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[Kaos]

So in the wiky Ice page it says:

Floors and walls made of ice will allow light through

Is that true? and does it also allow LoS? can we have floor windows by building ice floors?

And most importantly can it be weaponized? I was thinking of having like the tower watch-posts with windows but instead a subterranean corridor that can be watched by an animal from above/below through a floor/ceiling "window", so I get early warning of enemies entering the corridor but without having to replace the animal.

[Sphalerite]

Technically correct, but useless.  Any spot which has ever been touched by light will always have a status of Light Aboveground rather than Dark Belowground.  If you build a roof of ice over a Light Aboveground area, it remains Light Aboveground.  The same is also true if you build a roof of granite.

[Hotaru]

The LOS thing is interesting, but probably not, considering my dwarves have lived in successful above-ground fortresses cast out of ice (actually easier than building them, in a freezing biome) without interruption spam, a round ice wall around it apparently stopping the things wandering into the map interrupting things. Then and again, that's not a systematic test at all.

However you can realize that corridor just as well by putting the chickens behind windows on either side.

[Kaos]

the blue area is the supposed LoS, they get seen after they're underground in the corridor, and the ==== floors/ceiling should be made of ice, I guess it also works with floor bars/grates but projectiles can get through those.

I'm looking for a horizontal counterpart for the windows.

[NonconsensualSurgery]

Nothing a turkey on an elevated platform can't fix.

The LOS thing is interesting, but probably not, considering my dwarves have lived in successful above-ground fortresses cast out of ice (actually easier than building them, in a freezing biome) without interruption spam, a round ice wall around it apparently stopping the things wandering into the map interrupting things. Then and again, that's not a systematic test at all.

However you can realize that corridor just as well by putting the chickens behind windows on either side.

How did you cast ice without having the pump stack freeze?

[Nil Eyeglazed]

the blue area is the supposed LoS, they get seen after they're underground in the corridor, and the ==== floors/ceiling should be made of ice, I guess it also works with floor bars/grates but projectiles can get through those.

Actually, they can't.  Floor grates or horizontal bars are perfectly safe alternatives to ice floors/ceilings in the above diagram.

[Hotaru]

Nothing a turkey on an elevated platform can't fix.

The LOS thing is interesting, but probably not, considering my dwarves have lived in successful above-ground fortresses cast out of ice (actually easier than building them, in a freezing biome) without interruption spam, a round ice wall around it apparently stopping the things wandering into the map interrupting things. Then and again, that's not a systematic test at all.

However you can realize that corridor just as well by putting the chickens behind windows on either side.

How did you cast ice without having the pump stack freeze?

Um, maybe the "cast" was a bit misleading. Have a water source, designate a pond where you would like to add another z-level of mineable ice. You'll only need one stairway going up the side of a tower to do it.

Actually, they can't.  Floor grates or horizontal bars are perfectly safe alternatives to ice floors/ceilings in the above diagram.

They can't be shot through at all? That's interesting. I was thinking more like window behind a fortification allowing only diagonal access to it or something.

[Nil Eyeglazed]

They can't be shot through at all? That's interesting. I was thinking more like window behind a fortification allowing only diagonal access to it or something.

Well, I've tested with floor grates (v34.05), but not horizontal bars.  Just assuming for the bars.

[Kaos]

Nothing a turkey on an elevated platform can't fix.

The LOS thing is interesting, but probably not, considering my dwarves have lived in successful above-ground fortresses cast out of ice (actually easier than building them, in a freezing biome) without interruption spam, a round ice wall around it apparently stopping the things wandering into the map interrupting things. Then and again, that's not a systematic test at all.

However you can realize that corridor just as well by putting the chickens behind windows on either side.

How did you cast ice without having the pump stack freeze?

Um, maybe the "cast" was a bit misleading. Have a water source, designate a pond where you would like to add another z-level of mineable ice. You'll only need one stairway going up the side of a tower to do it.

I wasn't really talking about casting natural ice floors, those melt away if your biome is not freezing, I was talking about built constructed floors, you wait until winter mine some of the frozen murky pools then grab the ice stone and build the floor, that won't melt and no need for casting.

Actually, they can't.  Floor grates or horizontal bars are perfectly safe alternatives to ice floors/ceilings in the above diagram.

They can't be shot through at all? That's interesting. I was thinking more like window behind a fortification allowing only diagonal access to it or something.

I'm not so sure, in one of the changes for the 34.xx versions I read that they had fixed the LoS through floor grates/bars, before it didn't work (I never really tried, though) so if creatures can now correctly see through floor bars/grates is just logical that they can shoot through them (again, haven't tried yet) since they can and will shoot through wall grates/bars and fortifications.

[Nil Eyeglazed]

I'm not so sure, in one of the changes for the 34.xx versions I read that they had fixed the LoS through floor grates/bars, before it didn't work (I never really tried, though) so if creatures can now correctly see through floor bars/grates is just logical that they can shoot through them (again, haven't tried yet) since they can and will shoot through wall grates/bars and fortifications.

They can see through them-- they get interrupted-- but they can't shoot.  Testing for this involved putting a goblin under a grate and marching dwarves back and forth above him.  Civilians would get interrupted, but marksdwarves wouldn't shoot.

[Frogwarrior]

I just tested this in Adventure Mode by attempting to throw mud through some of the sewer floor grates. The mud did NOT pass through the grates. I conclude that grates block ammo.

[kaijyuu]

Ice constructions are absolutely no different than any other constructions.


If you want an early warning system for ambushes with pets, use windows.

[Kaos]

I just tested this in Adventure Mode by attempting to throw mud through some of the sewer floor grates. The mud did NOT pass through the grates. I conclude that grates block ammo.

MUD SHALL NOT PASS!!! sorry I couldn't resist! 

Ice constructions are absolutely no different than any other constructions.

If you want an early warning system for ambushes with pets, use windows.

The point was to use them underground... in a corridor, windows are nice in a tower, maybe something like this:

The pit is there to keep building destroyers from destroying the window, in the same manner a tower needs the windows to be on the z-level above...
Of course a design like this is much less compact, than what I was first proposing, but since the reports say that floor grates/bars are immune to projectiles, I might as well use them and go with the compact design...

[Frogwarrior]

Buildingdestroyers can destroy buildings from 2 spaces away. To be safe, your pit needs to be 2 spaces wide. Even without that, there's the fact that I'm pretty sure sneaking enemies can come pretty close to an observer before being detected, so your kitten isn't gonna see jack unless it gets very lucky.
Putting the kitten in the room above, with the space between the two corridors being floor grates, should work though.

[Urist Da Vinci]

Just tested in 34.06 and both floor bars and grates allow sight (they didn't a few versions ago!), but don't allow projectiles. Detection range is a 7x7x7 cube centered on the observer (you can spot a creature 3 tiles away).

Therefore, pasture a lot of dogs or other creatures on top of grates above the entrance hallway to protect them from archers while revealing sneakers.

Ice walls/floors are still walls/floors and block sight.