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Total Members Voted: 0

Voting closed: April 07, 2013, 10:34:35 am

[Tavik Toth]

Once given tokens or not, go to VR. List all programs available.

[GreatWyrmGold]

((This would be the place where I'd rant about Titans being big wastes of resources and inefficient and that big superweapons are ridiculous, while giving examples from history (mostly WWII Germany's attempts at those) and blablabla. Luckily, Fun > Realism in games.))

((The Soviets had some great giant superweapons, too.))

[Lenglon]

Do point out mistakes or if i forgot anything. If you think you deserve more tokens, do speak up, but know that this arrangement uses up all of the fund. So if you want more tokens, also point out who should get less, cause I can't conjure tokens out of thin air to add to the budget.

((so... Steve is paying bonuses and you're paying bonuses to the same people for the same reasons, is that correct? meaning some people (Astra for example, who stayed at her post and did her job as part of the defense team, leading to her having no adventures to show off.) get a total of zero tokens for the entire mission and others (simus) who were idle half the time and had their objectives handed to them on a multiple-choice platter get 6 or so? I object to that logic strongly.))

((I also don't understand the logic behind Grate being paid an extra token. his only noteworthy action was ignoring objectives at mission start (go down to the planet and pick up gerbil-bugs!) and getting himself killed unproductively (charge the amp specialist armed only with a laser rifle and no con skill at all!) when objectives changed to search and destroy. Feyri did more than that (corpse delivery service, cameraed the ships other than the sword and blackship so we'd know if they were broken into), and is getting zero tokens from anyone at all including steve. are we really paying people for getting themselves killed? Astra wasn't noteworthy for her successes, but she was reliable and actively defended the sword for an extended period, and she's on the zero token list.

It looks like you're paying people based on how noticeable their actions were, not on what their actions were or how trustworthy or reliable they were. are you really sure that's how you want to decide who gets the high-power equipment and who doesn't? whoever is the best at grandstanding gets the biggest guns?))

((sorry, but you knew this was coming, figured I'd get it out of the way now.))

[Parisbre56]

Assume Flint returns to the Sword sometime in the future when he stops being depressed, returns the shield, cameras and grenades for 4 tokens and gives them to Miyamoto. He will then tell Steve to give him however many tokens he deems appropriate.

[GreatWyrmGold]

Do point out mistakes or if i forgot anything. If you think you deserve more tokens, do speak up, but know that this arrangement uses up all of the fund. So if you want more tokens, also point out who should get less, cause I can't conjure tokens out of thin air to add to the budget.

((so... Steve is paying bonuses and you're paying bonuses to the same people for the same reasons, is that correct? meaning some people (Astra for example, who stayed at her post and did her job as part of the defense team, leading to her having no adventures to show off.) get a total of zero tokens for the entire mission and others (simus) who were idle half the time and had their objectives handed to them on a multiple-choice platter get 6 or so? I object to that logic strongly.))
((I also don't understand the logic behind Grate being paid an extra token. his only noteworthy action was ignoring objectives at mission start (go down to the planet and pick up gerbil-bugs!) and getting himself killed unproductively (charge the amp specialist armed only with a laser rifle and no con skill at all!) when objectives changed to search and destroy. Feyri did more than that (corpse delivery service, cameraed the ships other than the sword and blackship so we'd know if they were broken into), and is getting zero tokens from anyone at all including steve. are we really paying people for getting themselves killed? Astra wasn't noteworthy for her successes, but she was reliable and actively defended the sword for an extended period, and she's on the zero token list.
It looks like you're paying people based on how noticeable their actions were, not on what their actions were or how trustworthy or reliable they were. are you really sure that's how you want to decide who gets the high-power equipment and who doesn't? whoever is the best at grandstanding gets the biggest guns?))
((sorry, but you knew this was coming, figured I'd get it out of the way now.))

((I've got to agree with this logic. Even though it means I get less tokens.))

[Devastator]

"Well, I'd split mine with you, Gorat, but one token does not divide.."

[Harry Baldman]

Do point out mistakes or if i forgot anything. If you think you deserve more tokens, do speak up, but know that this arrangement uses up all of the fund. So if you want more tokens, also point out who should get less, cause I can't conjure tokens out of thin air to add to the budget.

((so... Steve is paying bonuses and you're paying bonuses to the same people for the same reasons, is that correct? meaning some people (Astra for example, who stayed at her post and did her job as part of the defense team, leading to her having no adventures to show off.) get a total of zero tokens for the entire mission and others (simus) who were idle half the time and had their objectives handed to them on a multiple-choice platter get 6 or so? I object to that logic strongly.))

((I also don't understand the logic behind Grate being paid an extra token. his only noteworthy action was ignoring objectives at mission start (go down to the planet and pick up gerbil-bugs!) and getting himself killed unproductively (charge the amp specialist armed only with a laser rifle and no con skill at all!) when objectives changed to search and destroy. Feyri did more than that (corpse delivery service, cameraed the ships other than the sword and blackship so we'd know if they were broken into), and is getting zero tokens from anyone at all including steve. are we really paying people for getting themselves killed? Astra wasn't noteworthy for her successes, but she was reliable and actively defended the sword for an extended period, and she's on the zero token list.

It looks like you're paying people based on how noticeable their actions were, not on what their actions were or how trustworthy or reliable they were. are you really sure that's how you want to decide who gets the high-power equipment and who doesn't? whoever is the best at grandstanding gets the biggest guns?))

((sorry, but you knew this was coming, figured I'd get it out of the way now.))

((I somewhat understand Grate getting paid, considering that he got marginalized, then killed because he didn't have any good equipment to work with, though running at the amp specialist and hoping for a miracle wasn't the best thought-out strategy, naturally. Feyri, though, really doesn't need the tokens, as she has a full set of whatever tools she needs, and whatever extra tools she needs for the next mission she can get from the team token fund.

EDIT: You might have a stronger case against Jhoseph, though - he got paid two tokens total for purely metagame reasons, though the circumstances, depending on your point of view, may prove mitigating.

Also, I think Astra also went comatose somewhere along the way. Did she actually do anything?

Finally, I had a thought - does Grate still have all his equipment in usable shape? He wasn't harmed through quantum shenanigans, and he even has a duplicate. Does the duplicate have the same equipment as well? Or is all the stuff just crushed into pieces?))

[SeriousConcentrate]

(Yeah, wolfchild disappeared. :\ Also, I have a different complaint. Radio keeps saying I took 15 for an Uncon Decomp. I'm pretty sure I took 10 for an Exo Decomp, because I had a few tokens of my own and traded in the second best decomp for the best one. That, and I don't need Uncon. I don't use Uncon. )

[Pancaek]

(I'll use the 5 from the trade in and the rest from the budget. That leaves me with three and the budget with fifteen.)

After getting the decompensator replaced, Jim gathered up his team. "OK, we have fifteen tokens left. Does anyone need anything?"

((It was an exotic one, but the 15 tokens bit is right it seems))

[Parisbre56]

((Perfect decompensators cost 20. I think Jim only had 5 when he bought it.

EDIT: Oh, wait, Pancaek posted it already, I'm blind.))

[BFEL]

((Just gonna say again how ridiculous not having the standard 5 tokens is. Seriously, us newbies who can't reliably do anything without permadeath are getting 1 or 2 tokens per mission, while vets are getting big bonuses on top of their head start. I feel like I'm falling further and further behind just because I didn't jump into the game the moment I joined Bay12.))

[SeriousConcentrate]

(Ah, OK. I thought I had used those three and gotten seven from the trade-in. My mistake.

@BFEL: TBH I don't really like this new mission budget system either, but people had to complain the previous system of 5 per mission didn't make any sense with the shift in what kind of work the HMRC was doing...)

[Harry Baldman]

((Just gonna say again how ridiculous not having the standard 5 tokens is. Seriously, us newbies who can't reliably do anything without permadeath are getting 1 or 2 tokens per mission, while vets are getting big bonuses on top of their head start. I feel like I'm falling further and further behind just because I didn't jump into the game the moment I joined Bay12.))

((This is the debut of the budget system, so there are obviously problems - fortunately, many of these problems are likely to get resolved in future missions due to several factors:

1) There's going to be less people going on them (probably less people going on them and not doing anything as well), so more tokens to go around in the debriefing, presumably.
2) You can, once again, get stuff before a mission by dipping into the team token fund if you feel you really need it. Like highly expensive, yet also crucial equipment like a decompensator. That's the perk that makes the budget system worthwhile, even if it does occasionally cause you to get fewer tokens at mission's end.))

[BFEL]

(Ah, OK. I thought I had used those three and gotten seven from the trade-in. My mistake.

@BFEL: TBH I don't really like this new mission budget system either, but people had to complain the previous system of 5 per mission didn't make any sense with the shift in what kind of work the HMRC was doing...)

((Titan robots that are entirely too big to be effective don't make sense, but they are tolerated because FUN. Mission salary should be tolerated for similar reasons.))

[SeriousConcentrate]

(@Harry: Ah, but I could've afforded one after the mission with the old system, provided somebody would lend me the tokens - and frankly they ought to, as I lend tokens out all the time and could've called some people on it. Also, the perfect decomp didn't matter in this mission as it got overridden at the last moment and the 2/3rd one would have sufficed for the rest of the mission. It will matter later, I'm sure, but the point stands that I could have gotten one now without much of a change from having gotten it before the mission.)