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Author Topic: Science Thread: Taming and Training  (Read 72974 times)

WaffleEggnog

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Re: Science Thread: Taming and Training
« Reply #105 on: March 27, 2012, 11:15:48 am »

I have only tamed one animal, a duck, and it just seemed to stay in one spot right outside the entrance to the first cavern layer, staring into space, even once it was adopted by someone. Wierd.....
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Broseph Stalin

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Re: Science Thread: Taming and Training
« Reply #106 on: March 27, 2012, 12:55:37 pm »

I have physically watched a second generation wolf pup be tamed from -Trained- to Domesticated. Which is more relevant, that they're second generation or that they're pups?

Experiment: Trap a male and female wild animal (Preferably one your civ is familiar with) but do not tame either. Leave them in a pit or sealed room. The female will give birth, capture the babies and tame them, report results.

Stormfeather

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Re: Science Thread: Taming and Training
« Reply #107 on: March 27, 2012, 03:09:24 pm »

Well darn. If they become trap immune after they revert, I guess my little cage traps around the pasture entrances won't do jack. Grumble.

I wonder if that's just a bug, an artifact of the fact that tame animals don't trigger traps, and they keep that immunity? Hum. Or maybe not even a bug, but acting as intended. (I guess if an animal is trained to know where the traps are, and to avoid them, even if it goes wild again it might continue to avoid them.)
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Frogwarrior

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Re: Science Thread: Taming and Training
« Reply #108 on: March 27, 2012, 04:34:35 pm »

Pretty sure it's more relevant that they're pups. Possibly the fact that they were born partially tamed helped as well.
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Kestrel

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Re: Science Thread: Taming and Training
« Reply #109 on: March 27, 2012, 07:30:20 pm »

I have determined through extensive experimentation that WAR ELEPHANTS F*!$%ING RAWK
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GhostDwemer

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Re: Science Thread: Taming and Training
« Reply #110 on: March 27, 2012, 07:43:39 pm »

Now it's plump helmet men. What cheerful, friendly creatures. They really want into my fort. I can't leave any access to the caverns open, they charge my fort. Not in a violent way. In an overly gregarious way, "Hey dwarves! What's up? What's cooking? That smells good, mind if I come in? I'll only stay a while, promise! These thrones are awesome, dude, so comfortable, we don't have chairs, haha, we just sit on... toadstools! Get it? Get it? get it? Why aren't you laughing? Hey while you're up can you get me a plump helmet roast? What? Don't look so shocked, dude, you eat mammals, I've seen you. Man, I'm just gonna chill out here for a while, you guys are cool."

So I try to practice catch-and-release, you know? And what I find funny is, a dwarf will happily lead a plump helmet man down to a pasture in the caverns. Then he lets him go and is all like "OH NO! RUN! A plump helmet man! Where'd he come from?" and the plump helmet man is like "Duuuuude, not cool, bro! Why you gotta be so cold, bro? C'mon, lemme in, I fracking hate these caverns bro! So damp, nobody knows how to cook for shit, and there's all these, like, giant three legged eyeless coyotes with two tails down here running around breathing noxious crap all over everything. Ya gotta let me in!"

I create fun stories in my head to make up for the fact that I can't catch or breed crap. It's all I got. That and my giant hamster, Wuzzles. C'mere Wuzzles, we don't need fracking war elephants or dragons, we got each other, and a bunch of copper spikes to keep us safe.
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Steb

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Re: Science Thread: Taming and Training
« Reply #111 on: March 28, 2012, 05:51:45 am »

All I've tamed so far is a giant louse to "semi-wild." It was trained whilst in a cage on the animal stockpile. It is now tied to a rope in my animal training room. A captured hamster woman is not trainable.
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Kogut

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Re: Science Thread: Taming and Training
« Reply #112 on: March 28, 2012, 07:34:53 am »

"Upgrading from an older DF version causes egglaying animals to lay untame children." - confirmed, fixed (see http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=5701 )
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nightwhips

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Re: Science Thread: Taming and Training
« Reply #113 on: March 28, 2012, 09:30:46 am »

I have a bit of an update, though minor.

I assigned a number of those semi-wild poults I've got (which I see is a bug due to save-game carry-over) to be trained. One of my miners, of all people wandered over and started the work. Then I realized the three poults he'd trained were following him around. Not good for a miner.

Here's the new bit (at least, I haven't seen it) - in his RELATIONSHIPS, v-z-r, he shows a "passing acquaintance" with three poults. I would hazard that tantruming on slaughter is due to the strong relationship between trainer and trainee. It may be worthwhile to investigate how this relationship strengthens with initial training or repeated training, and whether training should be micromanaged and done by multiple dwarves (to spread out the bad thoughts) if you're planning on eating your trainees. It may be better to simply tame breeding stock and then eat their babies, though.
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Girlinhat

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Re: Science Thread: Taming and Training
« Reply #114 on: March 28, 2012, 09:39:08 am »

I think breeding to tame, and then butchering the domestic offspring is the intended idea.

jaxy15

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Re: Science Thread: Taming and Training
« Reply #115 on: March 28, 2012, 10:32:42 am »

We Need to Confirm:
Exotic animals will now breed.
I breed naked mole dogs for my meat industry. Exotics DO breed.

Spoiler: Puppies! (click to show/hide)
« Last Edit: March 28, 2012, 10:38:16 am by jaxy15 »
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Girlinhat

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Re: Science Thread: Taming and Training
« Reply #116 on: March 28, 2012, 10:38:05 am »

So let's try and get a bit organized here.
Girlinhat has become a Bookkeeper!

What do we know about the new taming and training, and what has yet to be verified?

We Know:
Exotic animals will now breed.
You now use a zone instead of the kennels, created via the "i" menu.
[PET] and [PET_EXOTIC] may be tamed.
Taming may "wear off" after a time and the animal reverts to a wild or semi-wild state.
A dwarf assigned to the animal will automatically re-tame an animal that has begun to revert.
As your dwarves learn more about specific creatures, they become easier to tame.

We Need to Confirm:
Any (2nd gen) animals born from tame animals will be semi-wild at birth.
Any (3rd gen) animals born from tame animals will be domestic at birth.
The length of time between each wild reversion changes with how many times the animal has been tamed.
The offspring of a tame creature will be more/completely tame.
The offspring of tame creatures (perhaps limited to egglayers) may be less tame than their parents.
Young animals are easier to train than old animals (specifically those born on the map).
The taming of stolen merchant creatures or modded [PET] invaders.
Savage creatures (like Giant Desert Scorpions) are harder to keep tame.
Size of creature determines difficulty to tame.
Formerly-tame creatures become immune to traps?

We Don't Know:
How skill affects the taming rate.
How knowledge affects the taming rate.
Exactly how reversion is figured.
Upgrading from an older DF version causes egglaying animals to lay untame children.

Go now.  Science.

Kogut

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Re: Science Thread: Taming and Training
« Reply #117 on: March 28, 2012, 10:58:53 am »

"Upgrading from an older DF version causes egglaying animals to lay untame children." - confirmed, fixed (see http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=5701 )
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daishi5

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Re: Science Thread: Taming and Training
« Reply #118 on: March 28, 2012, 06:04:05 pm »

Update: from what I have so far, the levels of knowledge are: A few facts, General Familiarity, Knowledgeable, Expert, ... Domesticated.

I had to purge my animal collection because I had over 200 animals, I am now only working with my dragon, jaguars, giant eagles, and wild boars.  I think I have trained about 100 wild boars to reach the expert level.  Training animals is also a huge food producer, I have over 7000 meat, 6000 prepared meals and I am giving meals away to anyone who will take them. 

I also wonder if I can figure out how to breed dwarves faster and force them to emigrate back to the moutain home, my defense force of 100 untrained dwarves in copper armor may wipe out my home civilization at the rate I am burying them. 
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Dragula

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Re: Science Thread: Taming and Training
« Reply #119 on: March 29, 2012, 02:52:46 pm »

I've set first unassigned trainer to make my jaguar a war jaguar, but nothing is really happening, am I missing something?
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