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[NTJedi]

Thanks!!

[NTJedi]

The stairs are the problem, wagons can only use ramps.

If ramps are on the bottom then what's on the surface leading to the ramps??   Channels??

[Triaxx2]

I found a rather simple way to keep my depot accessible without leaving my fort accessible.

Two actually, but built on the same principle.
'
Basically, you build your depot in a box. Either on the surface in building, or in the side of a mountain/hill. Then connect it with a tunnel to your fort. Seal the inside with a draw bridge, and the outside with a bridge raising inside. This way the tunnel can be sealed while the 'box' is left open so there's no problem with the caravans.

Now, there are two alternatives for the defense. One is to use the perfectly good tunnel to put a trading stockpile in. The other if you expect a lot of building destroyers is to build pressurized pump systems. set them up to pressurize the tunnel. Flooding the tunnel during the 'off-season' means you won't be able to store things in there, but it means that if a siege arrives and attempts to break open the tunnel, anything not amphibious will get washed out. And anything that is won't get through the other end.

The downside is that you'll have to have both an aquifer to provide enough water, and to provide a place to drain it.

[pushy]

Normal AI for kobolds is to flee after loss of their stealth.  I wonder why the lil bugger kept pursuing that caravan trader, he must have been interested in their ox.  Thanks for the info.  That clears that up.  Very interesting how this game sometimes resolves.  I'd have never worked that out, without your help.  Just appeared to be a buggy caravan to me, I was rushing around trying to keep all my dwarfs busy.

That's true for kobold thieves, but not all kobolds. Just as goblin snatchers will run but soldiers will chase down anything with a pulse, kobolds sometimes send ambush squads that'll chase down dwarves/merchants/whatever.

I found a rather simple way to keep my depot accessible without leaving my fort accessible.

Two actually, but built on the same principle.
'
Basically, you build your depot in a box. Either on the surface in building, or in the side of a mountain/hill. Then connect it with a tunnel to your fort. Seal the inside with a draw bridge, and the outside with a bridge raising inside. This way the tunnel can be sealed while the 'box' is left open so there's no problem with the caravans.

Now, there are two alternatives for the defense. One is to use the perfectly good tunnel to put a trading stockpile in. The other if you expect a lot of building destroyers is to build pressurized pump systems. set them up to pressurize the tunnel. Flooding the tunnel during the 'off-season' means you won't be able to store things in there, but it means that if a siege arrives and attempts to break open the tunnel, anything not amphibious will get washed out. And anything that is won't get through the other end.

The downside is that you'll have to have both an aquifer to provide enough water, and to provide a place to drain it.

The airlock system you describe is common enough, though the use of pumps for flooding it as a building destroyer defence seems a bit odd; building destroyers will never destroy bridges. If the outer bridge is down then they may path towards the depot to destroy it, but aside from that they'll look for some other open path into your fort...or have I misinterpreted your description?

[-Firestar-]

*imagines a wagon falling through the stair grid like dough*

Must be fun to put that back together.

I had to build a couple bridges to reach the end of my map but because the bridges are 3 tiles wide, now the depot access only lists the bridge as 1 tile wide. Is this sufficient or do I have to re-make the bridges?

[dizzyelk]

*imagines a wagon falling through the stair grid like dough*

Must be fun to put that back together.

I had to build a couple bridges to reach the end of my map but because the bridges are 3 tiles wide, now the depot access only lists the bridge as 1 tile wide. Is this sufficient or do I have to re-make the bridges?

That'll work. So long as there's a single green line path, a wagon can go there.

[NTJedi]

Well placing the trading depot outside was undesired, but it's what I'll be using.  The ramps below solved the bottom half of the problem, but the top half on the surface remains a mystery.  I know I need to replace the stairs on the top surface, but just don't know what should replace them.

[Sphalerite]

Replace them with nothing.  A ramp needs open space above it, and a wall with a walkable floor next to it.

[NTJedi]

Replace them with nothing.  A ramp needs open space above it, and a wall with a walkable floor next to it.

How do I replace the stairs with open space above it?  Channels??

[Sphalerite]

If the stairs were carved out of rock or soil, channel them out to make open space.  If they were constructed, deconstruct them then channel out where they were.

[Castamere]

What about if you build a Depo on the open and build bridges around it
Build another in your fort and close the gates of your fort
When the merchant come, they'll go for the outside depo
Pull the bridges up and close the ourside depo
Open the fort and let them in.
Reverse when they leave
It's a lot safer than having an open fort, prone for ambushes and kobolts.

[NTJedi]

What about if you build a Depo on the open and build bridges around it
Build another in your fort and close the gates of your fort
When the merchant come, they'll go for the outside depo
Pull the bridges up and close the ourside depo
Open the fort and let them in.
Reverse when they leave
It's a lot safer than having an open fort, prone for ambushes and kobolts.

I don't want any buildings outside, except maybe a barracks because of the giant flying creatures.  I lost three dwarves to giant flying bats, each at different times during the first year of the game.  I have a large fort outside already with bridges, but the only ones outside will be trained soldiers and expendable woodcutters.

If the stairs were carved out of rock or soil, channel them out to make open space.  If they were constructed, deconstruct them then channel out where they were.

Thanks so much!!  This worked!

[Imp]

What about if you build a Depo on the open and build bridges around it
Build another in your fort and close the gates of your fort
When the merchant come, they'll go for the outside depo
Pull the bridges up and close the ourside depo
Open the fort and let them in.
Reverse when they leave
It's a lot safer than having an open fort, prone for ambushes and kobolts.

There's a couple weaknesses in using this method as described.

Since one can path from almost any map edge to that 'outside depot', your merchants can appear anywhere on the map.  This can be unhealthy should there be ambushes or other hostile units on the map.

These merchants can be trying to reach that 'outside depot' at the same time an ambusher unit is heading for them.  You might not know this until you've opened your fort, and might discover it in a manner that leads to more casulties than you wished for.

Your method offers no defense for the merchants, presuming that you actually desire to see them conduct buisness with your fortress in a wholesome, profitable, and safe manner.

As an alternative, build that bridge enclosed area as a one wall, two bridged enclave right on the side of your map.  The boundary of the area is going to be the map edge, two raised bridges touching that map edge, and an 'inner' wall.  The width between the bridges has to be at least 3, and the length between map edge and 'inner' wall must be at least 5.  Keeping it close to the minimum size works -better- for this method.  Once that wall is built, make a temporary ramp along the wall (outside the enclosed area) so you can get dwarves up there to make another bridge atop the enclosed area, sized to cover the structure as if it were a roof - this will protect it from most fliers.  Once construction of the upper bridge is done, deconstruct the ramp so only the rare flying building destroyer can reach that upper 'roof' bridge to force access inside.

Ensure that no trees or boulders block this enclosed area (I usually just keep an eye on it and trample any saplings that start to grow rather than try to pave it) and make a ramp down to an at least 3-tile-wide path that has some length to it and eventually connects to your fortress.  This path needs an 'outer gate', a rising bridge that is sealed to the outside, placed fairly close to the map edge, a place for the depot at some point (usually fairly close to the fortress) and an 'inner gate' between the depot and the fortress, that is sealed to the outside.  Make sure you place these 'gates' so that merchant guards/your dwarves are not randomly wandering into atom-smashing range.

90% of the time, leave the 'inner gate' sealed and the 'outer gate' open.  merchants are forced to spawn where there is a path to a depot.  They are forced to spawn in that 'hidden' sealed area, and will immediately start to path inwards.

Enemies spawn anywhere, and may someday spawn on the merchant path, but this is SO rare.  Never seen it happen myself, though I once saw a migrant wave spawn inside the path.  An enemy that spawns in here can only sit there, unless it wants to destroy the depot - this will let you know it's there.  Otherwise, it will eventually wander off the map or into an oncoming caravan.

When the caravan reaches the depot, flip the levers, so now the path is sealed to the outside and open to your fort.  Conduct your trading, get everything where you want it, and then flip the levers again so the merchants can leave when they are ready.

This keeps your dwarves safe, your merchants safe, and allows you considerable control of how pathing works in regards to these areas.  If you urgently need a 'distant bolt hole' for some reason, you need only open all three sets of rising bridges to allow this, and you have an exit hole leading out of the map.

Rarely the merchants refuse to path out - they dont WANT to leave the side of the map they entered from.  In that case, just open the outermost bridges (the ones that form the enclosure) to allow them wider exit, or just let them path out through the fortress main gate by opening the inner gate again, or perhaps have a few side exits carved and blocked by rising bridges to accomodate their departure in relatively complete safety.