will go under the bridge in the bottom hallway and mine the wall from the ramp through the bridge from below, and the magma will just flow over the bridge and never touch him.

No, THIS is a bad solution, as the magma at the top will replenish slowly, and falling magma now creates magma mist. Door+diagonal fortifications FTW.

Strongly disagree. Magma mist is irrelevant, your dwarves won't be standing anywhere they can be misted. Magma replenishing is a good thing for most applications, and doesn't hurt others. Most importantly, it allows for fast magma flow, which is very helpful for anything requiring large volumes of magma. Diagonal fortifications are faster to set up and work fine if you're just setting up magma forges and such, but for high-volume applications the bridge method is the way to go.

Explain how, in the post I quoted, dwarfs will not be standing next to magma mist. They will be standing next to falling magma, and they will get burned. Have you even tried this in the new release?

Herp derp, of course replenishing is good. You drastically misunderstood me. If you tap at the top, you will be taking from the top and your overall flow rate will be limited by the replenishment rate. If you take from below the top the magma next to your inlet will maintain a level of 7/7 until all levels above have been depleted. When you tap from the top, magma will deplete to below 7/7 and you will not have a full magma reservoir until the magma replenishes.

I repeat, please don't listen to Sabreur on this unless you really want lots of !!FUN!!, and a long wait until your magma workshops are at 4/7. If you like burning dwarves and waiting a year for your magma workshops to start up, then by all means follow Sabreur's advice.

[slink]

These are bad solutions. You don't have to bother with a pump or with letting your miner catch on fire in the first place. Either dig stairs up to the top of the caldera and channel the final square from above magma level, and let it flow down the stairs to where you want it, or build a magma-safe bridge right up to the side of the volcano at any level with a channel under it and a separate hallway leading there one z-level below. Block access to the top hallway and then designate the wall to be mined. The miner will go under the bridge in the bottom hallway and mine the wall from the ramp through the bridge from below, and the magma will just flow over the bridge and never touch him.

No, THIS is a bad solution, as the magma at the top will replenish slowly, and falling magma now creates magma mist. Door+diagonal fortifications FTW.

Strongly disagree. Magma mist is irrelevant, your dwarves won't be standing anywhere they can be misted. Magma replenishing is a good thing for most applications, and doesn't hurt others. Most importantly, it allows for fast magma flow, which is very helpful for anything requiring large volumes of magma. Diagonal fortifications are faster to set up and work fine if you're just setting up magma forges and such, but for high-volume applications the bridge method is the way to go.

Explain how, in the post I quoted, dwarfs will not be standing next to magma mist. They will be standing next to falling magma, and they will get burned. Have you even tried this in the new release?

Herp derp, of course replenishing is good. You drastically misunderstood me. If you tap at the top, you will be taking from the top and your overall flow rate will be limited by the replenishment rate. If you take from below the top the magma next to your inlet will maintain a level of 7/7 until all levels above have been depleted. When you tap from the top, magma will deplete to below 7/7 and you will not have a full magma reservoir until the magma replenishes.

I repeat, please don't listen to Sabreur on this unless you really want lots of !!FUN!!, and a long wait until your magma workshops are at 4/7. If you like burning dwarves and waiting a year for your magma workshops to start up, then by all means follow Sabreur's advice.

I've never tried the under-the-bridge method but I don't see how a Dwarf under the bridge can be exposed to magma mist.  Also, the bridge can be placed at any level so you are not limited to draining just the top layer of the volcano.

I have tapped magma pipes at the top level, to a same-level reservoir, and not had a very long wait until the workshops can be used.  Then again, I never need a very big forge room.  One kiln, one glass furnace, and one or two each of smelters and forges usually fills my needs.  If I were going to let it flow down a stairwell, I would first build a floor over the top of the stairwell to prevent any mist from rising.  Then the situation should be the same as I have been doing with same-level reservoirs.

I can say from experience that the diagonal fortification without a door is fatal now.  I'd be more inclined to give the bridge method a try than to add a door to the diagonal fortification method, simply because I like the idea of getting a wider channel if I'm going to build something anyway.

[Sabreur]

Explain how, in the post I quoted, dwarfs will not be standing next to magma mist. They will be standing next to falling magma, and they will get burned.

They'll be standing under a bridge.  Mist does not travel through constructions, such as bridges.  At no point does a dwarf stand next to falling magma with the bridge method.

[Hanslanda]

No need to get fiesty. We're all magma lovers here, we all probably have different methods. Let's work together before we argue details of magma breaching. I certainly appreciate all the advice given, but I don't want a flame war.

[Wannazzaki]

Magma has no pressure if the breach is on the same z level as what you want to fill. Channel a magma pit to the side a volcano, and pierce it while in the pit, it wont fill higher than the pit.

[Rakushun]

Sorry to sort of necrobump this thread, but I've been trying the bridge method discussed as a way to breach the bottom of my rivers to drain them underground and off the map. I've heard around the forum and I think even on the wiki that you can dig on the z-level of a closed bridge from below the bridge, but I can't get it to work at all. Here's a diagram:

Code: [Select]

River Z

WWWW
RRRR
RRRR
RRRR
RRRR
WWWW

RZ-1

WWWW
WBPW
WBPW
WBPW
WBPW
WWWW

RZ-2

WWWW
WJWW
WPWW
WPWW
WJWW
WWWW

W = Wall, R = River, B = Bridge, P = Ramp or designated ramp, J = Downward stairway.

So as you can see, the bridge is set up to stop the river from falling right on my miners. P on RZ-1 is where I've designated the ramps to punch through the river bottom. On RZ-2, I had up/down stairs but when my miners refused to dig through the bridge I thought I needed ramps, so I got rid of the stairs and put in a couple ramps, represented by P. That didn't work either.

So am I doing something wrong, or is this whole bridge method just bad information?

EDIT: I may have figured out why it's not working, I still have down stairs underneath the bridges. I'll have to remove them and try again.

EDIT 2: Confirmed that the problem was having down stairs directly under the bridges. Also confirmed that the method works.

[kaenneth]

Not this way =)

http://buttersafe.com/