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Author Topic: THE STRESS IS KILLING ME  (Read 9508 times)

Loud Whispers

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Re: THE STRESS IS KILLING ME
« Reply #15 on: March 06, 2012, 02:10:03 pm »

The bot is right, this ASCII shouldn't cause you stress. Relish the FUN, don't hate it.

Do like the dwarves : die with a smiley face !

 :)

Live by the smile, die by the smile

Sutremaine

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Re: THE STRESS IS KILLING ME
« Reply #16 on: March 06, 2012, 06:11:18 pm »

Any advice?
1. Tasty roasts and a low pop cap. I set mine to 9 and lucked out with 19 adults, which is just enough to not get any moods. As long as you have masterwork food and somewhere to eat it, dwarves don't give a damn that they're fighting over one bed in the dormitory.

2. More dwarves with the Brewing skill. Only speed is affected by increased skill, so you can put it on as many dwarves as you need.

3. Herbalism. If you have (or create) a safe space for plant gathering you can get enough plants to brew right now. Herbalism skills up pretty quickly and consistently gets you stacks of 4 or 5 at high levels.

4. Got a bed / weapon rack / armour stand? There's your military framework. Pick out two dwarves and let them spar in their clothes. You'll need a shield if you want them to learn Shield User skill, but they'll learn fighting, dodging, wrestling, and a little Armour User skill without any special equipment.
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I am trying to make chickens lay bees as eggs. So far it only produces a single "Tame Small Creature" when a hen lays bees.
Honestly at the time, I didn't see what could go wrong with crowding 80 military Dwarves into a small room with a necromancer for the purpose of making bacon.

nenjin

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Re: THE STRESS IS KILLING ME
« Reply #17 on: March 06, 2012, 06:17:07 pm »

I also second a draconian pop cap. It makes the logistical challenges of getting ready for that 200+ fort much easier.

On the other hand, if you don't disable invaders or wall yourself off, you may get crushed before you're ready.
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Cautivo del Milagro seamos, Penitente.
Quote from: Viktor Frankl
When we are no longer able to change a situation, we are challenged to change ourselves.
Quote from: Sindain
Its kinda silly to complain that a friendly NPC isn't a well designed boss fight.
Quote from: Eric Blank
How will I cheese now assholes?
Quote from: MrRoboto75
Always spaghetti, never forghetti

Sutremaine

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Re: THE STRESS IS KILLING ME
« Reply #18 on: March 06, 2012, 06:47:00 pm »

That is true, since I only have 2 military training and even though they're in good bronze I don't fancy their chances against an ambush squad (I ran a fort like this once and lost a pretty good military dwarf to a headshot from behind. It was a steel helm too, I think. Real bad luck). So I keep the fort sealed off except for that two-week window three times a year when the traders turn up and hope that the enemies spawn on the tiles across the river.

I was working on a wagon run to shorten the amount of time the traders spend in the open and also to have a confined area for traps and other death-dealing devices, but I didn't get it done before invaders started showing up. Now I'm at that awkward stage when I'm getting enemies but can't really deal with them because I have other concerns (like setting up an FB silk farm). But I did get 9x8's worth of caverns mapped out before any FBs turned up, so I'm happy with that.
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I am trying to make chickens lay bees as eggs. So far it only produces a single "Tame Small Creature" when a hen lays bees.
Honestly at the time, I didn't see what could go wrong with crowding 80 military Dwarves into a small room with a necromancer for the purpose of making bacon.

Psieye

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Re: THE STRESS IS KILLING ME
« Reply #19 on: March 06, 2012, 07:18:35 pm »

Advice? Try DFhack's "workflow" function, which is the successor to Dwarf Foreman and such utilities of old. More specifically:

1. Design a "generic, do-all" custom profession in Dwarf Therapist for all the unimportant dwarves who will do every job where skill only affects speed, not quality.

2. As soon as you embark, dig the soil a bit and put down two 3x3 farms, set to do nothing but grow plump helmets. You will now not starve until the first big migrant wave.

3. Build some 4 stills or more. Set them all to "Brew dirnk" on repeat.

4. Run workflow in DFhack. Set "workflow amount 200 100" to automatically have those "Brew drink" jobs suspended and unsuspended to keep your stocks within the 100~200 booze unit limit. Of course, later in a fort's life you should change that to a higher limit.


Right, that's food and drink sorted. As for beds and a dining room, I bring 15 pieces of wood on embark so the carpenter can build 7 beds, 4 tables and 4 chairs as soon as the fort starts. Yes it's easy to just cut that wood down yourself and all, but having that peace of mind of getting this small but important-for-happiness task out of the way fast is worth it I'd say. Build the beds in a wide space underground and assign them as 1x1 bedrooms - more happiness for dwarves if they think they have their own bedroom even if we'd see that as a slightly spaced out dorm. Sure the wooden dining room will need to be replaced soon but just getting it out of the way until around autumn is peace of mind, which sounds like a worthwhile investment of embark points in your case.

I'd say you don't need an army until year 3 when the ambushes get bigger and the sieges might start coming. Until then, a sea of cage traps will suffice as well as netting you some goblin weapons (mass dump, mass reclaim, undump cages) if you have no weapons-grade metal on your map. Since the latest version has migrants typically come with a few ranks in military skills, worrying about a training framework is second priority to just having them well equipped and a tactically advantageous architecture (bonus points for using windows so goblin archers can't shoot you but see your dwarves so they charge at you).


Set goals for each year to keep yourself paced. You don't need everything to be perfect right from the start. Sort out when you need X and don't get distracted trying to do Y when it's not needed until later.
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Military Training EXP Analysis
Congrats, Psieye. This is the first time I've seen a derailed thread get put back on the rails.

nenjin

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Re: THE STRESS IS KILLING ME
« Reply #20 on: March 06, 2012, 07:43:52 pm »

The only thing you need "perfect" is your mining designation, because you can't smooth/engrave constructed walls. Although a handful of non-engraved walls in a 10,000 tile fortress isn't a big deal either.

If you don't have your entry way planned out though, all those extra ramps and improperly connected stairs look pretty fugly.
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Cautivo del Milagro seamos, Penitente.
Quote from: Viktor Frankl
When we are no longer able to change a situation, we are challenged to change ourselves.
Quote from: Sindain
Its kinda silly to complain that a friendly NPC isn't a well designed boss fight.
Quote from: Eric Blank
How will I cheese now assholes?
Quote from: MrRoboto75
Always spaghetti, never forghetti

TinyPirate

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Re: THE STRESS IS KILLING ME
« Reply #21 on: March 06, 2012, 11:09:52 pm »

Ooo is there a list of "jobs not affected by skill" somewhere? I can see anew design for my "plebian" class coming in my future!

Also, where is some good documentation for all the DFhack tools? I am sure the answer is obvious, but I have not found really good, clear dox yet.
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Sutremaine

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Re: THE STRESS IS KILLING ME
« Reply #22 on: March 07, 2012, 12:32:21 am »

Ooo is there a list of "jobs not affected by skill" somewhere? I can see anew design for my "plebian" class coming in my future!
Woodcutter
Animal dissector
Animal trainer
Beekeeper
Brewer
Butcher (is sometimes time-sensitive)
Cheesemaker
Lye maker
Milker
Miller
Potash maker
Presser
Shearer
Soaper
Spinner
Tanner (is always time-sensitive)
Thresher
Wood burner
Fish cleaner
Fish dissector
Glazer (in .31, probably hasn't changed)
Strand extractor (takes FOREVER with unskilled dwarves, hope for a migrant)
Pump operator
Organiser
Record keeper

Not too sure about the other animal-related jobs.
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I am trying to make chickens lay bees as eggs. So far it only produces a single "Tame Small Creature" when a hen lays bees.
Honestly at the time, I didn't see what could go wrong with crowding 80 military Dwarves into a small room with a necromancer for the purpose of making bacon.

TinyPirate

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Re: THE STRESS IS KILLING ME
« Reply #23 on: March 07, 2012, 02:03:13 am »

You're a star! Ta!
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Psieye

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Re: THE STRESS IS KILLING ME
« Reply #24 on: March 07, 2012, 03:45:16 pm »

Also, where is some good documentation for all the DFhack tools? I am sure the answer is obvious, but I have not found really good, clear dox yet.
[url]https://github.com/peterix/dfhack/blob/master/README.rst[url]

Also, further to Sutremaine's list, consider giving Architecture, Masonry and Mechanics for your 'plebians' while using workshop profiles to make sure the output from mason and mechanic's workshops are high quality. With a 'sea of cage traps', you'll want all your 'plebians' helping out with setting it up and reloading. Same with building a large wall.
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Military Training EXP Analysis
Congrats, Psieye. This is the first time I've seen a derailed thread get put back on the rails.

Spish

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Re: THE STRESS IS KILLING ME
« Reply #25 on: March 07, 2012, 08:25:09 pm »

I set mine to 9 and lucked out with 19 adults, which is just enough to not get any moods.
Why would you ever, under any circumstances, not want artifacts? ???

If it's because of the massive wealth generated by them, then that's extremely elfish of you.
« Last Edit: March 07, 2012, 08:49:18 pm by Spish »
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Ah, yes, I thought something was amiss. Now I see. There's not enough terrible things in the lakes.

nenjin

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Re: THE STRESS IS KILLING ME
« Reply #26 on: March 07, 2012, 08:51:54 pm »

Depending on what you're doing, it forces you to develop industries you don't want/weren't ready to get into yet. And the material requirements can easily screw you. When you've only got ~10 functioning dwarves for a 5-year construction plan, losing one to a mood is both irritating and devastating.

If you can't tell, I'm in the "I want to get stuff built before the FUN" column.
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Cautivo del Milagro seamos, Penitente.
Quote from: Viktor Frankl
When we are no longer able to change a situation, we are challenged to change ourselves.
Quote from: Sindain
Its kinda silly to complain that a friendly NPC isn't a well designed boss fight.
Quote from: Eric Blank
How will I cheese now assholes?
Quote from: MrRoboto75
Always spaghetti, never forghetti

Spish

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Re: THE STRESS IS KILLING ME
« Reply #27 on: March 07, 2012, 08:54:46 pm »

^ Buy four of every type of material from the caravan, problem solved :P
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Ah, yes, I thought something was amiss. Now I see. There's not enough terrible things in the lakes.

nenjin

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Re: THE STRESS IS KILLING ME
« Reply #28 on: March 07, 2012, 08:59:16 pm »

That's points I could be spending on a larger stockpile of food and booze. Plus, your civ doesn't have access to everything a mood can ask for.
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Cautivo del Milagro seamos, Penitente.
Quote from: Viktor Frankl
When we are no longer able to change a situation, we are challenged to change ourselves.
Quote from: Sindain
Its kinda silly to complain that a friendly NPC isn't a well designed boss fight.
Quote from: Eric Blank
How will I cheese now assholes?
Quote from: MrRoboto75
Always spaghetti, never forghetti

TinyPirate

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Re: THE STRESS IS KILLING ME
« Reply #29 on: March 08, 2012, 09:09:57 am »

Thanks, Psi!

Man, hit the strangest bug on my first immigrant wave. I had an air locked meeting zone for them on the ground floor (evil area, taking no chances) but they didn't want to come in. Just milled about. Then they did come in but refused to go underground, and my underground dwarfs refused to come up to do any digging or anything.

Trying to construct something - none of the stone is available.

Turned burrow on and off, deconstructed doors, nothing works. Did I stuff something up by air locking the migrants at the start (doors were all locked up too).

One of my original 7 was I the surface and he got trapped in the same bugged state. So strange! Anyone ever seen anything like this?
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