Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[10ebbor10]

1 plot got irrigation.

[andy_t_roo]

fixed the plan for that - now have soldiers building irrigation before moving onto helping with other things


10ebbor10:
is the production of sulfuric acid via [size=78%]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lead_chamber_process[/size] a resonable thing to do?


or is going to this detail just too much bother for you?
(once we have sulfuric acid, we can process ores better, make plastic, and manufacture all sorts of things needed for restarting civilization)

[Mr. Palau]

Won't irragation require us to do more water runs in order to get the water to supply the irragation? Don't most forms of irragation require lots of water?

[andy_t_roo]

no, the irrigation as i have described it doesn't use any more water than baseline, and if carefully used it woukl actually use less water, as it looses less to evaporation.


Most irrigation using overhead sprinklers wastes water to evaporation, at the benifit of not needing much machinery to spray water all over the place.

[10ebbor10]

fixed the plan for that - now have soldiers building irrigation before moving onto helping with other things


10ebbor10:
is the production of sulfuric acid via [size=78%]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lead_chamber_process[/size] a resonable thing to do?


or is going to this detail just too much bother for you?
(once we have sulfuric acid, we can process ores better, make plastic, and manufacture all sorts of things needed for restarting civilization)

I'm not going to keep track of how good the metal produced is. Is you have the lead and stuff and want to do it, I'll give you a bonus for it. Keep in mind that the nanofactory can create plastics and such too whitout such a big investment.( The nanofactory is in fact capable of producing carbonnanofibers is you give it a log). If you repair it, that is.

[Argonnek]

You said earlier that we can grow whatever plants we like. If that is so, then I believe that we should grow spices (peppercorns, cloves, mustardseed, etc.) for trade. It isn't often considered, but having some spices to make more varied flavors is great for morale and great for the ones who control the supply. I'm not sure how this would fit in with andy's plan, though.

[andy_t_roo]

The problem is that we are man-power limited at the moment (* Is unable to be reduced easily), which is why a drive for the nanofactory / electrical power is needed, to automate various things.
*20 farmers
*10 furnace
*10 manufacturing various stuff
20 working on the lab
30 people switching between wood/food, and biological processing
*10 people doing random things (guard, build the radio, etc ...)

current medium term food plans are to get irrigation on all 4 plots.
plant trees
build a 5th plot
i was thinking a bio-fuels crop on the 5th, and possibly switching 1 of the grain over also - liquid fuels would be extremely valuable, and worst case scenario, we can run our generator off them, to give us a high quality electricity supply.


10Ebbor10: Can i have some stats on plants for :
farmed biofuels,
the trees we can plant (wood focus / food,wood split/ or food focus, although i think the cylce i proposed earlier is a good tradeoff there, getting wood costs us lots of water for growing trees, but harvesting food takes manpower instead)
spices

[Mr. Palau]

By the way the Bellows can also pressurize air if we don't want ot go with a surface supplied air plan.

What I think we should do is forge some basic mining equipment to get past that obstruction, and then have one guy supplied with air from the surface travel to the bottom of the bunker and postion the gas tank down there, with multiple holes that lead to leather tubes that have a range that would allow the sceintists to reach the life support system so they can begin repairing it.

This would be much more efficent in terms of length of leather tube required. It takes 300 meters of leather tubes to get to the bottom of the bunker, and lkely some 25 or so more meters of leather tube to reach the life support systems, that comes out to 1625 meters of leather tubes to have a team of five sceintists working on the life support system. I don't think we even have that much leather, let alone the time to make it all, given that in two weeks our team has only managed to make 125 meters of leather tubes. With the gas tank down there we only require 425 meters of leather tube, much more efficent obviosly, and could be done much quicker. Assuming that we will make 125 meters of leather tube on average per week then we will have enough to accomplish this in roughly five weeks, not counting the glue needed to make it all air tight and the meters of tubes used for the irragation project.

If the tank isn't out of gas by the time we have the leather tubes required we might have to make our own but that wouldn't be so hard.

!!!ONE STEP CLOSER TO THE BUNKER, hurray  !!!

[10ebbor10]

Maybe you should get some kind of light so that you can see what you were doing. Also 25 m to reach the lifesupport is a bit optimistic. (Also the lifesupport is fine, it's just offline, because the bunkers nuclear generator is down.)

[andy_t_roo]

The gas tank holds 2 weeks worth of gas, and yes, the bellows were originally constructed with the idea of charging the gas tanks.
This week i switched the power from the generator to the windmill, because we don't know how much power the windmill generates. If it is less than 110 per week, then we will need to be quite careful.


Also, i was going to use some of the metal we have to make pipes, with the extrusion press we are making this week.
(if the armor plates are 1.5m by 1.5m and 2cm thick, then that is equal to 30m of pipe with an internal diamter of 9cm, external diamter 10cm. ...
FakeEdit: [size=78%]http://www.onesteelbuildingservices.com/pdffiles/OneSteel_%20Pipe_Catalogue_web.pdf[/size]
15cm pipe with a wall thickness of 2.7mm can withstand over 300 atm. of pressure (it is rated to be safe at 34.4MPa, and atmospheric is 101kPa)
ok, taking the same volume of steel, and using a 3mm walled, 10cm pipe, you get 96m. and this pipe won't leak ...


Ok, next week we are going to forge 500m of pipe. and cut some wooden blocks for junctions (cut a cube, drill 2 intersecting 10cm holes to the center. When installing glue a piece of leather pipe around the lot to give strength and stability

[Mr. Palau]

HMM... there is no oxygen in the bunker so that rules out combustion for a light source... will return later with less obvious solution.

___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

*some time later*

Possible non-combusion light sources:
Oh thank you indians for your complex ceremonies! And Wikipedia for catalouging what I doubtlessly would have considered useless information before!

So heres what I found, The Ute People (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ute_Tribe) have this buffalo rawhide rattle, filled with quartz crystals, and when shaken the rattle gives off light because of the mechanical stress the quartz crystals are subjected to. Better yet Quartz is found in a  cyrastaline form natrually and is the second most abundant matieral on the Earth's crust  ! Now the hide of the buffalo is just thin enough to allow the light to shine through, with dog leather being thiner than Buffalo hide we can make the rattle out of dog leather  and use it to light our way. Just have a small piece of wood attached to a leather sack containing quartz and swing it around, so simple you could have one of the children do it (not literally though, do we even have children? we haven't even been here 9 months right?).

Now all we have to do to get this light source is have 5 scientists go and find some quartz, it doesn't weather so it can be found near rivers, where most other stone would have eroded into sand or basic soil, so have those sceintists look by the river valley, have them accompeny the soldiers on the water run. When they get back have them construct the rattle.

__________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

I never thought that the succes of rebuilding ciilization would rest on a rattle.

* it took like 2 minutes to get those lines to work, so counter initutive.

[andy_t_roo]

for light ...
we have electricity -- just carry a spool of wire with a boulb on the end - it should be qute easy to do, as we have re-wired 6 rooms in the lab, so should have a good few hundred m of wire

and this only needs to work untill we can patch some power into the bunker

the cable for the light can be any we find around.

Either that or we remove 1 10 energy unit module from our big capacitor bank, and just run with a std. torch.
(i would assume the energy it takes to run the fence for a week would be easily enough to run a single torch intermittently)

[hachnslay]

We might want to work on an atmospheric water collector to make us independant from the nearest water source.
Is there morning fog?
Fog fences.
otherwise we might want to use the salt to create brine and construct a solar water facility:reflect sunlight to heat brine,  collect water vapour, receive water. - an oversated brine solution will collect air humidity.


Look/ask for maps of the surrounding area, there might be other lootable places nearby, nuclear shelters in abandoned cities might contain additional workforce. There has always (twice) been interest in nuclear shelters when threats arose, which should increase our chance to find one or two in abandoned pre war settlements. The unlooted ones would be tightly sealed.
If we can obtain aluminum dust and bake it with rust we can make a crude termite. We only need a signal torch to light it and burn through the shelter doors.

Also: defenses in mine form might be useful. tell the traders you have those plans, though and plot a save path for them first.

[Mr. Palau]

uhh I forgot we had electricty... (facepalm)... but at least I learned something about obscure tribal practices and the mechanical properties of quartz  .

About the rain water or fog collection, we should integrate that into the irragation system. I assume that this being the former amazon rainforest, it rains a lot, but we just aren't told about it because it is normally inconsquential. We should erect a wooden roof across a large area of the compound, starting in the center and radiating off, that is tilted inward to feed the water it collects into a tank, which should have holes leading to the irragation pipes, and another leading into a bucket or other container that we can get drinking water from. Normally rain water isn't used for drinking water because it could contian things like bird faeces or pollutants, but our post-nuclear wastland has no pollutants besides the increased levels of radiation so we should be fine drinking it, we will get cancer from the ground anyway, unless sceince had a cure for that before the apocalpypse (I never thought of how hard itis to spell that word, weird.).

[10ebbor10]

We might want to work on an atmospheric water collector to make us independant from the nearest water source.
Is there morning fog?
Fog fences.
otherwise we might want to use the salt to create brine and construct a solar water facility:reflect sunlight to heat brine,  collect water vapour, receive water. - an oversated brine solution will collect air humidity.

Look/ask for maps of the surrounding area, there might be other lootable places nearby, nuclear shelters in abandoned cities might contain additional workforce. There has always (twice) been interest in nuclear shelters when threats arose, which should increase our chance to find one or two in abandoned pre war settlements. The unlooted ones would be tightly sealed.
If we can obtain aluminum dust and bake it with rust we can make a crude termite. We only need a signal torch to light it and burn through the shelter doors.

Also: defenses in mine form might be useful. tell the traders you have those plans, though and plot a save path for them first.

Nah, no morning fog. The base is build on a hill with no water sources nearby.

Also the base was located in the middle of the Amazonian forest. not much cities there.