Topic: Brain Stem project - Current stage version 1! (Read 10710 times)

Nihilist · « **on:** March 02, 2012, 09:20:17 pm »

<insert placeholder text here>

Latest version here!
http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=5870

Spits the brain into 3 parts, the cerebrum, cerebellum and connective tissue.
Damage to the cerebrum causes nausea and unconsciousness, while the cerebellum acts as a backup thought source. the connective tissue wraps around both parts and can cause severe bleeding.
eventually I want damage to the cerebellum to cause motor distress - but that kink hasn't quite been worked out yet.

This should work with any version .31 on onwards of current posting

Original OP

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Being rather unsatisfied with things dieing instantly if brained, even if just bruised or cut, I'd embarked to expand on that behavior.

Project goals:
1) Stop damaged brains from causing instant death.
2) Have a damage brain cause other issues

My first thought was to create a new body part called STEM:brain stem:STP give it a RELSIZE of 20(brain is 200) and attach it to the head with [CONTYPE:HEAD]. It has [INTERNAL][SMALL][NERVOUS](no brainstem no breathing!) and most importantly [THOUGHT]. I gave it [CATEGORY:BRAIN] to make the skull wrap around it and started testing.

This first run worked rather well. A brained dwarf is knocked unconscious but is not killed(thanks to 2 BPs with [THOUGHT]), subsequent blows will eventually tear apart the brain stem with skull shards completely killing the dwarf. However the skull was usually pushed through the stem on the 2nd or third hit to the head. Nice on paper, not as nice in practice with the first braining knocking the dwarf unconscious lending all subsequent blows to the head.
That wasn't really a big issue since goal 1 was met, but there is a much larger issue... if I want this extended to non-dwarves I would need to add :STEM: to every creature 0.0!
So I went back to the drawing board and applied some KISS philosophy, I simply added [THOUGHT] to the NECK entry in body_default. The NECK is essentially the upperspine, so it being destroyed causes death via suffication anywho.
In limited testing, this seems to happen less often than the STEM getting destroyed was.
I'm toying around with the idea of adding [MAJOR_ARTERY] to the brain as well, but again that's a lot of creature level work, plus it may conflict with this next part.

With goal 1 satisfied I'm moving on to goal 2, which will involve a syndrome caused by brain damage. The initial idea is to has the brain bleed a different blood that the rest of the creature, or be filled with a substance the escapes on rupturing the the brain. It'll have many low probability syndromes attached, with a few higher probability ones as well.

Issue being, I'm not exactly sure how to do this. Can you attach a syndrome to a template? that would be the simplest route I think, but I'm rather unfamiliar with creature modding on this level.
Any thoughts or pointers? I've been digging through the wiki but so far have come up dry.

Meph · « **Reply #1 on:** March 02, 2012, 09:51:48 pm »

Impressive.

You can attach the syndrome to an inorganic mat, and make the new "brain blood" template use this. I will be following this

Icefire2314 · « **Reply #2 on:** March 02, 2012, 10:55:54 pm »

Looks fun

I hate it when my dwarves die early due to getting punched with inconveniently breaks their skull open and smashes their brain apart. Sucks. Of course, when it's MY dwarves doing that... well...

Nihilist · « **Reply #3 on:** March 02, 2012, 11:12:25 pm »

Ninja Zombie assassins are what got me started up on this hehe.

Nihilist · « **Reply #4 on:** March 02, 2012, 11:35:37 pm »

Hmm So I get how to make the new brain blood template, but I'm struggling on how to make the brain bleed something different.. unless can I change the tissue template from local tissue mat to something different... hmm <runs off to test>

arzzult · « **Reply #5 on:** March 02, 2012, 11:37:22 pm »

Quote from: Nihilist on March 02, 2012, 09:20:17 pm

That wasn't really a big issue since goal 1 was met, but there is a much larger issue... if I want this extended to non-dwarves I would need to add :STEM: to every creature 0.0!

You're just not thinking creatively enough. You could simply add the stem as part of the already existing brain entry and it would be auto included to every thing with a :BRAIN:

Edit: Also I enjoy adding the [JOINT] tage to the neck and spine entries personally.

Sutremaine · « **Reply #6 on:** March 02, 2012, 11:46:13 pm »

Make the brain stem out of some other material and set it to have whatever properties the iron man has that makes it spew gas when hit. You should be able to change the state of the material to something that doesn't make such a display.

Nihilist · « **Reply #7 on:** March 02, 2012, 11:53:46 pm »

Quote from: Sutremaine on March 02, 2012, 11:46:13 pm

Make the brain stem out of some other material and set it to have whatever properties the iron man has that makes it spew gas when hit. You should be able to change the state of the material to something that doesn't make such a display.

I'm leaning towards this, well more spefically I may need to convert the brain for it to work right. This stem is functionally the upperspines nervous tissue now, it it being damaged is fatal unless you have [NO_BREATHE]

edit: hmm maybe not. The iron man has a gas layer under its skin. Not sure how to apply that to a body part.

Okay here is specially where I'm stuck.
Blood is set with
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:BLOOD:BLOOD_TEMPLATE]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:BLOOD:LIQUID]
Which I'm a bit familiar with from making poison blood. What I don't know is how to set a blood type to a specific part or enter more than one blood type. I have the feeling from looking at the tags its hardcoded to be universal. I mean it makes sense right?
Secretions are out, for obvious reasons.. <wanders off pondering>

Addict · « **Reply #8 on:** March 03, 2012, 12:08:09 am »

*bow*

this is amazing.
I may have to take up a second programming language to lend a hand to projects like this.

I approve.
Especially because its unrealistic for a stampeding rhinocerous to die and stop stampeding forward from a little bit of brain death.

Courtesy Arloban · « **Reply #9 on:** March 03, 2012, 12:50:44 am »

Quote from: Nihilist on March 02, 2012, 11:53:46 pm

Quote from: Sutremaine on March 02, 2012, 11:46:13 pm
Make the brain stem out of some other material and set it to have whatever properties the iron man has that makes it spew gas when hit. You should be able to change the state of the material to something that doesn't make such a display.
I'm leaning towards this, well more spefically I may need to convert the brain for it to work right. This stem is functionally the upperspines nervous tissue now, it it being damaged is fatal unless you have [NO_BREATHE]

edit: hmm maybe not. The iron man has a gas layer under its skin. Not sure how to apply that to a body part.

Okay here is specially where I'm stuck.
Blood is set with
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:BLOOD:BLOOD_TEMPLATE]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:BLOOD:LIQUID]
Which I'm a bit familiar with from making poison blood. What I don't know is how to set a blood type to a specific part or enter more than one blood type. I have the feeling from looking at the tags its hardcoded to be universal. I mean it makes sense right?
Secretions are out, for obvious reasons.. <wanders off pondering>

based on my meatmod selecting tissues in specific bodyparts works this way...
--after the use material templates:
      [USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:SYNDROME_BLOOD:BLOOD_TEMPLATE]
         [Put your Syndrome Here]
--after the use tissue templates:
      [USE_TISSUE_TEMPLATE:SYNDROME_SPINE:SPINE_TEMPLATE]
         [TISSUE_MATERIAL:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:SYNDROME_BLOOD]
--after the tl major arteries:
   [SELECT_TISSUE_LAYER:BLOOD:BY_CATEGORY:SPINE]
      [SET_LAYER_TISSUE:SYNDROME_SPINE]
      [TL_RELATIVE_THICKNESS:50]

Hugo_The_Dwarf · « **Reply #10 on:** March 03, 2012, 02:18:28 am »

another great thing to add into Regen, along with gentials for an extra spot to cause pain

Batmantis · « **Reply #11 on:** March 03, 2012, 07:43:48 am »

Using this as something to go off as suggested, which is how i interpreted the Iron man acting as it does;

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

and Modifying the brain to show something like this:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

and the adding this to my [only female caste entry yet, as i have them totally seperate] Human:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Brain_blood atm is just a copy of Creature_extract_template, as was the case with the iron man.

Brain membrane defined in tissue template; nothing special here.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Im going to test and post result, if the only contribution i make is what not to do, well thats okay.

Edit:what i did find was a lot of punching skull fragments though brain's brain tissue; im far to tired to figure out anymore and investigate weather the Syn is taking effect, I'll just leave this here for now and return tomorrow to see if there's been anything constructive in my absence.

Kudos to Op for the great idea, and hope this helps you cause.

P.s; im still learning, this could be 100% misguided and wrong for all i know heh.

Trapezohedron · « **Reply #12 on:** March 03, 2012, 09:30:38 am »

If I still know my raw-fu correctly, the brain gas will spread to the outsides of the head when the brain is damaged, possibly inflicting both the attacker and the victim with brain damage.

Di · « **Reply #13 on:** March 03, 2012, 09:55:39 am »

As for adding stem to every creature arrzult's right:

Code: (body_default) [Select]

[BODY:BRAIN]
	[BP:BRAIN:brain:STP][CONTYPE:HEAD][THOUGHT][INTERNAL][SMALL][CATEGORY:BRAIN]
		[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:200]
	[BP:IBRAIN:brain stem:STP][CONTYPE:HEAD][THOUGHT][INTERNAL][SMALL][CATEGORY:BRAIN]
		[DEFAULT_RELSIZE:20]

Code: (b_detail_plan) [Select]

[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:STANDARD_HEAD_POSITIONS]
.......
[BP_RELATION:BY_CATEGORY:SKULL:AROUND:BY_CATEGORY:BRAIN:100]
[BP_RELATION:BY_TOKEN:BRAIN:AROUND:BY_CATEGORY:IBRAIN:10]
.....

gives it to everyone, buut during testing punching proved to tear the stem first and despite stem being identical to the brain subjects always suffocated. On the other hand, right now, I'm being chased by an individual whom I had hacked in the head with adamantine halberd for three times giving him some time to recover.

Edit: Weird, but this effect is caused by declaration order. I had made stem hundred time bigger than brain and damaging it still caused suffocation, but when I'd swapped lines so stem was declared first they became suffocating from brain damage.
Editt:

Quote from: Nihilist on March 02, 2012, 09:20:17 pm

So I went back to the drawing board and applied some KISS philosophy, I simply added [THOUGHT] to the NECK entry in body_default. The NECK is essentially the upperspine, so it being destroyed causes death via suffication anywho.
In limited testing, this seems to happen less often than the STEM getting destroyed was.

In my testing this made creatures unkillable via head damage.

Nihilist · « **Reply #14 on:** March 03, 2012, 01:30:53 pm »

Wow lots to process this morning.

@Courtsey Arloban, this is brilliant! I may have figure out how to do what I want off this, though am having an issue with

Quote

after the use tissue templates:
[USE_TISSUE_TEMPLATE:SYNDROME_SPINE:SPINE_TEMPLATE]
[TISSUE_MATERIAL:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:SYNDROME_BLOOD]

Bolded section is giving me this in errorlog.txt
*** Error(s) found in the file "raw/objects/creature_standard.txt"
DWARF:Unrecognized Creature Token: TISSUE_MATERIAL

@Di, oo interesting on the declaration order, when I get to doing balance testing i'll try this out. And yea, the current upper spine solution does make creatures unskilled by head trauma - kinda of. Against blunt weapons the first hit will knock them unconscous, and the subseqent hits will usally damage the upperspine since its CONTYPE:HEAD. I haven't tested with edged weapons though, I'm hoping decaps will occur in those cases, or cutting out the throat.

News:

Author Topic: Brain Stem project - Current stage version 1! (Read 10710 times)

Nihilist

Brain Stem project - Current stage version 1!

Meph

Re: Brain Stem project - Current stage Testing theories

Icefire2314

Re: Brain Stem project - Current stage Testing theories

Nihilist

Re: Brain Stem project - Current stage Testing theories

Nihilist

Re: Brain Stem project - Current stage Testing theories

arzzult

Re: Brain Stem project - Current stage Testing theories

Sutremaine

Re: Brain Stem project - Current stage Testing theories

Nihilist

Re: Brain Stem project - Current stage Testing theories

Addict

Re: Brain Stem project - Current stage Testing theories

Courtesy Arloban

Re: Brain Stem project - Current stage Testing theories

Hugo_The_Dwarf

Re: Brain Stem project - Current stage Testing theories

Batmantis

Re: Brain Stem project - Current stage Testing theories

Trapezohedron

Re: Brain Stem project - Current stage Testing theories

Di

Re: Brain Stem project - Current stage Testing theories

Nihilist

Re: Brain Stem project - Current stage Testing theories