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[Tylermon]

I didnt know what else to name the title but tutorial isnt the word I'm looking for.

I feel part of a majority of people that try the game get overwhelmed if not by the visuals, then by the sheer size of the menu's.

My solution is not to write up and create tutorials(although that would be the most user friendly way. Simply more time consuming) rather create a mode that unlocks menu's as one plays the game.

This could be time based, or based on if the user attempts to use said options in menu, and of course THIS MODE WOULD BE OPTIONAL.

For instance lets say that all that is at first available is the designations menu with some-or all sub menu's. This would force players to experiment with those controls, creating less chaos to get confused by. After either the user performs some action with the menu or a certain amount of game time goes by a new menu would be revealed allowing further exploration at a less menacing pace.
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Another suggestion would be to add tooltips/small descriptions to what the function of a certain task is. While most are straight forward small pieces of information detailing how things are related to one another can be very useful and welcoming to new players.
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Yes everyone could use the wiki, search bazillions of youtube videos, lurk in the forums and the like. But unless someone is very dedicated to learning the game, they wont go through all that effort and are truly missing out.
The game is not impossible to learn as it is--however it is more difficult to learn than it should be/actually is.

[NW_Kohaku]

Actually, I was going to get around to writing something like this eventually, but basically...

I think that the best sort of tutorial is basically something like the Arena - you can create any sort of creature you want, and test whatever you want until you start figuring out how everything works.

We just need to have arena mode types of things for all the different functions of the game.  So, we can train a bunch of things for Adventurer Mode in Arena, but if we could have a total sandbox debug mode for Fortress Mode.

One mode might be a way to train for how to run a hospital, and have just hospital-related stuff active and capable of being made, and you could instantly create dwarves with specified kinds of wounds to be treated. 

Or you could have a military training mode where you have a training room and a bunch of monsters on the other end of a floodgate with a lever, and you have to learn how to train your soldiers and then throw the switch and see if you trained them enough to kill whatever monsters there were.

That way you could learn by experimenting in a consequence-free environment.

[GreatWyrmGold]

OP: Hm, yes, to make the game easier to understand we should prevent new players trying out the "Tutorial Mode" or whatever from using most of the menu options, which really kind of all rely on each other to some extent!

HW_Kohaku: A much better idea, IMHO. Probably this new debuggy-fort-thing would have some options like in the arena--e.g, spawn ceatures, spawn liquid, and so forth--but I can't think of much else to say.

One idea I have is to include a save with a semi-mature fortress of some design or another in the .zip which is downloaded for the game...does that idea make sense to anyone else? This would also have a bunch of 'N'otes that eplain what various stuff is. Ideally, this would be in a nice, easy biome, with access to all other civs, a cavern breeched, and nothing major boing on, probably just after the dwarven traders leave on the second or third year. This would give newbs an idea of how to make a decent fortress.

[NW_Kohaku]

Well, if we are talking about a hospital testing mode, you might have just an open area with one floor and no particular surprises.  (Unless you wanted to try an "outbreak" scenario where dwarves were spreading contagions around...)

You could just have a method to spawn in a basic set of supplies and designate a hospital zone and some workshops that only produce hospital-specific supplies.  The raw materials might just start out on the floor with the option to spawn more. 

Then, you could have some set of dwarves you could select to be the doctors and nurses, and some to be supply-makers or just run back and forth flipping levers or hauling back and forth between stockpiles that are designated to accept goods from each other in an endless loop or something, and you have to pick the best doctors from among them.  (So you have to avoid the guy who hates helping people for being a nurse, for example.)

Then, you can spawn in sick dwarves.  Test out syndromes, and how medical dwarves deal with them.

The important part of the tutorial mode is that the parts of the game that aren't related to illness or injury are locked out, as Tylermon was talking about.  You can just dink around as much as you want until you learn the system, and even advanced players would probably enjoy playing tests with syndromes they create.

[GreatWyrmGold]

I thought thst this was talking about a more generalised tutorial, which strikes me as being simpler (probably) and more useful.

[NW_Kohaku]

Simpler for Toady, but not for the player. 

Having tutorial modes for each major parcel of the game is a great help to the player. 

A military tutorial wouldn't be too hard to do - just set up arena mode ability to spawn creatures with the ability to spawn gear into stockpiles as well as just on top of creatures, with the fortress mode interface that you can switch to.  Only military functions enabled, excepting some things like weaponsmithing. 

Of course, combining hospital and military together might have some benefits, as well, at least, once the two are more directly interconnected.

[NTJedi]

I was thinking a good tutorial would have an entire fort all constructed with all buildings constructed and with a small equipped military, with a small stash of food.  New players could then learn the simple basics such as creating jobs, mining, building and moving military.  As time passes they could learn how each of the workshops, forges and buildings work while dealing with supply/demand of resources and food management.  They could even survive a few ambushes and goblin sieges so they understand what to expect.   

[Supersnes]

I was thinking a good tutorial would have an entire fort all constructed with all buildings constructed and with a small equipped military, with a small stash of food.  New players could then learn the simple basics such as creating jobs, mining, building and moving military.  As time passes they could learn how each of the workshops, forges and buildings work while dealing with supply/demand of resources and food management.  They could even survive a few ambushes and goblin sieges so they understand what to expect.   

When ready they could then embark from said fort and begin a new one from scratch.  This could be a effective way to allow noobs to flow into the gameplay. Hmmm... but again DF's FUN comes from its excessively high learning curve so it should be optional, but new players will likely accept the help.

[Jeoshua]

The Arena Mode Tutorial is interesting.  Basically add the ability to load multiple "levels" then give the player the option of selecting one of them.  Load it up, and it contains all the set pieces that you'd need to test out things of that type.  Give the option of taking control of a single entity or zoom out to something more like fortress mode.

And let the SCIENCE!! ensue.

Seriously, nobody thought of the applications of Dwarven Science here?  It would be way easier to load up the "Minecart" level than it would to build a whole fortress up to the specific level of minecarts, when testing them.  Right?

Plus, once implemented it gives Toady an easier time debugging things in the long run, too!  Just load up the "level" of whatever he's working on and viola!

[NW_Kohaku]

Yes, the arena is something Toady invented for his own testing and debugging, and yet it has become an instrumental tool for modders and Dwarf Science (!!optional!!) because it gives you the chance to really play around with all the building blocks in whatever arrangement you desire to get a better understanding of how the game actually works.

Just swapping around some of those parts to let you play with the basics of how you build a fortress is enough to give people most of the tools to understand how to scale that cliff at their own pace.

You really only need a few, anyway.  Hospital, military, wood and farm and still (I.E. making beds and barrels of food and booze), and maybe mining and fluids.  Those are the major things to learn.

[Tylermon]

I completely understand how all the menu's build from one another. That is why they unlock as you have explored/tried using other menu's. That way the player can go"

 hey...I just did something over here...and now I have more options that I can play around with! Ohh wait?! They work together! Now lets see what they do...hmmmm.

But I really like the idea of a sandbox/arena mode. However that still creates the issue of there being many menu's that overwhelm new players.



I got this idea because I decided to start playing the first released version of DF and work my way up from there. It has made learning so much easier and fun because I start with less and get progressively more options to play with as I move towards newer releases. I must say that the 2D versions may be my favorite at this point.