Jack: Who do you think is 3rd party and why? If you were a survivor, would you claim it at this point? Other than your vote target, who is scum and why? What's your read on Shakerag? If there was a cult, which two people would you think belong to it at this point based on their interactions?
Let's start with the block of questions.
*My focus is on the threat that is known to exist, not on some sort of possible threat that may or may not even exist. I have little reason to believe that any player, at this point, is a third party. Simple as that.
*If I was a survivor, I would have claimed it yesterday.
*The scumteam was two people: Tiruin and you. Simply, Imiknorris, Hapah, and Shakerag have all been ruled out from my perspective, due to saves.
*What's my read on Shakerag? He's not a member of the scumteam. Might be a third party of some sort, but I see that as unlikely. I'm almost certain we don't have any major hazardous third parties at this point (SK, cult): no signs of them, plus balance issues.
*Who would be cult together? Probably Imiknorris and either Shakerag or Hapah: allowing solid connections between each cult member would be a poor idea for a limited cult in the style of RL3, I think.
Now, on to your case against me.
a) "Brother wins if Jack wins" and "Jack is town" means "Brother wins if town wins", which is exactly the same as making him town to begin with. The notion of the 3rd-party being "town-ally" is frankly ludicrous and unbalanced in town's favour. It makes much more sense for him being brother to a different non-town 3rd party.
Ah, I was wondering where the rest of your case was. Your case seemed oddly weak for an experienced player's case in day 4, even for a FoS. However, as Hapah and Imiknorris have pointed out, this point is crap. The fact that I had a brother has absolutely no bearing on my alignment, both because making it impossible for a brother to be a brother to town would imbalance the game badly in town's favour and because a brother just doesn't work like you're saying it does.
By the way, I know you've seemingly abandoned that whole "you had a brother and he claimed and you were still voting for him an hour later and so he died and you didn't react" argument, but I still want to know how exactly it led to the "Are you a Brother?" question. Or, if it wasn't that that led to the question, what did?
and b):
In fact, how does any of that warrant even a FoS? This feels oddly flimsy, especially for this late in the game and from a veteran.
I find your reaction to the question excessive. Really? not even warrant a FoS? Oddly flimsy? Especially from me? Isn't that a bit overdefensive for a freaking FoS?
That was not a rhetorical question. I actually wanted, and still want, to know what there actually warranted even a FoS. Seriously, I spent at least 15 minutes just staring at your FoS in confusion as to what you were trying to say and how any of it was FoS-worthy.
I would like to quickly note that you have admitted that what you posted at that time was based heavily on misremembered information, or, to put it differently, was flimsy. Not that it would have been any better had what you remembered been correct, though. It felt oddly flimsy from a veteran on Day 4, and hey, what do you know...
a) "Brother wins if Jack wins" and "Jack is town" means "Brother wins if town wins", which is exactly the same as making him town to begin with. The notion of the 3rd-party being "town-ally" is frankly ludicrous and unbalanced in town's favour. It makes much more sense for him being brother to a different non-town 3rd party.
...you had something else! Which turned out to be crap.
Plus you immediately point me to look for 3rd parties elsewhere:
Finally, what are your thoughts on Hapah and Shakerag? You're speaking as if you think they could be third parties, but you don't actually seem to be examining that possibility. You're strongly pushing the conversation towards thoughts on Imiknorris and I, while your reasoning for your FoS on me is poor at best.
...and then you fail to follow through; you have not made a single effort to look or even mention 3rd parties, likely happy the topic died out. To answer: Yes, I thought anyone could be a third party, and didn't know whom, but I wasn't about to paint everybody blue (that's the same as pressuring no one, not useful), so I focused on the two scummier ones first. Makes sense, yes?
I care, and cared, far, far more about finding the threats we know exist than finding possible forces that may or may not be threats and may or may not even exist at all. Just like every single other player
except you. Strangely enough, at that point, I was still trying to figure out who among you and Native was a mafioso.
Why did I ask about your views on Shakerag and Hapah? Because your case against me was so utterly horrible, yet I was a major suspect. Clearly you had absolutely nothing on either of them...oh, wait...
But it's true Hapah and Shake may be it. I'm pretty sure they're not Tiruin's buddy, but that doesn't make them town, so they should also be questioned. Hapah I get a pretty strong town read from, but Shake has failed to answer questions and been a bit cagey.
...and then Shakerag becomes one of your top suspects today, for that. Fascinating. It's almost as if you didn't actually examine his activity carefully before my post.
Meanwhile, I'm noticing your attempts to tie Imiknorris and I together as a scumteam (because suspecting someone to be scum for not interacting the right way with someone else you
suspect of being scum
always works out well).
So that's that about Native. But there's something else going on. Experience tells me that with ten players, three scum and a 3rd party is too much, so it makes sense there are only two actual mafia, but then for balance I think there is still a 3rd party out there. For starters, a brother is not a particularly powerful 3rd-party role, so for balance there should be at least one more (6-2-1-1 is a safe bet). We know it's not a killer, as all kills/attempts have been accounted for. It may be something rather innocuous like a second brother or survivor, or something more sinister like a cult. We should not ignore this possibility.
Bookthras: What exactly made you change your opinion on this?
Author
Topic: Roguelike Mafia 4 - Haste makes waste. [Game over!] (Read 107741 times)