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[Putnam]

It'll probably be a total rewrite of the way veins work.

[GreatWyrmGold]

This is a bit of a complicated question.

1. Toady, do you have any plans as to when (i.e. which caravan arc release) you will reintroduce dark fortresses, mountain halls, and forest retreats?
2. If not, what kinds of things will you add before reintroducing them? I recall you saying that forest retreats would probably wait for multi-tile trees, but are there similar "requirements" for before you re-add in mountain halls and dark fortresses?
3. Once you add them back in, how much will mountain halls, dark fortresses, and forest retreats benifet from the sorts of changes you made to towns?

[Putnam]

1. By the time the caravan arc is over. Toady doesn't do timelines
2. Probably multi-layer veins for mountain halls and I'm not sure for dark fortresses.
3. Probably lots. I'd be interested in seeing underground markets.

[NW_Kohaku]

I'd really like to see as much raw-control over the new city types as possible, though.  I hope that we can have the ability to mod distinct civs that have slight variations in architecture.  In fact, I'd like to see a control where you can have civs procedurally react to different climates or other stimuli where they will build their houses one way in hot climates and another way in cold climates (like having steeply sloped roofs in places where heavy snowfall occurs). 

For that matter, I'd like to see more rules for the procedural generation of the caverns, so that they don't all look so much alike.

[EmeraldWind]

I'd really like to see as much raw-control over the new city types as possible, though.  I hope that we can have the ability to mod distinct civs that have slight variations in architecture.  In fact, I'd like to see a control where you can have civs procedurally react to different climates or other stimuli where they will build their houses one way in hot climates and another way in cold climates (like having steeply sloped roofs in places where heavy snowfall occurs). 

For that matter, I'd like to see more rules for the procedural generation of the caverns, so that they don't all look so much alike.

We probably won't see that until after we see the first script-able procedural creature generators at the very least. Toady still needs to actually figure out a standard by which to structure whatever kind of script he comes up with for that.

[MrWiggles]

If he comes up with one.

[NW_Kohaku]

We probably won't see that until after we see the first script-able procedural creature generators at the very least. Toady still needs to actually figure out a standard by which to structure whatever kind of script he comes up with for that.

If he comes up with one.

Which is why I'd like to bring the topic up from time-to-time.  This whole thing would be much easier if he builds the procedural rules while keeping in mind the notion that he would want to make this raw-modifiable eventually, if not from the outset. 

We have some control over how caverns are formed in the worldgen options, after all, so having some parameters for player control isn't unprecedented, here. 

Raw-editable changes to the procedures for generating procedural creatures would be nice, and all, but changes to the way procedural citybuilding (or, say, procedural magic systems) takes place would have a much greater impact upon the ability for the player to really make their worlds feel different and reactive to the way they set their worlds up.

One of the major reasons I stopped modding DF was that I really couldn't create any sort of civ or creatures that weren't basically just humans or dwarves, because the game just isn't built to handle anything but dwarves with slight variations. 

[Cruxador]

1. Toady, do you have any plans as to when (i.e. which caravan arc release) you will reintroduce dark fortresses, mountain halls, and forest retreats?

Unless something has changed since he last discussed it, there is no plan that specific.

2. If not, what kinds of things will you add before reintroducing them? I recall you saying that forest retreats would probably wait for multi-tile trees, but are there similar "requirements" for before you re-add in mountain halls and dark fortresses?

He has not mentioned any other requirements. It is reasonable to assume that none are particularly large endeavors, at least not on the level of multi-tile trees.

3. Once you add them back in, how much will mountain halls, dark fortresses, and forest retreats benifet from the sorts of changes you made to towns?

It is probable that they will be quite different, to the extent that most layout code won't be reused, but code regarding the tracking of goods and whatnot will probably be the same.
[/quote]

1. By the time the caravan arc is over. Toady doesn't do timelines

Toady does timelines. There's one on the dev page right now. It doesn't include non-human cities, but it's going to be reworked. It would be accurate to say that Toady doesn't stick closely to his timelines, however.

[Putnam]

No, I mean "in x weeks" or "in x months".

His timelines are "a while" and "soon".

[monk12]

No, I mean "in x weeks" or "in x months".

His timelines are "a while" and "soon".

With the definition of "soon" being "the next year or so"

[Chronas]

No, I mean "in x weeks" or "in x months".
His timelines are "a while" and "soon".

With the definition of "soon" being "the next year or so"

All devs are generally pretty notorious for that.

[Thief^]

No, I mean "in x weeks" or "in x months".
His timelines are "a while" and "soon".

With the definition of "soon" being "the next year or so"

All devs are generally pretty notorious for that.

Most notably Valve: https://developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/Valve_Time

[Neonivek]

I guess I have a question for Toady

Toady have you ever felt like you would rather keep a placeholder in the game as it was, instead of doing the planned updates later? I am actually reminded of the Good and Evil lands and how you actually seem to have a more solid idea of how they work then the planned Sphere lands.

[Rafal99]

wall/floodgate/etc. builders often make more reasonable decisions about where to stand to avoid walling themselves in

builders make reasonable decisions to avoid walling themselves in

builders avoid walling themselves in

...

<builds temple of the Great Toad>

[monk12]

I... but.... what... HOW!

No, really, how do wall/floodgate/etc builders make a decision about where to stand?