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Author Topic: Ambushes, crossbows and general surviving  (Read 4965 times)

KlogW

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Ambushes, crossbows and general surviving
« on: March 11, 2012, 08:55:42 pm »

I've been playing DF for a couple of years now but I haven't really tried Adventure mode until last realease. I'm having tons of fun (and Fun) but there's one thing starting to bother me: the dreadful ambush + one-shot kill combo. 90% of my adventurers end their careers with a bolt in the eye in the first turn of an ambush. The luckiest ones stop the bolt with their guts only to get hacked to pieces moments later because of the combat penalties (I asume) when in pain. I can deal just fine with crossbowmen in camps by sneak-choking them, and I've fought titans, mummies and necromancers, but the combination of ambush plus crossbows has proven lethal to all my adventurers.

I understand that no fast travel equals no ambushes, but... seriously? A one day travel may be 30 or more minutes of real time walking without fast travel, this seems like a lot of time only to kill a naked weresheep peasant. I know that the observer skill prevents ambushes to an extent, but eventually you'll get into one. So, how do you deal with it?

Also, first post on the forums, long time lurker. And sorry if this is one of those questions that gets asked all the time, I did some search but didn't find anything conclusive enough on the matter.
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Blakmane

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Re: Ambushes, crossbows and general surviving
« Reply #1 on: March 11, 2012, 09:05:40 pm »

Bring companions, have a high observer and intuition, and have some ambusher skill. Your best bet is to run away and hide whilst your companions are slaughtered. If you are dying instantly you also probably don't have enough dodge/shield user. These are the main skills that will help you survive arrows. Finding some good armour is also useful. Remember that bandit entities are retained between adventurers, so if you can kill off one or two bowmen before you die your next adventurer will have an easier time.

Finally, as a lone adventurer you cannot think of yourself as much more than any other individual. a demigod is more powerful than your standard mook, but not *that* much more powerful. If you want to go in alone you have to think of yourself more as a guerilla fighter and not some God of War super hero. Both melee and missile weapons are important to train: one stone to the face and that crossbowman won't be hitting you nearly as often.


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KlogW

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Re: Ambushes, crossbows and general surviving
« Reply #2 on: March 11, 2012, 09:19:33 pm »

Thanks for the tips. I usually bring just one companion to avoid bogeymen, and favouring two-handed weapons with no shield is probably a big part of my problem. Oh, and I've been lowering intuition for extra points thinking it was a useless stat, I feel like an idiot now.

Is there any way to increase observer and intuition as fast as, let's say, wrestling or ambusher, or is better to just expend points there at the character creation?

Thanks again for your fast reply.
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JohnieRWilkins

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Re: Ambushes, crossbows and general surviving
« Reply #3 on: March 11, 2012, 10:05:29 pm »

Sadly no. No good ways of raising observer/intuition. Here is the list of skills that raise their attributes:

http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/Attributes#Skills_By_Soul_Attribute

Also, observer doesn't help THAT much. Your best bet is to start a superior agility/toughness demigod and grind sneaking up a few levels. That should give you the opportunity to find the nearest tree and hide as soon as you're ambushed. If you're good enough at ambushing, you can acquire a crossbow yourself and do battle on more equal terms.
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bg

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Re: Ambushes, crossbows and general surviving
« Reply #4 on: March 11, 2012, 11:31:59 pm »

jumping in just to say there IS a good way of training observer.
start with something around proficient observer(i went with very low intuition)
break into a tomb. don't wake up a mummy or pick up anything other than corpses, which will do the same.
look for a room with lots of traps. just don't get killed.
sleep or wait an hour, the traps will be re-hidden
re-detect to raise observer.
got it to legendary in around ten tries of a room with ~10 traps
but you could do with less.
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Blakmane

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Re: Ambushes, crossbows and general surviving
« Reply #5 on: March 11, 2012, 11:52:34 pm »

The only stat you should ever dump is musicality (and linguistic ability maybe: not sure if it is involved with the reading skill/learning secrets now). Every other stat either does something important or *may* do something important but we're not entirely sure.

Several times on this forum i've seen people complaining about how their adventurers always pass out after a single chipped bone, only for us to find out they dumped willpower......

You can also hold more than one shield by [r]emoving them from your backpack, but I have no idea if this actually increases block chance. I DO know holding a two-handed weapon *and* having something else in one of your hands actually makes the weapon considerably weaker, so don't do that.
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Flying Dice

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Re: Ambushes, crossbows and general surviving
« Reply #6 on: March 11, 2012, 11:56:31 pm »

Creativity, Musicality, Linguistic Ability, and (IIRC) Patience are all currently useless.

Incidentally, don't fast travel and you will hardly ever get ambushed.
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Matoro

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Re: Ambushes, crossbows and general surviving
« Reply #7 on: March 12, 2012, 02:26:23 am »

Sneaking can save your life. Go behind the tree and (s)neak.
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TheLinguist

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Re: Ambushes, crossbows and general surviving
« Reply #8 on: March 12, 2012, 02:33:15 am »

I typically go with at least expert dodging (IIRC) and superhuman agility, and even when I don't use a shield, I tend to survive against archers and ambushes. Be sure to disable the archers first, though.
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Quitschi

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Re: Ambushes, crossbows and general surviving
« Reply #9 on: March 12, 2012, 09:56:49 am »

Holding more shields does not increase block chance per se.
BUT the more shields you hold, the more experience your blocking skill gets
and thus it increases your blocking chance indirectly.

While holding something like 20 shhields you can get to be a legendary blocker in a matter of few blocked strikes.
I would consider this to be a bug though. (but beeing able to hold the shields is another one in the first place...)
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DarkWolfXV

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Re: Ambushes, crossbows and general surviving
« Reply #10 on: March 12, 2012, 11:19:11 am »

Yeah, kobolds headshotting me is frustrating,
or severing my arms with arrows so i cant fight back or block, even when being in full iron.
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Archereon

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Re: Ambushes, crossbows and general surviving
« Reply #11 on: March 12, 2012, 11:27:48 am »

Become a necromancer, and bring an army of about 100 undead.

Spam raise dead every turn until the ambush dies.
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Shinziril

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Re: Ambushes, crossbows and general surviving
« Reply #12 on: March 12, 2012, 01:20:44 pm »

Legendary Dodger+Legendary Shield User will keep you safe from (almost) anything.  Find a small animal, grab it with one hand so it can't escape, and let it flail at you.  Works great. 

Try it with a wolf or a dingo or something if you want more badass cred, but don't complain if he eats your face.
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Loud Whispers

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Re: Ambushes, crossbows and general surviving
« Reply #13 on: March 12, 2012, 01:50:19 pm »

A one day travel may be 30 or more minutes of real time walking without fast travel

A bit of an overstatement, it takes an hour rl time to cross a large mountain range over several in game days, but why take the long route when you can spend a few seconds in fast travel? :P

Still, be fast, and don't be stupid. Bring peasants. If you're wandering out in the wilds alone with enough fame to earn ambushes...

KlogW

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Re: Ambushes, crossbows and general surviving
« Reply #14 on: March 12, 2012, 02:39:45 pm »

Creativity, Musicality, Linguistic Ability, and (IIRC) Patience are all currently useless.

Incidentally, don't fast travel and you will hardly ever get ambushed.

Yep, that's what I read on the wiki, but somehow my mind decided to add intuition to that list, should have double checked.

I don't fast travel small distances so I can train ambusher and fight the wildlife, but I don't have the time nor the patience to walk long distances except when forced to (crossing mountains).

A bit of an overstatement

Well, to be fair all of my first post is kind of an overstatement :P, when I wrote it I was a bit pissed I lost just another promising adventurer to another ambush. Is not like ambushes are a certain death for me, I have survived a few, but still they are the first cause of death for my adventurers. Anyway, I feel now better prepared to deal with them, thank you all for your tips.
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