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[ToonyMan]

I wouldn't consider Tiruin over-explaining to be anything but a personal tell.  He's like that as town from what I've seen.  It's aggravating but argh whatever.  You just have to look for actual scumslips from other ways they talk.  I don't think he's scum right now because of this.  Phantom of the Library is like this too.

Zombie Urist's reasoning is kind of silly though.  His logic on Flandre doesn't make any sense to me.

I agree with Imiknorris that Flandre is being passive.

This of course strings both of the Urist's together.  I think it's scummy since Flandre isn't being passive at all, which makes this a flat-out lie. 

So right now...Dariush, Darvi (probably just shitty town why did you replace ugh), IronyOwl, and both the Urists I think are being scummy.  NativeForeigner is a nulltell, he acted like Think recently against Tiruin with the "why aren't you pressing me more?".  OrangeBottle is null too I believe (I feel like he's leading Zombie's attack).  If I haven't mentioned anybody else they really aren't leaving an impression on my really, which is bad for them.

Shakerag - ??
Toaster - said he missed the forum this weekend
Powder Miner - ??
Jokerman-EXE - ??

I have very little on these four because they haven't done anything recently (besides the ones I've already mentioned).

[zombie urist]

Flandre:

I scumhunt best once I find something worth mentioning. As for being passive, I did not even think I had time to give that impression.

This is passive. How are you going to find something if you don't scumhunt?

You're confidence seemed rooted in your mafia history here on these boards (all three as scum), and you used RL Mafia as an excuse to pardon yourself. Scapegoat.

I don't think you understand what scapegoating is. I never said that my confidence was based on forum mafia.

Notice that I didn't even say that I suspected you--only that I wasn't convinced. Stronger than a vague statement, and weaker than an FoS. Your answer was fine, and I agree that only time will tell.

Don't know what you mean here.

I can't speak for Think, but I can only guess that he was whining half-sarcastically about not getting acknowledged because he wanted material to pry at. It's interesting, but not malicious.

It's interesting, it's scummy. I never asked for you to try and explain his behavior. The fact that you did anyways is also 'interesting.'

Also I would have pointed this out anyways and Think replacing out was just bad timing.
Lastly why are you FoSing instead of voting?

Zombie Urist's reasoning is kind of silly though.  His logic on Flandre doesn't make any sense to me.

I agree with Imiknorris that Flandre is being passive.

This of course strings both of the Urist's together.  I think it's scummy since Flandre isn't being passive at all, which makes this a flat-out lie. 

Who is this post directed at? My reasoning is Think was scum, Flandre replaced in for Think => Flandre is scum. I say he is passive because he is making an excuse not scumhunting (see above). Earlier he also said that nothing jumped out, but didn't ask anything or comment otherwise, which is also passive behavior.

Toony: what are you going to do about the people with nulltells?

[ToonyMan]

Well, I think it's better to have a reason for voting someone than to just "get it out of the way".

As for nulltells, since I only really have two from active-er people I think it's okay for the game.  I wanted to point it out at least.

[Orangebottle]

Zombie:

In post 2, first he says

How amazing. Almost no one bothered to answer my questions.

Looking back at (1) and the responses in between, only Book didn't answer his question, not 'almost no one.' He also voted for Jokerman twice and missed Jokerman's post.
He asked Shakerag, Tiruin and me to acknowledge his responses. This is scummy because it makes me think he has nothing else to do and is avoiding scumhunting.

So, to clarify, Flandre's scum because Think stopped scumhunting in RVS shortly before he was replaced?

...I agree with Toony, that sounds silly.

I agree with Imiknorris that Flandre is being passive. She has not asked any questions, except the one to me about RL mafia and forum mafia, which is useless to the scumhunt.

Flandre: Top scumpicks please.

That seems to be a very popular question with you. Why are you asking only about her top scumpicks instead of, say, how her questions were relevant to the game at all? Have you ever considered that she might have some logic behind her questions?
Toony:

Well, I think it's better to have a reason for voting someone than to just "get it out of the way".

As for nulltells, since I only really have two from active-er people I think it's okay for the game.  I wanted to point it out at least.

So you don't care that you have a few people that are nulltells? That's alarming. Possibly even scummy. Why don't you take your time between posting your tiny little two/one-line posts and actually, I don't know, ask these people some questions? All I see you doing right now is answering questions and poking lurkers.
Flandre:
Zombie's right. Why aren't you voting?

[zombie urist]

Zombie:

In post 2, first he says

How amazing. Almost no one bothered to answer my questions.

Looking back at (1) and the responses in between, only Book didn't answer his question, not 'almost no one.' He also voted for Jokerman twice and missed Jokerman's post.
He asked Shakerag, Tiruin and me to acknowledge his responses. This is scummy because it makes me think he has nothing else to do and is avoiding scumhunting.

So, to clarify, Flandre's scum because Think stopped scumhunting in RVS shortly before he was replaced?

Flandre's scum because Think is scum. Think is scum because of reasons I've stated earlier. Its not so much that he stopped scumhunting before he was replaced, its just that posting to ask people to acknowledge his responses smells of desperation. Shortly before he was replaced doesn't factor in this at all.

Flandre is also scum because of reasons in my earlier post.

That seems to be a very popular question with you. Why are you asking only about her top scumpicks instead of, say, how her questions were relevant to the game at all? Have you ever considered that she might have some logic behind her questions?

I'm trying to move the game out of RVS. This will force people to put up reasons and justifications.

Well, I think it's better to have a reason for voting someone than to just "get it out of the way".
As for nulltells, since I only really have two from active-er people I think it's okay for the game.  I wanted to point it out at least.

My reason for voting Flandre is because I think she is scum. Are you just going to focus on the people with null tells who aren't active? 

[NativeForeigner]

Follow up on you? Why are you so concerned about that? I am only one of the few who asked you anything, and the only one you question is the one with a vote on you (I admit, I was waiting for Toaster's response and your own to get more information). You aren't participating in the conversations between everyone else and only jump in to ask me that one question.

Why?

I'm not concerned. I just find it odd that you vote me, question me, and then drop it without another word. Why would you do that?

I questioned Toaster, too. Also, why would I participate in a conversation that's not mine? They're not particularly interesting.

[Urist Imiknorris]

Flandre:

Urist Imiknorris:

Why were you hoping for something to complain about? And why are you being so passive?

I scumhunt best once I find something worth mentioning. As for being passive, I did not even think I had time to give that impression.

Fair enough. The passiveness was from me being a derp - for some reason I thought you were Dariush.

Zombie:

I can't speak for Think, but I can only guess that he was whining half-sarcastically about not getting acknowledged because he wanted material to pry at. It's interesting, but not malicious.

It's interesting, it's scummy. I never asked for you to try and explain his behavior. The fact that you did anyways is also 'interesting.'

How is it interesting?

[Darvi]

Internet cut off as I was about to post. Makes contributing a tad difficult.

Anyways, Tiruin is awfully quick to get into arguments with Toony after his button-pushing, and just as quick to stop when it became apparent that it wasn't helping him.

Toony: So, what, no suspicions other than that RV?

[Darvi]

Hey no fair, when did this get a new page?

Darvi: Same question for Bookthras goes for you: If you were a cop-type role, what characteristics or qualities would you judge your target by?

Somebody who I don't have a scum read on, is a good player, but not good enough to be a sure N1-kill. Unless they claimed miller or are a PGO.

[Dariush]

Toony:

Somebody weak in the knees?  Stop being a coward.

Oh, all right. I hoped for a sane explanation from you, but it looks like I set my expectations too high. Your case is bullshit, Toony. Instead of actually scumhunting you prefer to make up shit out of thin air. This doesn't apply exclusively to your case against me, but also against your leading questions during RVS to other people.

So right now...Dariush, Darvi (probably just shitty town why did you replace ugh), IronyOwl, and both the Urists I think are being scummy.  NativeForeigner is a nulltell, he acted like Think recently against Tiruin with the "why aren't you pressing me more?".  OrangeBottle is null too I believe (I feel like he's leading Zombie's attack).  If I haven't mentioned anybody else they really aren't leaving an impression on my really, which is bad for them.

Relevant part bolded. What the fuck, really. Out of 13 players who aren't you you consider 5 scummy, two nulltelling and the rest... scummy because they don't leave an impression on you? Explain that.

UI:

Dariush: Why aren't you questioning people?

I was waiting for a response from Toony.

ZU:

I didn't randomly choose two people to ask that question. My top suspects so far are Flandre (who replaced Think0028) and Powder Miner.

Think0028 for this post in which he calls out Joker for lurking and laments that no one is paying attention to him.

Powder Miner has been rather wishy-washy in his responses in this post. I also don't understand why he's accusing Shakerag of rolefishing.

Those are rather weak grounds for a vote and a FoS. Was that a lynch vote, or a pressure one?

Flandre's scum because Think is scum. Think is scum because of reasons I've stated earlier.

Isn't it too early to call out people for scummitude based on a few phrases of the person they've replaced, ZU?

Tiruin:

Dariush has been online for quite some time, and not giving out anything related to his interrogators.

Just as a note, your post was made when it was 5 AM down here, and (for me, at least) sleeping, unfortunately, takes precedence to Mafia.

[Tiruin]

Follow up on you? Why are you so concerned about that? I am only one of the few who asked you anything, and the only one you question is the one with a vote on you (I admit, I was waiting for Toaster's response and your own to get more information). You aren't participating in the conversations between everyone else and only jump in to ask me that one question.

Why?

I'm not concerned. I just find it odd that you vote me, question me, and then drop it without another word. Why would you do that?

I questioned Toaster, too. Also, why would I participate in a conversation that's not mine? They're not particularly interesting.

If I may ask, why wouldn't you (pertaining to the participation in conversations)? Why aren't they interesting? Are you satisfied with hunting scum by watching and waiting for a slip, or are you reluctant to question anyone at all, based on what you said? Even an RVS question would help leads, in small matters as in big.

Also, pressure vote. It seems you feel affected by that single vote though.

Tiruin:

Dariush has been online for quite some time, and not giving out anything related to his interrogators.

Just as a note, your post was made when it was 5 AM down here, and (for me, at least) sleeping, unfortunately, takes precedence to Mafia.

I meant was, your last post was about +~40 hours ago based on the lurkertracker from that post. Anyway, you've posted.

Now to know where IronyOwl went.

[ToonyMan]

Toony:

Well, I think it's better to have a reason for voting someone than to just "get it out of the way".
As for nulltells, since I only really have two from active-er people I think it's okay for the game.  I wanted to point it out at least.

So you don't care that you have a few people that are nulltells? That's alarming. Possibly even scummy. Why don't you take your time between posting your tiny little two/one-line posts and actually, I don't know, ask these people some questions? All I see you doing right now is answering questions and poking lurkers.

Ah well, what I mean by that is I think it's better to actively attack people you think are being scummy and ones who aren't can keep doing what they're doing.  If I don't see anything wrong with a player there's nothing to ask is there?  I would be "making shit up" which I would never do.

Well, I think it's better to have a reason for voting someone than to just "get it out of the way".
As for nulltells, since I only really have two from active-er people I think it's okay for the game.  I wanted to point it out at least.

My reason for voting Flandre is because I think she is scum. Are you just going to focus on the people with null tells who aren't active? 

That's not really true.  In fact it's the complete opposite!  Everybody I want to question right now I think are being scummy.

Toony: So, what, no suspicions other than that RV?

Not really no.  I'm happy with your response though.

As of typing this I still have Dariush and IronyOwl.  I'm going to type something up for the Urists too.

Toony:

Somebody weak in the knees?  Stop being a coward.

Oh, all right. I hoped for a sane explanation from you, but it looks like I set my expectations too high. Your case is bullshit, Toony. Instead of actually scumhunting you prefer to make up shit out of thin air. This doesn't apply exclusively to your case against me, but also against your leading questions during RVS to other people.

Well, no.  You still haven't answered my question Dariush.  Which is terrible.

So right now...Dariush, Darvi (probably just shitty town why did you replace ugh), IronyOwl, and both the Urists I think are being scummy.  NativeForeigner is a nulltell, he acted like Think recently against Tiruin with the "why aren't you pressing me more?".  OrangeBottle is null too I believe (I feel like he's leading Zombie's attack).  If I haven't mentioned anybody else they really aren't leaving an impression on my really, which is bad for them.

Relevant part bolded. What the fuck, really. Out of 13 players who aren't you you consider 5 scummy, two nulltelling and the rest... scummy because they don't leave an impression on you? Explain that.

Five is pretty good I think.  It's not a huge majority but it also focuses enough to be productive.  Which I can't say you are being.

@IronyOwl:
Still busy I guess?

@At both Urists:
Can I have a short summary of the logic behind your votes?

@Everybody else:
The day ends today.  We are not getting a concise vote.  My thought is because we have too many people and not enough playing, care to share your opinions?  I don't want a tie at the very least.

[Reverie]

Orangebottle:

Flandre:
Zombie's right. Why aren't you voting?

I'm getting there.

Zombie Urist:

Flandre:

I scumhunt best once I find something worth mentioning. As for being passive, I did not even think I had time to give that impression.

This is passive. How are you going to find something if you don't scumhunt?

Scumhunting is more than just searching for fishy comments. Following through on a lead is just as important, and that was what I was referring to.

You're confidence seemed rooted in your mafia history here on these boards (all three as scum), and you used RL Mafia as an excuse to pardon yourself. Scapegoat.

I don't think you understand what scapegoating is. I never said that my confidence was based on forum mafia.

Okay, I can agree with my misuse of the term 'scapegoat', but there is a difference between saying and implying. Confidence is not unfounded, and we know for a fact that you have been with us for a while as scum.

Notice that I didn't even say that I suspected you--only that I wasn't convinced. Stronger than a vague statement, and weaker than an FoS. Your answer was fine, and I agree that only time will tell.

Don't know what you mean here.

It seemed to me at the time that you were blowing up my disbelief into an affront on your town-ness, because you voted for me in the same post as your response. You did not state this as a reason for your vote, but I wasn't so sure.

I can't speak for Think, but I can only guess that he was whining half-sarcastically about not getting acknowledged because he wanted material to pry at. It's interesting, but not malicious.

It's interesting, it's scummy. I never asked for you to try and explain his behavior. The fact that you did anyways is also 'interesting.'

Right. So completely ignoring what my predecessor did would not be even more 'interesting'? Look at what you are saying. I have nothing to hide on his behalf and by extension, mine.

Also I would have pointed this out anyways and Think replacing out was just bad timing.
Lastly why are you FoSing instead of voting?

I was waiting for a response from Tiruin to consider it. It's all in the timing. Again, I'm getting there.

Tiruin:

I think you missed my extended reasoning:

I haven't played with most of the people here so I don't think I can say exactly who I want as scumbuddies. The ones I know of would be the ones I'd pick but that would be biased against the others.

I am not trying hard, or trying at all to associate myself with others. What gave you that idea, or are you implying something else, Flandre?

Your extended answer was not the initial reaction to the question; you answered it in such a nervous roundabout way the first time, I couldn't ignore it.

To name people, I cannot, if that is what you mean by 'who' as my perspective on people is that everyone changes their playstyle according to their role. For my two scumbuddies, I'd like people who know how to play as a team yet know how to work independent in their day game.

Half of the answer was hung up on the fact that you were asked 'who', rather than 'what type' of scumbuddies you would prefer on your scumteam. You were struggling to make the question into something you could answer vaguely, and that much is painfully obvious to me.
And I know you aren't trying to associate yourself with others--you misread my argument, where I said the contrary:

It seems to me like you are trying your hardest to avoid associating yourself with others. Why would that be?

So did you slip in your rush to answer me?

What gave you that idea, or are you implying something else, Flandre?

And this is where I am glad I waited for you to respond to bring something else to light. I am implying something:

Urist I.:

Orangebottle:

ToonyMan:

zombie urist:

Jokerman-EXE:

IronyOwl:

Dariush:

Shakerag:

Powder Miner:

By questioning almost everyone playing, you are making yourself out to be useful town while not pressuring anyone specifically. This looks familiar, because you were trying not to negatively associate yourself with anyone, even then.

But where are Toaster, Native Foreigner, Think, and Bookthras?

I can speak for myself, so I'll give you a narrower version of the same question that you so nervously answered:

Between Darvi, Native Foreigner, and Toaster, which two would you prefer as scumbuddies, Tiruin?

[Tiruin]

Flandre:

First of all, I don't like it when people try to tell me my expressions that I do not feel when I post. I was never nervous when I answered you, or anyone at all in particular.

To name people, I cannot, if that is what you mean by 'who' as my perspective on people is that everyone changes their playstyle according to their role. For my two scumbuddies, I'd like people who know how to play as a team yet know how to work independent in their day game.

Half of the answer was hung up on the fact that you were asked 'who', rather than 'what type' of scumbuddies you would prefer on your scumteam. You were struggling to make the question into something you could answer vaguely, and that much is painfully obvious to me.
And I know you aren't trying to associate yourself with others--you misread my argument, where I said the contrary:

It seems to me like you are trying your hardest to avoid associating yourself with others. Why would that be?

How did you arrive at 'what type' and what gave you that idea? I was signifying the qualities of who the person is.

I guess you missed who I already pointed out:

+snip+

Toaster and IronyOwl. From my experience, they work well with their wordplay and know how to handle themselves.

Or Bookthras, he also knows how to word his net of thoughts and has a certain kind of power behind his posts.

And you accuse me of answering in a roundabout way? I think this statement does it:

I think you missed my extended reasoning:

I haven't played with most of the people here so I don't think I can say exactly who I want as scumbuddies. The ones I know of would be the ones I'd pick but that would be biased against the others.

I am not trying hard, or trying at all to associate myself with others. What gave you that idea, or are you implying something else, Flandre?

Your extended answer was not the initial reaction to the question; you answered it in such a nervous roundabout way the first time, I couldn't ignore it.

-snip-

If you saw, that was an answer to Shakerag. And 'initial reaction'? If you wanted to glean info from that one, why are you beating around the bush to offer me another one? All I said there was that it would be biased as I don't know the playstyles of nearly half the other players here. Hence, question list.

Oh, and I did ask the rest, thank you very much. Their respective questions were just not part of that single post you mentioned there. The huge list? That one.

To humor you as I've already given my picks: Toaster and Native Foreigner, as I've seen their playstyles before while reading the other Mafias, with Native Foreigner being mostly not the one he is acting now. And more on Toaster, he was the BM Scum tutor who I've learnt a lot from in my days as scum, and he plays a damned well town game.

[Toaster]

Orangebottle:

Urist: I wasn't aware that it was possible to be passive in RVS.

This statement is nonsense- please explain it.

EBWOP:
Flandre is also not Think. She has no way of defending whatever Think did in the past.

So, my theory is that you're scum for voting for Flandre for absolutely zero reasons. Care to refute it?

You seem awfully interested in upholding the glorious name that is Flandre, who could do no wrong despite what bad old Think did in the past.


Flandre:  I see much blue but no red out of you.  Why so many FoSes but no votes?   PPE: Oh, there's the vote.  I see.


Native:  Why aren't you voting anyone?   For someone who purports to be being helpful, you should be.