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[The Darkling Wolf]

Smart Moving is totally forge compatible.

Just install the modloader version of it, after installing PlayerAPI. Install Forge before anything else.

[Sergius]

You're assuming she'd instantly see a bug report and go "Oh, must be my fault"

Far more likely she'll tell them to verify that it's actually an RP bug, or she'll just straight up ignore it.

   Umm, do you know how bug tracking works? She is the only person coding RP2 so if she wants to fix bugs then she has to wade through all the bug reports at the least and enough people will probably report false bugs to make her have to at least look.

Another point then, if this was the case, her thread would be full of bug reports for Tubestuff, as it is, all of the bugs in it are directed at its creator, the same creator who made the power crossover mod in the first place.
Most users with the ability to go and download a separate addon have the intelligence to restrict bug reports to that addon creator.

Again, the case is made that modding is bad, because Mojang should be swamped by now by bug reports about Redpower2 and IndustrialCraft. In fact, there should be no modding, because it isn't fair for them right?

It comes down again to "modders have more rights than the maker of the product, who has none. It's ok for modders to bitch about others modding their mod, but if the creator complains, we should burn him at the stake."

[Vattic]

It comes down again to "modders have more rights than the maker of the product, who has none. It's ok for modders to bitch about others modding their mod, but if the creator complains, we should burn him at the stake."

If Notch didn't want modding he should have clamped down on it from the start. Users and makers of mods were bound to get all worked up after modding had become such a big part of the game for many people.

Did Eloraam speak out publicly when Notch said he was going to ban modding until the API was done? If she didn't it's not really fair to tar her with the communities response.

[Graknorke]

It comes down again to "modders have more rights than the maker of the product, who has none. It's ok for modders to bitch about others modding their mod, but if the creator complains, we should burn him at the stake."

If Notch didn't want modding he should have clamped down on it from the start. Users and makers of mods were bound to get all worked up after modding had become such a big part of the game for many people.

Did Eloraam speak out publicly when Notch said he was going to ban modding until the API was done? If she didn't it's not really fair to tar her with the communities response.

Modding Minecraft is technically illegal, it's just that it is overlooked for community reasons.

[Girlinhat]

I subscribe to the theory that modding is vital to the long-term success of any given piece of software.  Look around at the games you enjoy, and observe how many of them have open modding, forced modding, or no modding.  Glancing at my Steam list... X3 - major modding.  M&B Warband - major modding.  Torchlight 2 - modding.  Skyrim - massive modding.  The best games are mod friendly.  This expands to all programs, mainly.  Anything that gets third party plugins becomes popular - observe smart phones.  The only real exceptions are when it's a serious investment, like Windows doesn't allow much tinkering, but then it's tough to make an OS (although Linux is also proof against this), and certain programs like Windows Media Player and Paint perform their function so basically that there's not much to complain about.

Minecraft is extremely mod-friendly.  This has ensured its longterm survival as a game in many ways.
To believe that your mod for minecraft is exempt from the rules that have made minecraft popular, is to be disillusioned and entitled.

[Matz05]

Depends on your local definition of "create" and "derivative", but yeah, seeing as it involves recompiling.
Honestly, I don't know why Eloraam gets all the hate when she is rather moderate-to-easygoing as modders go. Is it because she actually has a decent (and some would say essential) mod instead of all the awful or just optional stuff the really jerkish modders pump out?

EDIT: ninjad

I agree with you.

[The Darkling Wolf]

I subscribe to the theory that modding is vital to the long-term success of any given piece of software.  Look around at the games you enjoy, and observe how many of them have open modding, forced modding, or no modding.  Glancing at my Steam list... X3 - major modding.  M&B Warband - major modding.  Torchlight 2 - modding.  Skyrim - massive modding.  The best games are mod friendly.  This expands to all programs, mainly.  Anything that gets third party plugins becomes popular - observe smart phones.  The only real exceptions are when it's a serious investment, like Windows doesn't allow much tinkering, but then it's tough to make an OS (although Linux is also proof against this), and certain programs like Windows Media Player and Paint perform their function so basically that there's not much to complain about.

Minecraft is extremely mod-friendly.  This has ensured its longterm survival as a game in many ways.
To believe that your mod for minecraft is exempt from the rules that have made minecraft popular, is to be disillusioned and entitled.

Weren't you arguing in favour of her not letting people make addons a while ago?

[Sergius]

I subscribe to the theory that modding is vital to the long-term success of any given piece of software.  Look around at the games you enjoy, and observe how many of them have open modding, forced modding, or no modding.  Glancing at my Steam list... X3 - major modding.  M&B Warband - major modding.  Torchlight 2 - modding.  Skyrim - massive modding.  The best games are mod friendly.  This expands to all programs, mainly.  Anything that gets third party plugins becomes popular - observe smart phones.  The only real exceptions are when it's a serious investment, like Windows doesn't allow much tinkering, but then it's tough to make an OS (although Linux is also proof against this), and certain programs like Windows Media Player and Paint perform their function so basically that there's not much to complain about.

Minecraft is extremely mod-friendly.  This has ensured its longterm survival as a game in many ways.
To believe that your mod for minecraft is exempt from the rules that have made minecraft popular, is to be disillusioned and entitled.

I subscribe to the same thing. I however, do not subscribe to double standards.

EDIT: Well, same thing you were saying with that last line, basically. Entitled little buggers.

[Matz05]

Well, there are two levels of "leave it alone" when it comes to Minecraft modders.
There is Eloraam's "I don't want to compete new features with/deal with bugs from/deal with breaking submods. At least don't change anything that isn't finished."
Then there is the "GAIS MY COPYWRIGHT!!! I SUE YOU!!!!!!!11!!!11!ONE!!!" you get from most modders.

The former is arguably misguided, but basically a friendly request. The latter is a demand that should be violated purely for the sake of bruising the ego behind it.

[iceball3]

Well, there are two levels of "leave it alone" when it comes to Minecraft modders.
There is Eloraam's "I don't want to compete new features with/deal with bugs from/deal with breaking submods. At least don't change anything that isn't finished."
Then there is the "GAIS MY COPYWRIGHT!!! I SUE YOU!!!!!!!11!!!11!ONE!!!" you get from most modders.

The former is arguably misguided, but basically a friendly request. The latter is a demand that should be violated purely for the sake of bruising the ego behind it.

Well, yeah, though, I'm pretty sure she hasn't had much refrain for completely tearing down (I'm remembering this correctly, yeah?) anything she sees with the smallest amount of her code in it that isn't hers. Turns from "friendly request" to "Polite but as far as we're concerned enforced demand".

[Akhier the Dragon hearted]

Well, yeah, though, I'm pretty sure she hasn't had much refrain for completely tearing down (I'm remembering this correctly, yeah?) anything she sees with the smallest amount of her code in it that isn't hers. Turns from "friendly request" to "Polite but as far as we're concerned enforced demand".

   She requests the places take stuff that mods her mod down. The big places respect her wishes. You could for instance post links to a mod that does fools around with her code here though it might as I have mentioned, cause troubles for Toady so its not advised. Basically you have to find a place that doesn't care about the modders to post you links. Of course theres the thing, the place probably is not a nice place to be a modder then. I think its just manners to not go against her wishes as long as she is actively developing the code. Now if she at some point stops maintaining it then either its up to whoever she puts in charge of maintaining it or feel free to do what you want with it.

[Matz05]

Yeah. I don't see the problem, it's not like people have to do as she says, it's just polite.
Going over people's heads loses some respect from me though. Mirror that stuff everywhere! Striessand Effect! Honestly, it's just a matter of principle. If somebody decides to suppress information by a means other than asking, it's every Internet citizen's duty to attack them in that way.
However, aren't most modules "open" already though? The wiring, tube, and worldgen systems are basically done, it's just energy conversions that are the sensitive issue with Bluetricity in it's infancy. I really think people should go ahead and ignore her warnings if you think it's a good idea, but that the idea is to discourage quick-and-dirty hacks that will preclude the adoption of an actual GOOD implementation in the official branch later on; which is a reasonable concern.

[Akhier the Dragon hearted]

   Anyway there are mods that are made to work with RP2 and those things. For instance Chickenbone Wireless redstone is hooked up to it though he did ask permission to do it. Its just that the things that are finished don't really need all that much added. The wires are brilliant and the machines work how they are supposed to, its just the power gen right now that is the problem.

[iceball3]

Well, yeah, though, I'm pretty sure she hasn't had much refrain for completely tearing down (I'm remembering this correctly, yeah?) anything she sees with the smallest amount of her code in it that isn't hers. Turns from "friendly request" to "Polite but as far as we're concerned enforced demand".

   She requests the places take stuff that mods her mod down. The big places respect her wishes. You could for instance post links to a mod that does fools around with her code here though it might as I have mentioned, cause troubles for Toady so its not advised. Basically you have to find a place that doesn't care about the modders to post you links. Of course theres the thing, the place probably is not a nice place to be a modder then. I think its just manners to not go against her wishes as long as she is actively developing the code. Now if she at some point stops maintaining it then either its up to whoever she puts in charge of maintaining it or feel free to do what you want with it.

But the idea is that not anyone can just hop in and say "this person used some of my code" and expect the mod to be taken down, such a thing like that has ridiculous amount of regards to how popular the mod is.
So it sorta turns into "My mod is more popular, thus I have more sway in what people can derive from it."
When honestly, there shouldn't really be much sway at all what can or cannot derive from a mod.

[Akhier the Dragon hearted]

   Well yeah, its not fair. To have sway over what happens to your mod the mod has to matter of course. Its just how life works though honestly people try to mod her mod because it is popular so maybe the sites would be willing to listen to small modders but it has just never come up. I don't know of a single example where a small time mod was modded by someone else and the original modder minded though that may just be my inexperience with less popular mods.