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How many outfits are we going to have (in the name of Science)?

1: NC
2: NC and TR
3: NC, TR and Vanu

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Author Topic: Planetside 2: Free-to-Play MMOFPS. 2000 players/server.  (Read 1131822 times)

Egan_BW

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Re: Planetside 2: Free-to-Play MMOFPS. 2000 players/server.
« Reply #12150 on: July 24, 2016, 12:09:39 am »

I think that SOE whatsherface should replace all noseguns with melee weapons, so that skyknights can joust as they were always meant to.
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Ozyton

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Re: Planetside 2: Free-to-Play MMOFPS. 2000 players/server.
« Reply #12151 on: July 24, 2016, 01:44:31 am »

I always wanted a bayonet attachment for my rifle.
Why not have a bayonet attachment for the nose guns? I mean, ramming is already viable...

Akura

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Re: Planetside 2: Free-to-Play MMOFPS. 2000 players/server.
« Reply #12152 on: July 24, 2016, 04:05:26 am »

Well, we have to have something to make up for not having a factional advantage-trait like NC or TR.

Doesn't the Scythe have perfect hover, something the Reaver and Mosquito cannot do?
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Tiruin

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Re: Planetside 2: Free-to-Play MMOFPS. 2000 players/server.
« Reply #12153 on: July 24, 2016, 06:37:40 am »

Well, we have to have something to make up for not having a factional advantage-trait like NC or TR.
Factional advantage? Those exist? I thought everyone was generally balanced with certain niches but all around OK? :-X
* Tiruin plays on the Briggs server.
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Flying Dice

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Re: Planetside 2: Free-to-Play MMOFPS. 2000 players/server.
« Reply #12154 on: July 24, 2016, 08:42:18 am »

Well, we have to have something to make up for not having a factional advantage-trait like NC or TR.

Doesn't the Scythe have perfect hover, something the Reaver and Mosquito cannot do?
If you use the level 3 hover module, yeah. Otherwise you play the same thruster-tapping game to stop from diving into shit while trying to bombard it. It's a bit better at hovering by default, but a fighter-bomber that's slightly better at hovering is not preferable to one which is faster, more maneuverable, and faster firing, or one that can take a bigger pounding and do more damage per shot. Especially when the others get factional advantage on their weapons and it doesn't (see lolpods, it's really obvious there), or when it's designed such that it catches on obstacles and blows up instead of bouncing off.

Well, we have to have something to make up for not having a factional advantage-trait like NC or TR.
Factional advantage? Those exist? I thought everyone was generally balanced with certain niches but all around OK? :-X
* Tiruin plays on the Briggs server.

I've played all three a decent amount, and VS is definitely the worst off, partially by originally design and partially because people whined until they lost the one thing they really had going for them.

Here are the things that were nominally among VS's advantages back in the day:

1. No bullet drop.
2. Balanced weapon stats.
3. Magboost.

1: Only applies to some types of small arms. Does not affect dumbfire rockets, bolt action sniper rifles, or most vehicle weapons (barring one or two that are energy weapons). Combine this with how most VS small arms have average or worse damage falloff and you've got a situation where the primary VS advantage is that it's slightly easier to harass people with really low damage shots from outside normal engagement ranges. But they still aren't hitscan, either. So in effect it eliminates one of the three aim-offsetting factors (the others being flight time and recoil), but ranges where damage is meaningful are so short that you'll never need more than a millimeter or two of elevation anyways. That, and it doesn't get applied to anything where it would actually be useful. Sniper rifles still have drop, tank shells still have drop, rocket pods still have drop, &c.

Compare that to TR and NC. TR get high RoF and large magazines (which equates directly to lower TTK and more kills for each reload) applied to all of their weapons including MBT cannons and rocket pods. NC get high damage (with lower RoF and generally heavier recoil). This also applies to all of their weapons, and their downsides are things that can be compensated for. Lower RoF is tolerable if your guns can kill with fewer shots, and recoil management is basic mechanics. The GodSAW, even post-nerf, is still one of the best weapons in the game for a reason: it's a one or two-tap kill LMG that's functionally also a sniper rifle.

You'll see people talking about VS weapons being more accurate or some shit, that's pretty much entirely false. In effect they're slower firing than TR, much weaker than NC, with a tiny advantage that doesn't apply in 95% of fights. Leading in to...

2: Nominally true, insofar as that VS weapons tend to fall into the middle of the road. In other words, they're typically shit at everything. The Orion is considered to be one of the most powerful VS guns because of its high RoF (mainly)--it's a noticeable underperformer when compared to TR guns. The SVA-88 is the other useful VS LMG, because it's like a shitty weak knockoff of the Gauss SAW. That's what you see repeated throughout, the VS have a lot of mediocre guns that don't do well in any role, and a few that are almost as good as the average for other factions.

3. The Magboost. Which no longer applies because people cried until it was nerfed into the ground.

Okay, so here's the deal with the Magrider: it's a shitty tank. Why? First, it's turretless. This means that you must be pointed directly at your target. A Harasser flanks you during an armor battle? Either you can't shoot it while it shoots into your side and rear, or you turn to shoot it and give your side and rear to the enemy tanks. You can't effectively fire on the move unless you're going straight for the enemy. You don't get your factional advantage at all; VS tank shells still have plenty of drop. Your gun is mounted on the bottom of your tank. That means that a Magrider driver has to expose their entire vehicle to take a shot, and any irregularities in the terrain or obstacles can prevent you from firing. Going hull-down is impossible.

In short, the Magrider is essentially a tank destroyer with none of the advantages thereof. No stronger frontal armor, no stronger gun, no ability to hide more effectively. It had two things going for it: strafing and the Magboost. Strafing is still there. Specifically, ADADAD strafing where you move perpendicular to a target you're facing. In that respect it's better, since you have better control and don't have to turn side-on to do it.

Magboost, though, that was what really made the Magrider good. The big weakness of the Magrider is that it can only be effective either in great numbers or operating in choke points, but the same reasons for that also meant that it was shit at pushing through enemy lines and flanking. The Magboost made flanking not only possible but easy, even in really rough terrain. The south-east of Indar was prime Magrider territory for a reason: you used to be able to boost straight up a lot of those cliffs and get around to the side or rear of an entrenched enemy while other Magriders held the choke point. It also reduced the danger in crossing open ground by allowing to to cross it faster.

But people cried and it was nerfed into uselessness. Now we have shitty tanks that can't do anything better than their counterparts. Oh, except for one thing: the hovering means that you can drive over friendly vehicles in traffic jams! Boy, that sure does make up for everything else!

--

When I started playing my NC toon I had some trouble because of the recoil. Once I got used to it, I started to like how easy it was to kill people with a couple good shots. I fell in love with the Vanguard, a proper (high-performing) MBT. When I started playing TR my first life with totally default kit sent me on a higher killing streak than I'd had for weeks on VS or NC. And it never changed.

That's the tl;dr of PS2 factions. You play VS if you're a masochist who likes spandex and weird-looking vehicles and can handle having the shittiest version of everything. You play NC if you're a good tech player who can control their weapons since they reward good play the most (or just a dedicated tanker, because in that field VS sucks and TR is a niche gimmick). You play TR if you're a CoD player who wants to be able to kill three people in as many seconds by holding M1 and looking in their general direction. I'm not even kidding. My TR toon is what I go on to relax and have fun when I'm getting stressed playing VS or NC, because it's markedly easier to do well.

My feelings about the ESFs are this: Reaver = lol no fuck that I'm getting in a tank; Scythe: So fun to fly but god damn do I die a lot if there's AA around; Mossie = D.Va.exe
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Kanil

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Re: Planetside 2: Free-to-Play MMOFPS. 2000 players/server.
« Reply #12155 on: July 24, 2016, 10:28:08 am »

Ah, TR and their "niche gimmick" tank that's outperformed every other tank literally forever. Those poor, poor, poor TR tankers.
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Yah, it sounds like minecraft with content, you have obviously missed the point, people dont like content, they like different coloured blocks.
Seems to work fine with my copy. As soon as I loaded the human caravan came by and the world burst into fire.

darkrider2

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Re: Planetside 2: Free-to-Play MMOFPS. 2000 players/server.
« Reply #12156 on: July 24, 2016, 02:50:24 pm »

Ah, TR and their "niche gimmick" tank that's outperformed every other tank literally forever. Those poor, poor, poor TR tankers.

I'm pretty sure their tank just had boosted stats 'cause it was the best weapon for sitting around and harvesting infantry off the sides of towers. Crossroads watchtower... that one spot where you could shoot into the biolab with your tank... other camping spots. The prowler anchor mode nerf happened so long ago I can barely remember the time they had a decent gimmick on their tank.

As it stands now the prowler is utter trash compared to the vanguard.

The prowlers damage is split between two shells, great for correcting your shot on an aircraft or double shelling infantry to oblivian, but vs other tanks it's completely awful. Turret aim isn't stabalized in planetside so you can't just fire on the move unless you're on totally flat terrain, you'll miss one of two shots probably due to hitting the tiniest little pebble on the road. The vanguard can go full speed and hit it's shot by just clicking when their target crosses the crosshair. The prowler has to maintain aim on the move, good, luck. Going anchor mode is a death sentence vs other tanks so don't bother, it used to be good when TR could anchor on a mountain ten miles away and shell you forever, but the nerf killed it.

Not to mention it's got a wider body, there are places in tech plants (and staircases everywhere else) I can maneuver a vanguard that the prowler just can't go.

I have a TR and NC character, 1200+ hours in planetside, and have played both tanks.
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Egan_BW

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Re: Planetside 2: Free-to-Play MMOFPS. 2000 players/server.
« Reply #12157 on: July 24, 2016, 02:58:11 pm »

everyone but me is op
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beorn080

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Re: Planetside 2: Free-to-Play MMOFPS. 2000 players/server.
« Reply #12158 on: July 24, 2016, 03:27:45 pm »

The other magrider advantage was it had the best AI gun of all the tanks. Its still good, but it really did get needed down. I remember that unnerfed version fondly, as it slaughtered anyone that went in front of it.
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miauw62

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Re: Planetside 2: Free-to-Play MMOFPS. 2000 players/server.
« Reply #12159 on: July 24, 2016, 03:30:07 pm »

The problem with prowler lockdown is that it's mostly just good for farming.

That's probably the reason I'm always hesitant to play PS2 because it usually ends with me feeling like I'm being farmed, or just there so some BR120 can enjoy the game.
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JimboM12

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Re: Planetside 2: Free-to-Play MMOFPS. 2000 players/server.
« Reply #12160 on: July 24, 2016, 03:40:19 pm »

I may reinstall PS2 because of these discussions, but Overwatch has my nads in a very sturdy grip right now.

I was a vanu player, but as has been discussed, i found most of my guns kinda being ehhh. My primary class and weapon was being a medic with the summer rewards platinum NS11. I loved having my pimp maxed out medigun, rezzes were so fast and could be done from quite a range and the NS11 was just a solid all around performer with the foregrip (if i remember right, the NS had horizontal recoil mostly, which the foregrip was good for) and the soft point rounds.
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Reudh

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Re: Planetside 2: Free-to-Play MMOFPS. 2000 players/server.
« Reply #12161 on: July 24, 2016, 03:50:30 pm »

The problem with prowler lockdown is that it's mostly just good for farming.

That's probably the reason I'm always hesitant to play PS2 because it usually ends with me feeling like I'm being farmed, or just there so some BR120 can enjoy the game.

That was far and away the biggest gripe I had. Without fail, the highest BR have soft point ammunition and numerous other certed items that take fucking forever to grind for, so you die in an encounter 1v1 if you both start firing at the same time.

Flying Dice

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Re: Planetside 2: Free-to-Play MMOFPS. 2000 players/server.
« Reply #12162 on: July 24, 2016, 05:46:57 pm »

I may reinstall PS2 because of these discussions, but Overwatch has my nads in a very sturdy grip right now.

I was a vanu player, but as has been discussed, i found most of my guns kinda being ehhh. My primary class and weapon was being a medic with the summer rewards platinum NS11. I loved having my pimp maxed out medigun, rezzes were so fast and could be done from quite a range and the NS11 was just a solid all around performer with the foregrip (if i remember right, the NS had horizontal recoil mostly, which the foregrip was good for) and the soft point rounds.
I was the same way, the NS-11 outperformed all the VS guns the medic could use by a long shot. Great weapon.

Ah, TR and their "niche gimmick" tank that's outperformed every other tank literally forever. Those poor, poor, poor TR tankers.
Lol, no. It is and always has been a niche gimmick tank, and that niche gimmick is sitting off in the distance farming certs without even pretending to contribute to objective play. Any half-competent Vanguard drive can wreck a Prowler, and it only outperforms the Magrider because the Magrider is a steaming pile of shit in any fight that doesn't conform to its extremely narrow strengths.

Take the niche Lightning guns. I've killed a few Prowlers from full health with the (now useless) HE Lightning, and more than that with the Skyguard. I don't think I've ever even managed to even steal a kill on a Vanguard like that.
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Kanil

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Re: Planetside 2: Free-to-Play MMOFPS. 2000 players/server.
« Reply #12163 on: July 25, 2016, 12:49:15 am »

I find all-conquering DPS to be pretty appropriate for a wide variety of ranges and situations, but maybe that's just me.

Also, if you're killing Prowlers 1v1 with a Lightning, then those Prowlers are driven by bad players. If your Lightning isn't using AP and is killing Prowlers 1v1, then those Prowlers are driven by incomprehensibly bad players.
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Yah, it sounds like minecraft with content, you have obviously missed the point, people dont like content, they like different coloured blocks.
Seems to work fine with my copy. As soon as I loaded the human caravan came by and the world burst into fire.

Akura

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Re: Planetside 2: Free-to-Play MMOFPS. 2000 players/server.
« Reply #12164 on: July 27, 2016, 12:28:31 pm »

I really want to scream at my own faction right now.

Found not one, but two NC HIVEs deep within our territory on a mostly TR dominated Hossin(that's me, TR). When I noticed them, I jumped back to Warpgate(the closest spawn - yes, that close), joined an armor group trying to attack, only to find the position literally unassailable from the ground, either in vehicles or on foot, and covered in shields. Thinking of the possibility they might have been hacking somehow, I anyways took a Flash around trying to find a way in. Found a way into a canyon network at the far west side of Zots North Garden - and immediately found the first HIVE undefended, so I destroyed it. Eventually found the other base, behind layers and layers of defenses. First was an energy gate blocking vehicles, covered by AT turrets. Nobody was around, so I hopped over the gate(I later discovered this was unnecessary as these gates allow infantry), dropped some mines on the modules powering it, and blew them up. Managed to work my way into the main canyon where the HIVE was, only to run into about a dozen Xiphos turrets with automation modules.

Respawned, pulled a Sunderer, some guy jumped in, and we drove right back in. Had to deal with another defense - a Valkyrie flying around, spotting anyone entering. Couldn't shoot it down, but pushed it off enough to penetrate the base. Good thing the auto-Xiphos turrets don't attack vehicles. Managed to kill a few modules and their Sunderer before they swarmed us.

Spawned another Sunderer, and as I was making my way back, I ran into(almost literally, since I tried to ram the bastard) an NC Sunderer heading for the base. Couldn't kill it since the 60mm grenade launcher is absolute garbage. Reaching the (still disabled) canyon gate, I'm swarmed by guys raining smoke grenades on me, and eventually killed by a fairy. I ragequit at that point - as far as I know as of this writing it's still there.


The reason I want to scream at my faction? I did most of that all by myself save for that random guy I picked up(who wasn't useless). My entire faction allowed two enemy bases inside its territory, allowed several enemy vehicles to traverse the entirety of the continent, and basically just kept smacking their head against an impenetrable barrier because they either just wanted to farm or are two stupid to figure out anything more than "CHARGE!".
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