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[DoomOnion]

...THIS IS WHAT I WAS TALKING ABOUT.

Come on, I know you guys are all smart enough to see the argument and logic I am portraying behind that example.

*facepalms*

[jhxmt]

What I think you're saying is that it might not be perfect on release, but that EA tend to patch a lot post-release, and that it may or may not therefore end up as a good game.

I'm not disagreeing with that.  I'm saying that, if that's the case, I'd happily try it out (either free or at a reduced rate) on release, and stick with it while it was buggy.  If the game is not good on release then I do not want to pay a 'good game' price for it on release.

Of course, given that EA tend not to release playable demos, tend to overhype every single game they release until you can't tell decent from awful, and tend to charge through the nose both on release and for 'content' released later on (which often inherently contain system/stability patches as well, locking out those early adopters who don't want to pay more for content), this is not a model that I am willing engage with.

So yes, I might play it.  In a couple of years.  When the price has dropped, and the two hundred 'new building' DLCs have all been released and are available in a bundle.  Basically, I might buy it when I'm confident it's actually a full game rather than an elongated, costly demo and/or beta test.

Edit: actually, I may have misread, as you may be talking about improvements over the course of a series rather than over the course of patches.  In which case I disagree.  The Sims 3 frustrates me far more than the Sims 2 ever did, which was more frustrating than The Sims - primarily because of the increased pressure to buy micro-transaction DLCs for each game.  My above points therefore stand.  If EA follow the arc they're on, I very much doubt that SC5 will be anything like 'content complete' until at least a year or two after release.

[Spitfire]

Simcity 5 is not going to be a serious city builder? I thought it was pretty serious, what did I miss?/

I've got my bad impression on SC5 of every video I could get my hands on. And this review review confirmed my impression.

[DoomOnion]

Simcity 5 is not going to be a serious city builder? I thought it was pretty serious, what did I miss?/

I've got my bad impression on SC5 of every video I could get my hands on. And this review review confirmed my impression.

Well, that's a clincher right over there.
Since I just made a grand speech about how games are more of an experience than the sum of its whole.

[Guardian G.I.]

Leaked SimCity 2013's manual.

[10ebbor10]

I never said it was a good game. I just said I don't dare to hope for it being an amazing game.

EA spent the last ten years giving SimCity fans ill-considered spin-offs and unplayable cell-phone games, why should they give this new game the benefit of the doubt?

Edit: @ above: Once more reconfirmed my doubts.

I'll list stuff here.

You can participate in up to 10 regions at a time

Remember, that you can't just safe a region on your computer, so you will have to remove old cities if you want to play a new one.

Sim city Store

Day one DLC, how could we expect otherwise?

[jhxmt]

Leaked SimCity 2013's manual.

Is this genuine?  Just curious.  If it is, one thing that makes me cautious is the lack of a simple new game - you have to 'choose' a Region Map, and then 'claim' a city site...is this always-online, and am I always going to be competing against other players?

Also, no high/medium/low density zoning?  I just zone resi/comm/ind and it builds up the density on its own?  Hmm.  Not sure whether that's an improvement or a step backward.  Reduces micromanagement, I guess, but what if I *want* to make that beautiful lakeside shore into a heaving industrial dystopia rather than a mildly factory-scattered beach?

SimCity Store - colour me unsurprised.

[10ebbor10]

Sim City is always online. All saves saved on the cloud. You can however start a private, 1 person multiplayer game. (Also, max 10 saves at once, so you can't copy saves, or go back to older saves)

Max Density is based on road size, so you can control it somewhat.

Oh, and don't think you can build everything from scratch. For example; you will be forced to dump sewage untill you get a certain city hall upgrade, and you can't acces several features untill you do certain achievements. Oh, and unless you build a certain city hall upgrade, you can only set general tax levels (identical for com, habitat and industry) and unless you build the departement of finance, you can't tax rich different from poor.

[Korbac]

Oh, and don't think you can build everything from scratch. For example; you will be forced to dump sewage untill you get a certain city hall upgrade, and you can't acces several features untill you do certain achievments.

In fairness, if you were building up a town and the country was, eh, hard up on money, I don't see why they'd instantly go in with an uber duber sparkly cleanup system, maximum green power plant, universities, massive hospitals, etc.

Although I thought dumping sewage was something very few first world countries do any more?

[10ebbor10]

No, I mean the problem is that each city is going to start of the same way. I can't simply say that I want to build a small rich resort. I will first have to move all the way up through the abitrary progress table till I can buy my special upgrade, then clean up the mess, while still trying to maintain the population level required for the arbitrary upgrade to work.

You can't even build a firestation without a townhall upgrade.

[dennislp3]

Where are you getting all your info? I played the beta...and never upgraded the townhall once...and I had everything you described...

[10ebbor10]

Where are you getting all your info? I played the beta...and never upgraded the townhall once...and I had everything you described...

An apparently leaked version of the manual was posted on the page before.

[dennislp3]

ahh didn't read it...also...its apparently not even complete...and looks like a word for word copy paste of most the stuff you see in game...I am gonna call fake or horribly incomplete...cause you don't have to upgrade buildings to get other buildings except in a very small set of cases...but no much more or worse than in SC4...its your basic formula of hitting pop and other easy requirements to unlock stuff.

Also after having horribly opposed it at first and then playing the beta...I do have to say I feel better about it then before...

I still do not agree with the online always BS and I don't care for the smaller map sizes.

But the basics that make it simcity are still there...there is zero loss of information that I can see, zoning is not present but instead much more intuitive and "organic" feeling and the smaller maps and intercity stuff forces specialization to a degree...which honestly makes a bit of sense and makes it better. I think they can handle it better...but thats how they are doing it.

You can still make an industrial city and then have a commercial/residential only city if you want as the premise of shared labor and what not has not changed.

The EA shop thing was never present in beta and I am skeptical about its existence as stated in that supposed manual...maybe it is...maybe it isn't...I have yet to see anything official regarding an in game store thingy like that.

I don't agree with plenty of things in it...and that for me makes it a "not worth $60" title...but so far..I do not see it as a total flop or piece of shit.

[10ebbor10]

I hope it is. I don't mind the limiting of the higher tier buildings, but limiting tax options or forcing people to use a single option for some time is not fun.

[dennislp3]

Eh tax options were only limited based on population...and not once did I have an issue with it...only got the option once it actually mattered and those people could even move in in the first place