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[GlyphGryph]

The people who made this petition are a bunch of slack-jawed buffoons. Our nation has bigger problems than words on paper, so I'm a little perturbed by people wasting time and resources on something this trivial. We can worry about this when everyone actually has ENOUGH of the paper they so despise to actually live comfortably.

You know, one would have thought this would be true - but nope! Its apparently a big enough deal that the devout Christians managed to pretty much destroy our national slogan in their eagerness to distance us from our history and cast us as a theological state, over such a "trivial" issue as what our money says.

I wonder, do you hold the same opinion of the people who forced it onto the money, who not only pushed it through the legislature but ended up sending quite a few separation of church and state cases through our system over it? Were they slack jawed buffoons as well?

[Karlito]

So... are we actually saying that God himself is actually rooting for our country?

Many people actually believe that though.

[Flying Dice]

So... are we actually saying that God himself is actually rooting for our country?

Many people actually believe that though.

And lo, the Lord did appear with deep friers and assault rifles, and they were good!

[Ancre]

For that matter, the whole "sworn in on a Bible" thing is a much more serious triviality than the money.

Wait, don't people swear on their respective holy books? Ie isn't swearing on Bible only for self-proclaimed Christians?

Unless something has changed recently, AFAIK all oaths of office, swearing into courts, etc. are done on a Bible, though people can 'affirm' rather than 'swear'. In either case, what of atheists?

Atheists should swear on On the Origin of Species, by Charles Darwin :p

But seriously, yeah, I gripe a bit over that too. Swear on the constitution, not the bible.

[chaoticag]

The people who made this petition are a bunch of slack-jawed buffoons. Our nation has bigger problems than words on paper, so I'm a little perturbed by people wasting time and resources on something this trivial. We can worry about this when everyone actually has ENOUGH of the paper they so despise to actually live comfortably.

This is something that costs little to fix, and is a big enough deal that fox news complained about it when it was first taken off some bills. And as far as time and resources go, the resources is that we switch a few things in the federal mint, and the time to take this is pretty trivial. I'd also like to point out this is one of the reasons many claim the US is a Christian nation, so the gain is more symbolic, and more cultural than anything. Change needs to start somewhere, and this is a good place to start.

[Tarran]

And lo, the Lord did appear with deep friers and assault rifles, and they were good!

You know... that actually doesn't sound that bad.

UNITED STATES: Fighting for fried food and the right to bear unneeded amounts of weapons! Under god, of course.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

On the subject of legal affirmation:

Affirmations that are purely secular have been around for as long as the US has been. This is in part because in some Christian sects (such as the Quakers) swearing an oath to God is a serious offense and in part to preserve the separation of Church and State.

You would put your hand on a copy of the Constitution and say: "I do affirm that...(oath)...(omit "so help me God").

How about we get rid of the Pledge of Allegiance in general? I'm happy and proud to be an American, surely, but it always kinda struck me as indoctrinating our youth.

They don't have to say it, and it's not really something that's very indoctrinating from my perspective.

Spoiler: 1923 Version (click to show/hide)

"I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States and to the republic for which it stands: one nation indivisible with liberty and justice for all."

No "crush our enemies and see them driven before us" in there or anything; not very controversial.

You have to learn The Pledge, Two Songs, Every president, Every 50 States and their capitals, as well as learn why America is cool and why they saved everyone in every war single handedly.

We really don't. With the exception of the last point and the state capitals (no one learns that with any kind of permanence) that stuff is just kind of picked up over the years. As for the last point, knock it off. Yes, there are silly nationalists out there who have no realistic idea of US military history. They're just as much of a headache to the rest of America as they are to the world at large, and their version of "history" isn't what the schools teach.

[darkrider2]

So... are we actually saying that God himself is actually rooting for our country?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gott_mit_uns

God was with the germans too apparently.

[DJ]

God sure likes to hedge His bets.

[CJ1145]

The people who made this petition are a bunch of slack-jawed buffoons. Our nation has bigger problems than words on paper, so I'm a little perturbed by people wasting time and resources on something this trivial. We can worry about this when everyone actually has ENOUGH of the paper they so despise to actually live comfortably.

You know, one would have thought this would be true - but nope! Its apparently a big enough deal that the devout Christians managed to pretty much destroy our national slogan in their eagerness to distance us from our history and cast us as a theological state, over such a "trivial" issue as what our money says.

I wonder, do you hold the same opinion of the people who forced it onto the money, who not only pushed it through the legislature but ended up sending quite a few separation of church and state cases through our system over it? Were they slack jawed buffoons as well?

...Yes.

The entire issue is almost as dumb as the two sides that think it's worth fighting over. It seems by your wording you were hoping to catch me in some moment of hypocrisy or something, but frankly I think everyone involved has the collective attention span of a mayfly. Our slogan was fine as it was, if a little pretentious, so Christians didn't need to change it. It's also, at this moment, not something that should be at the top of our lists. Because as much as you all say these things are trivial issues, you know damn well the idiots in the GOP are going to fight it to the end and make it a years-spanning struggle. All the time that will be spent trying to force that through could be spent bettering our education system, improving life for kids that have to grow up in slums, and other things that actually mean anything beyond words on paper.

The people who made this petition are a bunch of slack-jawed buffoons. Our nation has bigger problems than words on paper, so I'm a little perturbed by people wasting time and resources on something this trivial. We can worry about this when everyone actually has ENOUGH of the paper they so despise to actually live comfortably.

This is something that costs little to fix, and is a big enough deal that fox news complained about it when it was first taken off some bills. And as far as time and resources go, the resources is that we switch a few things in the federal mint, and the time to take this is pretty trivial. I'd also like to point out this is one of the reasons many claim the US is a Christian nation, so the gain is more symbolic, and more cultural than anything. Change needs to start somewhere, and this is a good place to start.

Listen, I'm all for change for the better, but I'm just so disappointed people think the words on money are more important than the people on the streets. I spent twenty minutes in Dayton, Ohio the other day, and I ran into six homeless people. Just walking down the street, and they were there. Even in my suburban town, where the average income is something like $80,000 a year, I see men in ratty clothes and shopping carts huddling in the alleyways on some nights. All I can ask is, how in the hell is their well-being less important than the feelings of non-Christians? Not their livelihoods, not their families, just their feelings? It's nothing short of irresponsible to put the needs of the suffering behind the wants of people groups who feel oppressed by a, in spirit, harmless phrase on some money.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

CJ, all issues are constantly in the field of debate. Saying that "we have bigger problems!" means nothing.

[MrWiggles]

And we're capable of multi tasking, just because this is being up for debate doesn't meant that nothing else is also having.

[varnish]

I really, really hate that whole dismissive attitude. There are bigger problems, yes. That does not mean that this is not a problem. It does not mean it is not worth fighting. It's a violation of the constitution, and is part of a much larger trend of ignoring the rights of religious minorities in this countries. It's important enough.

Saying "Oh, blank is so much more important" is just of way of shutting down any discussion, and I've got no fucking patience for that.

[Neonivek]

As for the last point, knock it off. Yes, there are silly nationalists out there who have no realistic idea of US military history. They're just as much of a headache to the rest of America as they are to the world at large, and their version of "history" isn't what the schools teach.

Given the point of what I said was supposed to be a "Negative" I was more or less saying that it must be very annoying learning world history very one sided only to need to relearn it at a much later date.

Like I had to... again and again and again... I REALLY hate Revisionist and Politically Correct history.

[Sir Finkus]

So that tosses out things like gay marriage too I suppose.  You could easily make the argument that having gay marriage recognized is less important than people without homes, unjust wars, or the government spying on citizens and shredding the bill of rights.  It doesn't mean it isn't a battle worth fighting.