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[Cruxador]

Right now, trees seem fairly gigantic in comparison to most buildings and people. Each seems about 3-6 z levels high, while most human buildings are 1-3. The trunks are 2x2 but people are just 1 tile, making each tree like some kind of great big baobab or sequoia.

Your perception of scale is all kinds of messed up. Do you live in a city or something? There's very few trees that don't get to be twice the height of a single story house in just a few years, and double the width of a human can be as little as a few decades. Since these are presumably natural-growing trees (rather than planted by landscapers or loggers) many of them are likely hundreds of years old. The current size/shape seems to be modeled on oaks, and is appropriate to a lot of deciduous trees. It would be cool to see some trees that really do redwoods justice, but they would be a lot taller than anything in the game currently, besides geological features such as mountains. I believe they're not in because of the hardware issues implicit in calculating all those extra Z-levels, although a fort or elven encampment in a redwood forest would be incredibly awesome.

[Wastedlabor]

I've seen wild apricot trees that were like four stories high.

[Ozfer]

Since sites are becoming more dynamic, along with the NPCs, will site naming ever be changed to make more sense within context of the events and people that happened there?  Along that line, will sites ever be renamed by NPCs?  If goblins capture a city, would its name be converted to goblin-language?  It would be cool if the "Glade of Prancing" was renamed to "The Glade of Fear" after a Dragon settled there.

[Abitbol]

Omo has come, its a bloated blob of fat with tentacles.

One month, two axes dwarves and some processing later,

LE NOUVEL OMO LAVE PLUS BLANC QUE BLANC

French fries to whomever finds whom I just quoted

Coluche approved

[WillowLuman]

Right now, trees seem fairly gigantic in comparison to most buildings and people. Each seems about 3-6 z levels high, while most human buildings are 1-3. The trunks are 2x2 but people are just 1 tile, making each tree like some kind of great big baobab or sequoia.

Your perception of scale is all kinds of messed up. Do you live in a city or something? There's very few trees that don't get to be twice the height of a single story house in just a few years, and double the width of a human can be as little as a few decades. Since these are presumably natural-growing trees (rather than planted by landscapers or loggers) many of them are likely hundreds of years old. The current size/shape seems to be modeled on oaks, and is appropriate to a lot of deciduous trees. It would be cool to see some trees that really do redwoods justice, but they would be a lot taller than anything in the game currently, besides geological features such as mountains. I believe they're not in because of the hardware issues implicit in calculating all those extra Z-levels, although a fort or elven encampment in a redwood forest would be incredibly awesome.

But the trees even surpass many human forts, which is obviously not so good for the fort. And if 2x2 is supposed to be the size of an average bedroom, then that's an enormous tree. An adult human can wrap his/her arms around or almost around most trees.

[DG]

I agree that the height of the trees is not a problem. On the other hand I think the width of the trunks is far too much for trees of that height. I forgot who put up an ascii mock-up in this thread when trees first started getting worked on but I liked their idea.

[blue sam3]

Right now, trees seem fairly gigantic in comparison to most buildings and people. Each seems about 3-6 z levels high, while most human buildings are 1-3. The trunks are 2x2 but people are just 1 tile, making each tree like some kind of great big baobab or sequoia.

Your perception of scale is all kinds of messed up. Do you live in a city or something? There's very few trees that don't get to be twice the height of a single story house in just a few years, and double the width of a human can be as little as a few decades. Since these are presumably natural-growing trees (rather than planted by landscapers or loggers) many of them are likely hundreds of years old. The current size/shape seems to be modeled on oaks, and is appropriate to a lot of deciduous trees. It would be cool to see some trees that really do redwoods justice, but they would be a lot taller than anything in the game currently, besides geological features such as mountains. I believe they're not in because of the hardware issues implicit in calculating all those extra Z-levels, although a fort or elven encampment in a redwood forest would be incredibly awesome.

But the trees even surpass many human forts, which is obviously not so good for the fort. And if 2x2 is supposed to be the size of an average bedroom, then that's an enormous tree. An adult human can wrap his/her arms around or almost around most trees.

You are confusing sleeping quarters in a wealthy area of modern society with those of medieval peasants. And you are confusing trees that have been around for a relatively short period (read: almost all trees you're likely to have seen, unless you live in the right place) with trees that have stood for millennia (most of which near where most people live have long (and I really do mean long here) since been felled.

[Haprenti]

With pulping coming to prevent Necromancers and reanimation to be too strong, do you plan to ever add a limit to the number of corpses a necromancer is able to reanimate at a time ? With something like a necromancer skill to increase our corpse cap and/or our range. And making reanimating creature that are far stronger than us possibly go berserk because of its strong will being able to be partially free from our control over them, but not being strong enough to be sane.

[Darchitect]

• Which tiles will be used for the trees?
• Have you given any more thought to allowing us to split the graphics off the curses_640x300.png so we can create proper tilesets?
• Is the code already in place to do all that? We can already create tiles for all the animals and humanoids, since we can access their raw files.
• Do you have a timeline to "rawify" all the things we don't have access to currently?

[Putnam]

• Which tiles will be used for the trees?
• Have you given any more thought to allowing us to split the graphics off the curses_640x300.png so we can create proper tilesets?
• Is the code already in place to do all that? We can already create tiles for all the animals and humanoids, since we can access their raw files.
• Do you have a timeline to "rawify" all the things we don't have access to currently?

1.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/imgs/trees_river_1.png
http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/imgs/trees_river_2.png
http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/imgs/trees_river_3.png
http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/imgs/trees_river_4.png
http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/imgs/trees_river_5.png
http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/imgs/trees_river_6.png
http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/imgs/trees_river_7.png
http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/imgs/trees_river_8.png

2. You already can.
3. You already can.
4. No.

[Knight Otu]

• Which tiles will be used for the trees?
• Have you given any more thought to allowing us to split the graphics off the curses_640x300.png so we can create proper tilesets?
• Is the code already in place to do all that? We can already create tiles for all the animals and humanoids, since we can access their raw files.
• Do you have a timeline to "rawify" all the things we don't have access to currently?

1) It'll depend, but the default is as follows (with the wall tiles forming the trunk):

Nothing is final (and it can all be changed in the raws), but the 1/4 tiles are branches heavy enough to climb (but they still have some leaves), the single lines are heavy enough to climb on but won't have leaves/fruit, the semi-colons are too light for climbing (I haven't started climbing yet), and the little pentagons are parts of the trunk that slope or taper.

When you say it can all be changed in the raws, does that extend to the tiles that are used to represent certain parts of the tree? I'm down with what you've got there mostly, but the "1/4"s are distracting, being readable numbers thrown into the mix like that. I think it's because number tiles have been otherwise reserved for fluid levels.

Yeah, you can change each of the tiles.  The d_init file has the defaults, and the raws have any special tiles for specific trees.  For the 1/4th you'd probably just need to change the d_init one.

2) That's Full Graphical Support from the ESV, and the following quote almost certainly still applies. <Fake-edit - assuming you mean giving new tiles to hard-coded items, which is the way I read your post, rather than just change the existing tileset, in which case, Putnam has the answer.>

In the case of supporting tiles for each game object, I need to figure out the deal with all the new SDL code before I can lay anything out in stark terms.  The textures are stored differently (in a single atlas if it still works that way), and I'm not sure if it'll be feasible to move to full item/map texture support without altering the way that works.

3) Presumably, no. <Fake-edit - see above.>

4) There is never a timeline for features that aren't actively being worked on. Just the plan to do so eventually (and rawifying as much as possible is a plan).

With pulping coming to prevent Necromancers and reanimation to be too strong, do you plan to ever add a limit to the number of corpses a necromancer is able to reanimate at a time ? With something like a necromancer skill to increase our corpse cap and/or our range. And making reanimating creature that are far stronger than us possibly go berserk because of its strong will being able to be partially free from our control over them, but not being strong enough to be sane.

Ever is a long time. However, Toady has mentioned that, eventually, the interaction system will evolve into a full-fledged magic system where presumably skill and costs will be allowed to be a factor.

Is there any plan to have undead scale with the power of the necromancer?

Eventually it'll be a full magic system with a whole lot of scaling sort of things and tweaks and specific personalized alterations to effects and various coolness, but for now it is utterly dull.

[Darchitect]

Putnam,

Thanks for the pics! Hadn't seen those yet.

Knight Otu,

Yes, I did mean access to the hard-coded items. I'd really love to create a tileset where every item can have it's own graphic. No more well/bees/ants and dyer's shops that use colored rubble. And a tile for each kind of weapon. And one-tile bridges that are visibly different between their up and down states. So many things. I understand why Toady would be freaked out by having to adjust his entire engine to accommodate all that.

Out of curiosity, what does ESV stand for?

[Putnam]

Eternal Suggestions Voting.

[monk12]

Eternal Suggestions Voting.

Viewable here, if you'd care to cast your own votes or see what has been discussed. Graphics Support is currently #4. I don't know how much it is still used/maintained (#23- Retire a Fortress looks like it'll be knocked off this release) but it's still a good at-a-glance idea of the more popular suggestions.

[Neonivek]

Now the thing to remember about Eternal voting is it is just a way to tell Toady what things the community wants the most.

It isn't a vote where Toady is bound to add something.