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Author Topic: Roguelike Mafia 4 - Haste makes waste. [Game over!]  (Read 108788 times)

Urist Imiknorris

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Re: Roguelike Mafia 4 - Same Shit, Different Day [Day 5]
« Reply #315 on: May 12, 2012, 02:57:51 pm »

Because I was still running under the assumption that there was one scum left. If I had rethought that assumption sooner, I'd have used it on Shakerag.

And my suspicions are as such: If there's one scum left, it's Book. If there are two, they're Book and Jack.
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Quote from: LordSlowpoke
I don't know how it works. It does.
Quote from: Jim Groovester
YOU CANT NOT HAVE SUSPECTS IN A GAME OF MAFIA

ITS THE WHOLE POINT OF THE GAME
Quote from: Cheeetar
If Tiruin redirected the lynch, then this means that, and... the Illuminati! Of course!

Bookthras

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Re: Roguelike Mafia 4 - Same Shit, Different Day [Day 5]
« Reply #316 on: May 12, 2012, 04:54:56 pm »

Solo Mafia is a serial killer, Book. Tiruin was not a serial killer. The Mafia alignment by its very nature strongly implies multiple members.
Hmm. True enough, though nothing technically prevents it. But still, multiple scum teams all can have "Mafia" alignment without being a team, or some other oddity may be at play here.

It's interesting how your main focus is third parties, even at the expense of finding the other mafioso/i.
That's mainly because it seemed pretty clear Native was it. Once he flipped scum we probably would have had an indication of whether there were more left, or the game would have been over, or that only 3rd parties remained the problem. Since he didn't flip town, the assumptions must be questioned.


Let's do some process of elimination: I am town.
How convincing. You're asking us to take your word for it.

Shakerag was targeted by the scum kill. (although I love how you're calling him scum despite that)
Hapah protected Shakerag from the scum kill.
Shake was protected from Tiruin's kill, yes. That doesn't make him town, though, he can be scum of a different colour (rival mafia team, or 3rd party). I am calling him scummy (but explicitly "not Tiruin's buddy"; so don't put words in my mouth) because he has acted scummy, but I don't know which flavour of scum he could be.

I highly doubt Jack would be so stupid as to risk death when his only scumbuddy's lynch was inevitable,
I also have trouble with this assumption. We only have his word the protection on him triggered due to his own action. This may be the case, or it may have been some other kill attempt. For purposes of speculation, say he was on a different scum team, he attempted to kill, but was redirected to himself, triggering the protection. There are other possible scenarios that could also account for it.

Here's another one: there's no evidence you actually protected him and the protection triggered. Again, we only have your/his word for it. If you two are a team, of any flavour, all these inconsistencies go away.


But I find it interesting how you immediately take him at his word about the scroll of Danger thing and ask us to do the same. One more interesting interaction between you two.


As for a false flip, I highly doubt that would happen.
Yeah, it's unlikely enough. But still worth asking the question. As I said, Native was definitely scummy enough and very likely to be Tiruin's buddy, so the assumptions must be questioned and revisited. Including the assumption of what happened between you and Jack N2, or that we should take you at your word when you recount these or say "I'm town, therefore you're scum".
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No one ever listens to Zathras, no. Quite mad, they say.  |  That ain't a shepherd.

Zathras hefts the corpse-of-webadict puppet and works its mouth: "I declare world peace! Yay! All hail Zathras!"
Everyone is handsomely rewarded, and lives happily ever after.  Except for Bookthras, who dies of poison in the night.

Urist Imiknorris

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Re: Roguelike Mafia 4 - Same Shit, Different Day [Day 5]
« Reply #317 on: May 12, 2012, 05:53:45 pm »

Quote
But still, multiple scum teams all can have "Mafia" alignment without being a team, or some other oddity may be at play here.
True. But, a single mafioso does not a mafia make. Tiruin has a scumbuddy, maybe two, and you appear to have no interest in trying to find him/them. Your goal seems to be rooting out third parties and maybe a second scumteam. Do you know what selective scumhunting is?

Quote
That's mainly because it seemed pretty clear Native was it. Once he flipped scum we probably would have had an indication of whether there were more left, or the game would have been over, or that only 3rd parties remained the problem. Since he didn't flip town, the assumptions must be questioned.
I assume you made a derp?

Quote
How convincing. You're asking us to take your word for it.
Feel free to question it. Replace with "Not Tiruin's scumbuddy" if you'd like, as that's the point I'm making.

Quote
I also have trouble with this assumption. We only have his word the protection on him triggered due to his own action. This may be the case, or it may have been some other kill attempt. For purposes of speculation, say he was on a different scum team, he attempted to kill, but was redirected to himself, triggering the protection. There are other possible scenarios that could also account for it.
If the kill attempt on Jack was the result of another's action, why would said other person not claim it? If town, it would be proof of lying scum. If rival scum, it would be a free lynch. The only person with no incentive to out a lying liar who lies would be a third-party who wants said liar to win, and Mr. Dwarfinton was already dead.

Quote
Here's another one: there's no evidence you actually protected him and the protection triggered. Again, we only have your/his word for it. If you two are a team, of any flavour, all these inconsistencies go away.
Ah, I see. How likely do you think that the scenario of the (only) scumteam being me, Jack, and Tiruin is, and why? Also, there is: Jack confirmed the protection flavor.

Quote
But I find it interesting how you immediately take him at his word about the scroll of Danger thing and ask us to do the same. One more interesting interaction between you two.
See previous point re: Danger scroll fakeclaim.

In addition, what did you do last night?

Jack: What was the flavor for your scroll of danger's kill attempt?
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Quote from: LordSlowpoke
I don't know how it works. It does.
Quote from: Jim Groovester
YOU CANT NOT HAVE SUSPECTS IN A GAME OF MAFIA

ITS THE WHOLE POINT OF THE GAME
Quote from: Cheeetar
If Tiruin redirected the lynch, then this means that, and... the Illuminati! Of course!

Toaster

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Re: Roguelike Mafia 4 - Same Shit, Different Day [Day 5]
« Reply #318 on: May 12, 2012, 10:01:28 pm »

Vote Count:

Jack A T:   Bookthras,
Bookthras:  Urist Imiknorris,
Shakerag:
Urist Imiknorris:
Hapah: 

Not Voting:  Jack A T, Shakerag, Hapah

Day 5 will last until Wednesday, 5/16 at 11 PM EST.


Mod: Are false role/alignment flips possible in any capacity in this game?

No.
Logged
HMR stands for Hazardous Materials Requisition, not Horrible Massive Ruination, though I can understand how one could get confused.
God help us if we have to agree on pizza toppings at some point. There will be no survivors.

Urist Imiknorris

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Re: Roguelike Mafia 4 - Same Shit, Different Day [Day 5]
« Reply #319 on: May 12, 2012, 10:14:31 pm »

Mod: Would it be possible for the game to start with a one-man mafia? (specifically mafia, serial killers don't count)
Logged
Quote from: LordSlowpoke
I don't know how it works. It does.
Quote from: Jim Groovester
YOU CANT NOT HAVE SUSPECTS IN A GAME OF MAFIA

ITS THE WHOLE POINT OF THE GAME
Quote from: Cheeetar
If Tiruin redirected the lynch, then this means that, and... the Illuminati! Of course!

Jack A T

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Re: Roguelike Mafia 4 - Same Shit, Different Day [Day 5]
« Reply #320 on: May 13, 2012, 12:57:15 am »

If there are three scum it's LyLo. My recommendation: Full claims from everyone. Role, alignment, actions performed, other actions known, inventory (including how and when each item was acquired). Posted it already? Too bad, post it again.

Works for me.

I am a town paladin (via random).

D1 I had a Scroll of Inspection (via class) and my Scroll of Danger (via random).  I received a Scroll of the Clear Mind from questing.
N1 I tried to inspect Mr. D.  I was redirected to Urist Imiknorris, who showed up as town.
D2 I received a Scroll of Enchant Armor through questing.
N2 I used my Scroll of Danger, triggering a self-kill.  I was protected.
D3 I received a Staff of Tracking through questing.
N3 I tracked NativeForeigner, who went nowhere.
D4 I received a Scroll of Hallucination through questing.
N4 I used my enchant armor scroll on Imiknorris.  I saw him as the most likely kill target for a scum Bookthras, as the player least likely to go along with his arguments outside of me.

Jack: why have you failed to answer my questions?
Book: Because I wasn't on to respond to them.

To summarize: Bookthras's case is built on garbage, was built on garbage, and I still don't know what he was trying to say with it.  Also, I apparently don't focus nearly enough on possible threats that may or may not exist, instead of focusing on the mafiateam.

Just to make things rather clear for our good friend Bookthras:
Toaster: Is it possible for a Brother to be the brother of a townie?  If a Brother is in a given game, will the player it is tied to be selected randomly?

Finally...
Also, there is: Jack confirmed the protection flavor.
Imiknorris: That...doesn't actually help show I was protected.  It's evidence in favour of the Hapah/Shakerag protect, but not your protect on me.
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Quote from: Pandarsenic, BYOR 6.3 deadchat
FUCK YOU JACK
Quote from: Urist Imiknorris, Witches' Coven 2 Elfchat
YOU TRAITOROUS SWINE.
Screw you, Jack.

Urist Imiknorris

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Re: Roguelike Mafia 4 - Same Shit, Different Day [Day 5]
« Reply #321 on: May 13, 2012, 03:04:34 pm »

Imiknorris: That...doesn't actually help show I was protected.  It's evidence in favour of the Hapah/Shakerag protect, but not your protect on me.
Apparently I have a daily quota of stupid that my brain won't let me not fill.
Logged
Quote from: LordSlowpoke
I don't know how it works. It does.
Quote from: Jim Groovester
YOU CANT NOT HAVE SUSPECTS IN A GAME OF MAFIA

ITS THE WHOLE POINT OF THE GAME
Quote from: Cheeetar
If Tiruin redirected the lynch, then this means that, and... the Illuminati! Of course!

Toaster

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Re: Roguelike Mafia 4 - Same Shit, Different Day [Day 5]
« Reply #322 on: May 13, 2012, 08:54:23 pm »

Vote Count:

Jack A T:   Bookthras
Bookthras:  Urist Imiknorris, Jack A T
Shakerag:
Urist Imiknorris:
Hapah: 

Not Voting:  Shakerag, Hapah

Day 5 will last until Wednesday, 5/16 at 11 PM EST.



Mod: Would it be possible for the game to start with a one-man mafia? (specifically mafia, serial killers don't count)

No.

Toaster: Is it possible for a Brother to be the brother of a townie?  If a Brother is in a given game, will the player it is tied to be selected randomly?

Yes.  Maybe.
Logged
HMR stands for Hazardous Materials Requisition, not Horrible Massive Ruination, though I can understand how one could get confused.
God help us if we have to agree on pizza toppings at some point. There will be no survivors.

Jack A T

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Re: Roguelike Mafia 4 - Same Shit, Different Day [Day 5]
« Reply #323 on: May 13, 2012, 10:45:15 pm »

On a completely different topic, I'm going to be on a band trip to Ottawa for about a week, starting late night on Monday. Posting will be sporadic, and I may end up posting from my phone.
Logged
Quote from: Pandarsenic, BYOR 6.3 deadchat
FUCK YOU JACK
Quote from: Urist Imiknorris, Witches' Coven 2 Elfchat
YOU TRAITOROUS SWINE.
Screw you, Jack.

Hapah

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Re: Roguelike Mafia 4 - Same Shit, Different Day [Day 5]
« Reply #324 on: May 14, 2012, 03:14:29 pm »

Mod: Can Cultists convert Mafia?
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I can't be expected to remember the names of everyone I've tried to stab.

Bored? Go read the EVE Chronicles.

Toaster

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Re: Roguelike Mafia 4 - Same Shit, Different Day [Day 5]
« Reply #325 on: May 14, 2012, 03:19:27 pm »

No.
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HMR stands for Hazardous Materials Requisition, not Horrible Massive Ruination, though I can understand how one could get confused.
God help us if we have to agree on pizza toppings at some point. There will be no survivors.

Shakerag

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Re: Roguelike Mafia 4 - Same Shit, Different Day [Day 5]
« Reply #326 on: May 14, 2012, 03:43:37 pm »

Oh, right, I'm in *two* games right now.  Let's see here.

Bookthras@239:  Re-read forthcoming.  3rd party: Outside of the brother we already had, I have no current reads, feelings, or vibes about another 3rd party.  We've got five of us left, three flipped town, one flipped scum, and one flipped 3rd party.  There's at least one more scum left.  *If* there's another 3rd party, then it would have to be something non-killing.  As far as "brother to a townie" goes, I have had little exposure to that role, so I'm going to say it's possible to be true.  I don't know if the "brother" to the role is picked or randomly assigned, but I don't see why it couldn't be someone who is town either way.


My read on Hapah:  Town, because he protected me when I tracked Tiruin visiting me N2, and no one counterclaimed the protect.  At the very least he couldn't be on the same scumteam as Tiruin, but I'm not feeling that he's 3rd party.

My read on Jack:  Scum, see below.

My read on the game:  Becoming suspicious of UI and Jack as I reread.  If they're both scum, then they could have coordinated faking actions on each other (scroll of danger/protect and scroll of treasure).  UI and Tiruin targeting GG ... maybe UI was assisting?  UI protects Native ... he would know Native isn't going to be targeted with a kill, so no flavor.  Jack IDs UI as town early on. 

Okay, that was a bit of random note taking, but I'll leave it.  Look at UI and Jack's actions.  They can't be independently verified.

UI:
N1: Enchant armor --> GlyphGryph
-He died.  Can't verify. 
N2: Protect --> Jack A T, protection triggered
-Action on scumbuddy, could have been anything.
N3: Protect --> NativeForeigner, protection not triggered
-Knew Native wouldn't be NKed, recipient can't verify if not triggered.
N4: Greater Treasure --> Jack A T, roleblocked, armor enchanted
-Cover story for a blocked NK?  Setting up cover story for Jack later on either way.

Jack:
N1: I tried to inspect Mr. D.  I was redirected to Urist Imiknorris, who showed up as town.
-Setting up scumbuddy as town. 
N2: I used my Scroll of Danger, triggering a self-kill.  I was protected.
-May or may not have happened, can't be verified except by scumbuddy.
N3 I tracked NativeForeigner, who went nowhere.
-Posted after Native said he used a scroll of ninja looting.
N4: I used my enchant armor scroll on Imiknorris. 
-Coverstory for scumbuddy.

That's awfully nice how it all fits together.  All of those night actions and no one outside of you two can verify any of it?  I can't reasonably pass all of that off as coincidence. 


Roleclaim:
Town Warrior (fucking yay -_-) via random
Starting item:  Scroll of Scrying

D1: Scroll of Curse Armor (also fucking yay)
D2: Scroll of Tracking
D3: Scroll of the Clear Mind
D4: Scroll of Paralysis (from public pool)

N1: Scrying on GG, GG went nowhere, UI and Tiruin visit
N2: Tracking on Tiruin, Tiruin visiting me, protected from kill
N3: Clear Mind on UI
N4: Paralysis on UI

Hapah

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Re: Roguelike Mafia 4 - Same Shit, Different Day [Day 5]
« Reply #327 on: May 14, 2012, 04:04:07 pm »

Man, I've gotta say, this game is odd. Do you realize the only NK we had was N1? We went N2, N3, and N4 with no kills. How often does that happen? More importantly, WHY is it happening?

Bookthras and Shakerag, what are your actions? Or at least, your actions last night? We need all the pieces. For my part:

I am a Town Priest.

Starting Items: Wand of Protect

D1: Quest, Amulet of Preservation
N1: No Action (I guess Flandre was MIA)
D2: Pool, Ring of Free Action
N2: Protect, Shakerag (triggered)
D3: Pool, Ring of Resist Poison
N3: Protect, Shakerag (not triggered)
D4: Pool, Oracle Scroll
N4: Oracle Scroll. There is one Artifact in play. Either Book's got it or one of you lot is hanging onto it and not claiming it (which is expected. I probably wouldn't claim an artifact either unless I had a DAMN good reason).

PPE: I had similar thoughts too, Shakerag. I'm waiting for Book's action-claims before I go too far down that road, though.
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I can't be expected to remember the names of everyone I've tried to stab.

Bored? Go read the EVE Chronicles.

Urist Imiknorris

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Re: Roguelike Mafia 4 - Same Shit, Different Day [Day 5]
« Reply #328 on: May 14, 2012, 04:39:58 pm »

Shakerag:

Quote
N4: Greater Treasure --> Jack A T, roleblocked, armor enchanted
-Cover story for a blocked NK?  Setting up cover story for Jack later on either way.
"either way?" As in, if I'm telling the truth, that's a cover story for Jack? How?

Quote
UI and Tiruin targeting GG ... maybe UI was assisting?
How? Give at least one plausible action.

Quote
That's awfully nice how it all fits together.  All of those night actions and no one outside of you two can verify any of it?  I can't reasonably pass all of that off as coincidence.
Native confirmed Jack's N3 result. And tell me: Do those actions make logical sense for two townies with town reads on each other?

Shakerag and Hapah: What are your reads on Bookthras?

Book, what artifact have you managed to get a hold of? Why have you not claimed your action from last night?
Logged
Quote from: LordSlowpoke
I don't know how it works. It does.
Quote from: Jim Groovester
YOU CANT NOT HAVE SUSPECTS IN A GAME OF MAFIA

ITS THE WHOLE POINT OF THE GAME
Quote from: Cheeetar
If Tiruin redirected the lynch, then this means that, and... the Illuminati! Of course!

Hapah

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Re: Roguelike Mafia 4 - Same Shit, Different Day [Day 5]
« Reply #329 on: May 14, 2012, 04:57:40 pm »

Urist: Holding judgment until he posts his actions. Also, there's nothing saying Book has the artifact. He might, but he may not. Could be any of you lot, the way I see it.

Also, for some plausible "assist" actions on GG: Could have been Curse Armor, Wand of Probing, Slowing, Monster Detection, Object Detection...some certainly make more sense than others, but I don't think any are out of the question. I guess it's also possible that you were his killer and Tiruin used the item, but it's a moot point.

I just want Book to claim. Jumping to conclusions with two days still to go seems a bit premature, and a mislynch here is probably the end. Let him speak his piece, and we will go over all the information presented and see what we can come up with.
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I can't be expected to remember the names of everyone I've tried to stab.

Bored? Go read the EVE Chronicles.
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