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[A_Fey_Dwarf]

I have been wondering what kind of deflection bonus shields get depending on their quality and metal. I know how both of these multipliers effect armors block value, but I'm not sure if its the same with shields. So I was wondering if it would be a waste to forge all of my military an adamanite shield when they do the same thing as an iron shield. Would I be better off making plate mail with this valuable but limited resource?

[ May 17, 2008: Message edited by: A_Fey_Dwarf ]

[Kagus]

I believe it changes the block chance the same way it changes any other value.  If it doesn't, then there would be no difference between adamantine-shield block rates and wooden-shield block rates.

But even if it doesn't change the block rates, shields provide an extra layer of armor to the arm that they're on.  That's a standard armor value, something that it most certainly does have an effect on.  But, that's only the one arm.  Your choice, really.

Oh, and adamantine is much lighter than iron.  You won't need as high a skill in armor use in order for your troops to move with a reasonable amount of speed.

[umiman]

Iron ore weighs 300.

Adamantine weighs 25.

A military dwarf wearing all adamantine weighs around the same as a naked dwarf with a big hat.

I don't know what this comment's purpose is.

[Onul]

Naked dwarves with big hats are deadly, so.

Go from there.

[Styrre]

Just remember that even a Champion with a full set of masterwork Adamantine plate  + shield will quickly fall prey to any ranged weaponry.

[BurnedToast]

quote:Originally posted by Styrre:
<STRONG>Just remember that even a Champion with a full set of masterwork Adamantine plate  + shield will quickly fall prey to any ranged weaponry.</STRONG>

this is just plain false. I've had champions in middle quality leather armor destroy multiple ranged ambushes alone. Legendary wrestler (makes them dodge more) and legendary shield use means they will almost never get hit. Add high quality adamantine gear on top of that and the extremely rare arrow that hits them has an extremely low chance of killing them.

for the original poster, I usually only give adamantine to my best champions anyway so they get shields too. Truthfully it does not matter, once they hit legendary+5 wrestler and shield use they are pretty much immortal even with just leather armor so it's more of a status symbol then anything.

[Lyrax]

Agreed w/ above.  Legendary wrestlers with legendary shield use are nearly immortal.  If they have a good shield (like adamantine), they can go into battle with no armor, just a shield, and never get hit.

Whenever I have a champion fall to ranged weapons, it's because they don't have wrestling or shield use high enough.

[A_Fey_Dwarf]

O.K. Its just that I am attempting my first 'military as only defense' fortress and its only year halfway through the second year and already about 20 military dwarves have been shot by marksgoblins. The adamantine sheilds that 2 of my hammerdwarfs were wielding seemed useless so i posted this topic to help decide what to do.

Thanks for the help, I guess ill just have to train my hammerdwarves in wrestling instead of with a silver hammer.

[chaoticag]

according to the wiki, adamantium = 5 x iron
masterwork = 2.0 times object
therefore a masterwork adm. shield is ten times better than iron.

EDIT: plate mail might be a good idea, but I would rather have weapons instead.
My opinion entirely of course.

Just remember that a shield dosen't block all types of damage.

[ May 18, 2008: Message edited by: chaoticag ]

[A_Fey_Dwarf]

quote: according to the wiki, adamantium = 5 x iron
masterwork = 2.0 times object
therefore a masterwork adm. shield is ten times better than iron.

That is for armor's damage absorption, not for shields. It says down the bottom of the armor page that shields have a 20% block chance. I posted this topic to see if this percentage differs with the quality and material of the shield.

[umiman]

I think the only real difference you will see in the performance of your troops when you switch from steel to adamantine is that everyone moves so much faster. Other than that, dwarven skill usually takes precedence over armor quality. Still, it's better to be safe than sorry.

Just keep in mind that it takes a lot of adamantine to forge stuff for that fully armored dwarf, so you'd want to make sure the smith is legendary +10.

[A_Fey_Dwarf]

Oh... My armorer is only competent. But its not like I have fuel to waste training him as i'm restricted to wood burning.

[Doppel]

quote:Originally posted by umiman:
<STRONG>I think the only real difference you will see in the performance of your troops when you switch from steel to adamantine is that everyone moves so much faster. Other than that, dwarven skill usually takes precedence over armor quality. Still, it's better to be safe than sorry.

Just keep in mind that it takes a lot of adamantine to forge stuff for that fully armored dwarf, so you'd want to make sure the smith is legendary +10.</STRONG>

What does legendary + 10 mean? Does it mean that legendary isn't enough when forging/craftiing/whatever extremely valuable stuff?

[Styrre]

quote:Originally posted by BurnedToast:
<STRONG>

this is just plain false. I've had champions in middle quality leather armor destroy multiple ranged ambushes alone. Legendary wrestler (makes them dodge more) and legendary shield use means they will almost never get hit. Add high quality adamantine gear on top of that and the extremely rare arrow that hits them has an extremely low chance of killing them.
</STRONG>

Then the RNG simply hates me. I now wince every time I see a green "g". xD

[Thasero]

Dwarves keep gaining skill even after the skill display stops at "Legendary".  Legendary + X means X skill ranks after legendary.  I think I read that the highest meaningful skill rank you can attain is legendary + 5, which in practice is what all of your miners and engravers will be at if you make them do any meaningful amount of work after they turn legendary.  It's also what you get if you have an already-skilled dwarf make an artifact from a mood other than possession.