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Author Topic: Confession: I think vampires are a terrible addition  (Read 21306 times)

rtg593

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Re: Confession: I think vampires are a terrible addition
« Reply #60 on: March 05, 2012, 03:40:09 pm »

My main problem is they kill so much  I had a fort of 100 dwarfs with 5 vamps  a dwarf a season was passing away!
Why don't they drain people a little but keep them alive but weakened?

Dracula didn't kill the poor girl straight away!

Lock em away from the start like i do. Never had a vamp death in current fort.
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Elf Lover

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Re: Confession: I think vampires are a terrible addition
« Reply #61 on: March 05, 2012, 03:40:21 pm »

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Confession: I think vampires are a terrible addiction


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Re: Confession: I think vampires are a terrible addition
« Reply #62 on: March 05, 2012, 03:41:21 pm »

My main problem is they kill so much  I had a fort of 100 dwarfs with 5 vamps  a dwarf a season was passing away!
Why don't they drain people a little but keep them alive but weakened?

Dracula didn't kill the poor girl straight away!

Dwarfs aren't really known well for their abilities to control their drinking habits.

Wimopy

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Re: Confession: I think vampires are a terrible addition
« Reply #63 on: March 05, 2012, 03:46:49 pm »

My main problem is they kill so much  I had a fort of 100 dwarfs with 5 vamps  a dwarf a season was passing away!
Why don't they drain people a little but keep them alive but weakened?

Dracula didn't kill the poor girl straight away!

Dwarfs aren't really known well for their abilities to control their drinking habits.

That was a good one.

Also, funny thing is I didn't get any vampires, though I died at 70-ish dwarves... (Let's say the Circus and the walking dead timed the attack extremely well...)
Any prerequisites for getting vampires?

[Wrong forum, but I love them in adventure mode. Real challenge]
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Frogwarrior

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Re: Confession: I think vampires are a terrible addition
« Reply #64 on: March 05, 2012, 04:40:25 pm »

If you don't know how to scroll down the main menu to advanced worldgen, read the line for the 'edit parameters' hotkey, and scroll down the list of parameters until you see 'vampire' and hit enter twice (or look up how to do so on the wiki), that's really your own fault, isn't it?

I'll admit I didn't know about this, but when I did so I found Number of Vampire Curse Types already set to None. So changing it via world_gen.txt seems to have done the same thing.

But I'm still getting blood drained from sleeping dwarves, even though I had vampires disabled the only way(s) I've yet seen how to do it.

I'm not trying to be snarky here, I really am wondering how to stop this. I'd rather not play it with vampires at this point, they're too discouraging. It would be different if, as others have said, they occurred less frequently, but so far I've had vampires in the first fort of three different worlds after picking up DF a few days ago to play again.

Did you regen a new world? Changing the worldgen parameters only affects new worlds.
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Istas

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Re: Confession: I think vampires are a terrible addition
« Reply #65 on: March 05, 2012, 05:01:23 pm »

If you don't know how to scroll down the main menu to advanced worldgen, read the line for the 'edit parameters' hotkey, and scroll down the list of parameters until you see 'vampire' and hit enter twice (or look up how to do so on the wiki), that's really your own fault, isn't it?

I'll admit I didn't know about this, but when I did so I found Number of Vampire Curse Types already set to None. So changing it via world_gen.txt seems to have done the same thing.

But I'm still getting blood drained from sleeping dwarves, even though I had vampires disabled the only way(s) I've yet seen how to do it.

I'm not trying to be snarky here, I really am wondering how to stop this. I'd rather not play it with vampires at this point, they're too discouraging. It would be different if, as others have said, they occurred less frequently, but so far I've had vampires in the first fort of three different worlds after picking up DF a few days ago to play again.

Did you regen a new world? Changing the worldgen parameters only affects new worlds.

I made the changes to the parameters in the text file first, then deleted all existing worlds and generated a whole new one, yes.
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Springare

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Re: Confession: I think vampires are a terrible addition
« Reply #66 on: March 05, 2012, 05:02:38 pm »

Someone mentioned that the chance to get a vampire is to high.

I agree, because having a vampire could be something special, something you get every 5th fort or so, and than you have to tinker some dwarfy solutions out. But at the current state, you know there will be vampires, and have some counteractions in hand. Playing my first fort in the new version, i was very supprised to see a vampire so soon. But then...

Short:
Reaction for "vampires are special":  :-X *omygodavampire*
Reaction for "vampires as they are now":  ::) *i need a larger vampire-wrestle-arena...*
« Last Edit: March 05, 2012, 05:04:10 pm by Springare »
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Dark Like Snipes

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Re: Confession: I think vampires are a terrible addition
« Reply #67 on: March 05, 2012, 05:45:56 pm »

I generally think they're more trouble than they're worth. They're certainly far, far more common than they should be. I've had a vampire come in the first two migrant waves without fail in every fort that I've made/done testing in so far, which while being silly is also a pain because they tend to muck up your fort before it gets off the ground because you don't even have a sheriff yet (without resorting to metagame solutions anyway). If vampires are that common there should be some well-established ways of dealing with them; not sure why executing one with a pointy bit of wood to the heart would be a complicated affair, or even exile once they've been found out. Having some more weaknesses should also be on the table for them, like the usual garlic or animals reacting to them strangely, especially dogs. There should also be some skills in the game that have a chance to unmask intelligent creatures that are hiding something, basically judge of intent with more depth. Right now the metagamey solutions feel like cheating, but necessary cheating since there aren't really legitimate ways to deal with them.

I like vampires in concept, fortresses should certainly have some internal threats to worry about, but they're not executed very well at present. Vampires are something that should spring up maybe once or twice in three or four fortresses that make it to 200 population, something that is mostly a threat if you get too complacent about in preparing for it, like most threats in the game (I would support them being much deadlier and liable to cause widescale trouble in this scenario though). The situation as it is now with most forts having vampire mayors, book keepers, eternal lever pullers, and starvation chambers for all migrants being a necessity if you want to keep your important dwarves alive seems silly and makes vampires a far, far more crucial part of the game than they should be.
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slink

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Re: Confession: I think vampires are a terrible addition
« Reply #68 on: March 05, 2012, 06:16:34 pm »

The situation as it is now with most forts having vampire mayors, book keepers, eternal lever pullers, and starvation chambers for all migrants being a necessity if you want to keep your important dwarves alive seems silly and makes vampires a far, far more crucial part of the game than they should be.
Good summation.  It's more like Vampire Fortress than Dwarf Fortress.

The funny thing is that I expected to have terrible problems with necromancers raising my refuse pile.  Instead, I got to watch two waves of walking dead with their necromancers be wiped out by Vile Forces of Darkness that appeared moments later.  It was fairly hilarious.  A third wave was wiped out by my minefield between the drawbridges.  My refuse pile was just one level underground and I never saw so much as a twitch, even when I forgot to clear the pile into the incinerator (magma dump zone) in between clean-ups.
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Kestrel

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Re: Confession: I think vampires are a terrible addition
« Reply #69 on: March 05, 2012, 06:26:19 pm »

I love vampires as an addition but they're way too common.  That's not really terrible since they're a pretty minor nuisance, but I could see Toady toning their frequency back in future releases.  As more threats to your fort are developed, particularly in the Army Arc, I'd expect to see less of specific threats (ie vampires) to accommodate a greater diversity of challenges.
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Berserkenstein

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Re: Confession: I think vampires are a terrible addition
« Reply #70 on: March 05, 2012, 06:51:40 pm »

The situation as it is now with most forts having vampire mayors, book keepers, eternal lever pullers, and starvation chambers for all migrants being a necessity if you want to keep your important dwarves alive seems silly and makes vampires a far, far more crucial part of the game than they should be.
Good summation.  It's more like Vampire Fortress than Dwarf Fortress.

The funny thing is that I expected to have terrible problems with necromancers raising my refuse pile.  Instead, I got to watch two waves of walking dead with their necromancers be wiped out by Vile Forces of Darkness that appeared moments later.  It was fairly hilarious.  A third wave was wiped out by my minefield between the drawbridges.  My refuse pile was just one level underground and I never saw so much as a twitch, even when I forgot to clear the pile into the incinerator (magma dump zone) in between clean-ups.

Maybe there should be vampire hunters in the world that go around killing them during world gen.  Better yet, being able to assign a vampire hunter noble.  Perhaps making a vampire hunter arrive after a vampire migrant arrives. 

Urist Van Helsing.
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Nagassh

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Re: Confession: I think vampires are a terrible addition
« Reply #71 on: March 05, 2012, 07:06:07 pm »

I like the addition, but I think it would be better if vampires had a "chance" to kill their victim. It makes no sense to wipe out your food supply.
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Mitchewawa

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Re: Confession: I think vampires are a terrible addition
« Reply #72 on: March 05, 2012, 07:21:03 pm »

You lucky people. I've had two 200-strong forts without a single vampire! That blows, because vampires are a fantastic addition. Another dimension to this complex game, adding its own strategies and complexities.

We do not play Dwarf Fortress because it is easy, we play it because it is hard.
« Last Edit: March 06, 2012, 01:13:32 pm by Mitchewawa »
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Jingles

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Re: Confession: I think vampires are a terrible addition
« Reply #73 on: March 05, 2012, 07:29:48 pm »

I think Vampires are a fantastic addition.  They add good things to the game.  It getys one more involved with the dwarfs and makes their community seem more real.  As for the deaths they cause, they are merely a drop in the puddle.  I've had more normal dwarfs kill in a  mindless rage than I've had victims to vampires.  It'd be cool if there was more mechanics to deal with monster hunting though, such a an investigation skill, or a lore skill.  Then you could make yourself an Urist McHelsing to run around your fort.  Man it's totally badass.

Right now the best you can do is make  your very own McDracula's.  Which is also really bad ass.

Vampires are bad ass.  I think if popular culture has taught us anything, it is that.

Kestrel

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Re: Confession: I think vampires are a terrible addition
« Reply #74 on: March 05, 2012, 07:45:01 pm »

I've had two 200-strong forts without a single vampire!



Have you tried genning a new world?
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