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[zwei]

It seem that "notable person tamed some random creatures" became more interesting fact about civ history - now you can have civ that knows how to tame giant eagles thanks to ancient hero!

[Scarpa]

Attempts to tame/train creatures will add to your site's training knowledge of that creature, which augments future training of all creatures of that type.

Does this mean things like wardogs will actually deal more damage and/or take more damage as the site's training knowledge increases?

Seems the feature is just in context of exotic creatures, so probably won't have anything to do with war dogs. My guess is 'augments future training' applies to the chance of a successful training attempt for future animals of that type.

[Caldfir]

@devlog

That is... the best possible solution to the dungeon master/exotic pet thing I could think of.  That sounds like a very fun and !!fun!! system.  Better than I hoped - really looking forward to armies of jabberers

[Mr Frog]

You mean Animal Trainer skill now actually means something beyond whether that hydra-in-a-cage submits to my authority slowly or quickly?

I'm a bit sad that the DM is now apparently gone for good, but it's not exactly cold turkey :p

Spoiler: I mean, really (click to show/hide)

Have You Seen This Noble?

[Rough sketch in charcoal]

Last seen on April 1st, 2010. Long beard, is wearing 23 leather cloaks, 10 mittens on right hand and 16 on left. Answers to the names Dungeon Master or, alternatively, Mr. Pickles. Please call XXX-XXXX if you have any information.

Anyways...

How, exactly, does the game determine which animals are related? Does it use the currently-existing CREATURE_CLASS system (or a variant thereof), or does it analyze the various creatures' tags/anatomy and compare how similar each one is to the others? Or is it that I'm completely off here and it works in a completely-different manner? How does PET_EXOTIC affect things compared to PET?

Also...

What, exactly, was your motivation to remove the DM completely instead of fixing him? I can think of several good reasons, but I'd rather hear it straight from the Toad's mouth.

Finally, can we expect a similar overhaul of the tax collector's position/role if/when you work out a way to make the dwarven economy function in a sane manner?

[EmeraldWind]

This sounds like an interesting thing to add. It will probably lead to other similar things, like maybe a dwarf civ that has a inclination to metalworking and another will have an inclination to masonry (or types of masonry). It's almost like a start of a civ-based culture system.

[Spish]

I've noticed that, as of 34.01, creatures in post-abandonment player fortresses don't randomly gather at meeting hall zones anymore (just stand around, not moving at all from wherever the game decides to put them). Was this an intentional change?

Just asking, because being able to fill our forts with nasties is a pretty big deal in our planned succession world; in the current system, the game doesn't seem to spawn any critters at abandoned forts, and the ones that were already there mostly end up scattered far outside the fortress walls or deep within the cavern system, making the fortresses seem very boring and empty compared to how they were in 31.25 and earlier; for instance, if you end with a forgotten beast in this version, you'll probably never encounter it in adventure mode, because it'll most likely still be hanging out somewhere deep in the caverns by the time you finish exploring the fort (instead of chilling in one of the meeting halls).

[ricree]

Just be glad they don't have to invent medicine in the same way

Actually, this system sounds like a good fit for when/if syndrome cures make it into the game.

So fortress/civ medical knowledge would be the difference between
"That's just Urist's Bone Rot, I've got a tonic for it back in the workshop" vs "Oh Merciful Armok!  Why did his arm just fall off?"

[Livonya]

The new develop log post is quite interesting.

Is this sort of training knowledge at the civilization and fortress level something that you just came up with for this particular issue, and/or is it something that you had/have planned for other skills?

I am curious if this was a spur of the moment sort of change, or something that you had intended all along?

A great change, which would be interesting if expanded to other skills.

It seems that having multiple fortresses in the same civilization would actually expand that civilization's general knowledge, so this sort of emerging/expanding knowledge base would actually encourage the long term use of an individual world.

I hope more skills and abilities will trend this way.

[Footkerchief]

How, exactly, does the game determine which animals are related? Does it use the currently-existing CREATURE_CLASS system (or a variant thereof), or does it analyze the various creatures' tags/anatomy and compare how similar each one is to the others? Or is it that I'm completely off here and it works in a completely-different manner? How does PET_EXOTIC affect things compared to PET?

If you're referring to this part of the devlog:

Attempts to tame/train creatures will add to your site's training knowledge of that creature, which augments future training of all creatures of that type.

I read "all creatures of that type" as "all creatures of that species".  Setting up relationships between species manually would be a big boring task, and doing it algorithmically would be difficult. 

What, exactly, was your motivation to remove the DM completely instead of fixing him? I can think of several good reasons, but I'd rather hear it straight from the Toad's mouth.

Is this sort of training knowledge at the civilization and fortress level something that you just came up with for this particular issue, and/or is it something that you had/have planned for other skills?

I am curious if this was a spur of the moment sort of change, or something that you had intended all along?

Toady's main problem with the Dungeon Master was the notion of a skill/ability being magically conferred when a dwarf is appointed to a position.  He's been talking for a couple years about moving that ability to the civilization:

Spoiler: quotes about the Dungeon Master and civ knowledge (click to show/hide)

Feb 2010:

Yeah, the dungeon master has lost anything you don't see written in the raws there.  The position's whole future is kind of dependent on the outcome of the knowledge discussion, since the dungeon master grants a capability to every dwarf in a strange way.

May 2011:

I've heard a lot of talk about "secrets" lately.  Is the Dungeon Master's ability to tame exotic creatures also going to be one of these "secrets"?

It's possible to get sort of tech-treey with it, but I haven't done anything like that, and it's not set up to point to certain positions or to have positions confer any abilities on their own.  The larger questions surrounding knowledge and technology have not been resolved.

Nov 2011:

Is it possible in the new version to link powers to a particular job skill?  Such as giving elven druids some psudo-magical curses, or shapeshifting?

There's nothing like that.  It's the same issue as a dungeon master.  I don't want skills or powers to arise out of nothing if I can help it.

In general, the knowledge system has been planned for a while.  Back in 2009, Toady anticipated using entity raws to control the ability to make plaster casts.  False knowledge and lies also came up, along with animal people learning technology from dwarves.

[Moddan]

I'm kinda sad to see the DM go. I wish he could stay as a lore manager or so with a similar research job like the bookkeeper has now.

[NobodyPro]

But now who will wear all my fabulous cloaks?

[Vherid]

But now who will wear all my fabulous cloaks?

Should make people with animal trainer skill have the need to wear lots of cloaks

[Livonya]

Footkerchief -

Thanks for all the links... I have read all of that stuff before, but I don't always remember everything that Toady has written/said over the years.

So many interesting ideas that it is hard to keep track of them all.

In some ways I will miss the dungeon master... would be cool if it was an appointed position so that the position wouldn't be gone, but rather just the way s/he comes to have the ability's of dungeon master.

It will be interesting to see all the new ways that the player will be able to influence the world.  I can only imagine what will be possible in 10 or 15 years.

[Mr Frog]

Thanks @Footie for the quotes.

I must say that I really like the idea of each civ having different technological/lore levels, especially if there's some way to increase them.

[EmeraldWind]

Footkerchief -

Thanks for all the links... I have read all of that stuff before, but I don't always remember everything that Toady has written/said over the years.

So many interesting ideas that it is hard to keep track of them all.

In some ways I will miss the dungeon master... would be cool if it was an appointed position so that the position wouldn't be gone, but rather just the way s/he comes to have the ability's of dungeon master.

It will be interesting to see all the new ways that the player will be able to influence the world.  I can only imagine what will be possible in 10 or 15 years.

Perhaps, someday when the prisons in the fort are used more than for dwarves (like people who arrive at the fort taverns) the Dungeon Master will make sure that prisoners from out-of-town are well feed and watered as well as check to see if they are attempting to escape.