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[krenshala]

All of that is negated by the simple fact that you have Root Beer.

Armok damn I love Root Beer, I am going to miss it.

If you haven't already, I recommend you try a good bottled sarsaparilla. Unfortunately, I can't remember the brand of the good stuff I found that one time, but it usually beats rootbeer for taste.

[rtg593]

Well it just upsets me that I wont be getting any anytime soon.

As much as I enjoy America I have lost my reason to keep visiting, so I'm just going to have to go without. Still, I suppose the trade-off is pop made with actual SUGAR instead of nasty HFCS... which seems remarkable similar to clowns.

Aaaaah, sugar... No risk of cancer, now THAT's a sweetener. Bad enough the artificial stuff we use is linked to cancer and diabetes (ironic, since they were eliminating the sugar BECAUSE of diabetes), but the stuff they're using in diet sodas turns into formaldehyde in your blood. Yech.

Edit... Wait, what was this thread about?

[KodKod]

What any thread on these forums is about:

Derailment.

[Loud Whispers]

But it doesn't explain how it can shoot any direction it wants at any time with good / fair accuracy.

On the other hand, I think it's a well supported statement enough that the GCS could be able to do such a thing by now. Lest we use *gasp* MATHEMATICS!

What's slightly more odd, is how the GCS got so damn big.

Perhaps the untouched caverns have a high oxygen content?

[MetalHead]

Because rails are made for jumping!

Also there's a few brands around my area in the US that sell good sasparilla (though I may not have found the better ones) although I'm in the middle of nowhere.

Even so, @Rude: are you in Kansas by chance? come north to good ol' Nebraska where we're not quite afraid to admit we have a drinking problem!

Admittedly we in the US might have worse brews (actually alcoholic ones) than our friends across the pond (depending on taste), we have a few that might put up a fight.

Brews to note (NOTE: most of these are those I've seen in the Midwest US or points west):

Empyrean Brewery: Local to Nebraska, haven't seen it very far outside that but its Dark Side Vanilla Porter is a damn smooth one, also try Burning Skye for a Scottish Ale(?might have type wrong, haven't had it in ages)
Old Rasputin's Imperial Stout: No idea where it's brewed, but we get it here in Nebraska and due to its potency (9.somethin% alcohol) they only sell this in 4-packs - you won't need more
Stone Brewery: Not sold around here but my brother in Arizona got me some of this.  California brewed, but if you like your beers dark you NEED to try this.

While you guys might not have been talking actual beers I felt I'd give some advice to anyone wandering through. There are others but those are some of my highlights

[rtg593]

But it doesn't explain how it can shoot any direction it wants at any time with good / fair accuracy.

On the other hand, I think it's a well supported statement enough that the GCS could be able to do such a thing by now. Lest we use *gasp* MATHEMATICS!

What's slightly more odd, is how the GCS got so damn big.

Perhaps the untouched caverns have a high oxygen content?

... 2.5 pages. 2. Point 5. Pages. And you ruined it.

Sigh. Let the re-railment commence...

If they are truly untouched, then they might have high O2, as well as a significantly increased pressure. Pressure has been shown to have profound size effects of plants, and most likely the same for animals. Cherry tomatoes the size of watermelons, watermelons the size of beach volleyballs, 12 foot tall tomato plants... Ya... It can get crazy. Made for some great science journal reports, and crazy pictures, to boot.

Increased O2 would assist in supporting a larger creature's metabolism, but then the dwarves would become instantly sober (and a little high) upon breaching the caverns, and the GCS would start dying of their own accord, due to the change in atmosphere...

EDIT: Ninja'd by a re-derailment. Nice.

[KodKod]

I didn't think it was to do with metabolism, I was under the impression that large insects and arachnids simply can't breathe the insufficient oxygen content that we have here on earth at present. Oxygen was supposed to be in greater abundance on earth millions of years ago, and that's when we had dragonflies with 6 foot wingspans. Something to do with the exoskeletons.

However... we have Giant Jumping Spiders and Giant Brown Recluse on the surface so I think it's safe to say that whatever happens Oxygen isn't an issue in Dwarf Fortress.

[rtg593]

I didn't think it was to do with metabolism, I was under the impression that large insects and arachnids simply can't breathe the insufficient oxygen content that we have here on earth at present. Oxygen was supposed to be in greater abundance on earth millions of years ago, and that's when we had dragonflies with 6 foot wingspans. Something to do with the exoskeletons.

However... we have Giant Jumping Spiders and Giant Brown Recluse on the surface so I think it's safe to say that whatever happens Oxygen isn't an issue in Dwarf Fortress.

True. By metabolism, I meant the oxygen metabolism... Of course, that isn't technically a correct use, either, but insufficient O2 to breath is what I was meaning.

Ya, those 6ft wing dragonfly fossils are... Something else. lol.

[white_darkness]

This reminds me of an article I read awhile back about spiders in Greenland growing larger due to warmer weather...here.

Admittedly, this article is a touch tongue-in-cheek....

Still, oxygen, temperature, hydraulics, and the issues of musculature versus mass in regards to leg support.

How big is a GCS supposed to be anyway?  Car-sized?  Bus-sized?

[Naryar]

Size is 200000 , so grizzly bear sized.

So sending a fully, well-armored dwarf against a wild GCS is a good way to train armor user skill ? Science must be made.

[wierd]

I didn't think it was to do with metabolism, I was under the impression that large insects and arachnids simply can't breathe the insufficient oxygen content that we have here on earth at present. Oxygen was supposed to be in greater abundance on earth millions of years ago, and that's when we had dragonflies with 6 foot wingspans. Something to do with the exoskeletons.

However... we have Giant Jumping Spiders and Giant Brown Recluse on the surface so I think it's safe to say that whatever happens Oxygen isn't an issue in Dwarf Fortress.

This would be post oxygen catastrophe, in the midst of the carboniferous era.

The rise of single celled photosynthetic organisms culminated in a massive explosion of evolutionary potentials, as a vast stream of metabolic energy was suddenly made available in the primordial high co2, high greenhouse gas earth atmosphere.  the consequence of which was a radical pendulum swing in atmospheric concentrations from heavy co2 levels, to heavy o2 levels, which had a poisonous effect on many early lifeforms. Hence the name, "oxygen catastrophe". The following era of geologic history is the carboniferous era, in which early animal forms capitalized on the massively vegationally dominated landscape. Atmospheric oxygen levels were so high that fermentation and biotic decomposition ran serious risks of initiating spontaneous combustion, lightning strikes almost always caused wildfires of insane proportions, and insects were the size of turkeys. (Well, a 'slight' exageration there...)

Nothing nearly the size of a GCS though.  The GCS would either need a radically different biochemistry (sulphur cycle perhaps.... close proximity to volcanic vents would make it a viable adaptation), or a well developed respiratory system. (Doesn't need lungs per se, but an an analogous tissue on flapped "gills" like those found on shrimp and lobster would suffice if kept sufficiently moistened.)

Without such a radical adaptation, the beasties would need to be retardedly sedentary, with a rediculously efficient and slow metabolic rate for passive osmotic oxygenation (what is currently present in insects and many arachnids. Some arachnids have "book lungs", but are not efficient enough for a species as large and active as a gcs.)

[white_darkness]

Which wasn't the record on size then about 2.6 meters?  Which I would think that would be close to the right size.

[rtg593]

8 foot long sea scorpion? Seems close to the right size...

http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2007-11/yu-3sf112107.php
http://www.usatoday.com/tech/science/discoveries/2007-11-20-biggest-bug_N.htm

[Stil]

If you really want documentaries so badly then go and buy everything that Sir David Attenborough has ever done on DVD.

That's what I do and I have never been disappointed.

^ Yus.

You can't go wrong with any of his shows I saw him during a talk at university. He's just amazing <3

[Rude]

There's also the problem of weight growth as size increases. A doubling in exterior size means 8x more interior size (voluem). which poses problems for organ efficiency (namely O2 intake, but also every organ must be made more space efficient -- more complex-- which poses a problem from an evolutionary standpoint and a practical one. But also, it causes mechanical problems. Many spider species already have trouble standing upright or running around (argiope, black widows. Scorpions, also, mostly just drag themselves around rather than standing up) when you consider that a doubling in size means they spider may have to support up to 8x more weight it becomes an issue of just how strong is chitin and at what point do bones become necessary.

Even so, @Rude: are you in Kansas by chance? come north to good ol' Nebraska where we're not quite afraid to admit we have a drinking problem!

Oklahoma actually. Worse than Kansas, bc you can't get alcohol on Sunday, you can only buy beer (3.2) after 9pm on weekdays, beer is 3.2 (and gives me a headache) and if people see you with a whiskey bottle then your an alcoholic or a college party jerk. If its not 3.2 then its only available in the liquor store. I like DARK beer, but its expensive. I gave beer up mostly a while ago, now its gin or whiskey.
I've been to Nebraska for about 6 months. It was awesome except I just turned 21 2 weeks before I left.

I think this thread was "done" on the 1st page. It's been zigzagging across the tracks like a drunk driving a hover train ever since. OP doesn't seem to mind...