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Author Topic: Question about tissue layers  (Read 3167 times)

Drawde

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Question about tissue layers
« on: February 12, 2012, 09:26:14 am »
I have a custom creature with scales of a custom tissue.  I wanted the layer to basically be armor, at slightly better than copper.  Except the material the scale layer is made out of seems to make no difference.  Or at least not enough for me to notice, against normal animals.

Is there a way to do that?  I know that the scales will end up being damaged, but I'd like them to block hits more often then they do.
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Funk

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Re: Question about tissue layers
« Reply #1 on: February 12, 2012, 12:49:09 pm »
your sure that the scales are being made from the right material?
can you post the raws for the creature and the tissue.
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Agree, plus that's about the LAST thing *I* want to see from this kind of game - author spending valuable development time on useless graphics.

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Hugo_The_Dwarf

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Re: Question about tissue layers
« Reply #2 on: February 12, 2012, 02:15:14 pm »
[TISSUE:SCALE]
   [TISSUE_NAME:scale:STP]
   [TISSUE_MATERIAL:INORGANIC:COPPER] - IRON
   [SCARS]
   [RELATIVE_THICKNESS:1] - increasing this makes it thicker aka blocks more
   [HEALING_RATE:100]
   [VASCULAR:1] - if damaged will bleed if creature has blood
   [PAIN_RECEPTORS:5] - if damaged will give off pain
   [CONNECTS]
   [TISSUE_SHAPE:SCALES]

this also raises the question I have, what are all the TISSUE_SHAPE tokens?
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Drawde

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Re: Question about tissue layers
« Reply #3 on: February 12, 2012, 06:55:12 pm »
Tissue template:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Material template:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

I DID have the tissue set to just scale.  But didn't notice the difference when I changed it.  And I've never seen a difference when the thickness was set to 1000.

My intention here is to make the creature more survivable, but not invincible.  Strong versus animals or poorly armed intelligents, but killable by a well equipped person.
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Koji

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Re: Question about tissue layers
« Reply #4 on: February 12, 2012, 07:42:14 pm »
I think the problem might be that the BODY_DETAIL_PLAN is overriding the changes to layer thickness. You need to make a new BODY_DETAIL_PLAN for this creature and have its scale layer be thicker.

The Monster Hunter mod did this pretty effectively. My Dwarvenrealms Mod has Giant Desert Armadillos (as well as Liches and a frost worm called a Biter) that have an extra layer of bony plating over their skin. It doesn't make them invincible, but it generally gives them a little more durability.
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Drawde

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Re: Question about tissue layers
« Reply #5 on: February 12, 2012, 08:27:35 pm »
I've tried modifying the thickness in the creature raws.  Even setting it to 10000 there did nothing.

I guess I can try messing with a new BODY plan.  Once I figure it out.
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rephikul

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Re: Question about tissue layers
« Reply #6 on: February 12, 2012, 08:42:34 pm »
@Koji @Drawde, Tissue size is relative to their body part size. A tooth that's 99.999% nerve tissues still only have well, a tooth-sized amount of nerves.
« Last Edit: February 12, 2012, 08:52:50 pm by rephikul »
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Koji

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Re: Question about tissue layers
« Reply #7 on: February 12, 2012, 08:49:47 pm »
Quote from: rephikul on February 12, 2012, 08:42:34 pm
@Koji, Tissue size is relative to their body part size. A tooth that's 99.999% nerve tissues still only have well, a tooth-sized amount of nerves.

That doesn't really conflict with anything I said though. Were you talking to Drawde?
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rephikul

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Re: Question about tissue layers
« Reply #8 on: February 12, 2012, 08:51:58 pm »
whoops, my bad.
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Drawde

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Re: Question about tissue layers
« Reply #9 on: February 12, 2012, 08:52:41 pm »
Working on this, but don't know what else I need:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
This SHOULD tell the game that the scales are around the body part, wiht the head being a bit more vulnerable (eyes and mouth).  Though I don't know how to tell the game that the scales are on the top layer.  Or even if this would work.  I think [BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:VERTEBRATE_TISSUE_LAYERS:SCALE:FAT:MUSCLE:BONE:CARTILAGE] in the creature raw tells the layer order?

And I can use the creature raw to specify what the scales are made of with:[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:SCALE:DRAKESCALE_TEMPLATE] and [USE_TISSUE_TEMPLATE:SCALE:DRAKESCALE_TEMPLATE] in the right places in the creature raw?
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rephikul

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Re: Question about tissue layers
« Reply #10 on: February 12, 2012, 08:55:23 pm »
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:VERTEBRATE_TISSUE_LAYERS:SCALE:FAT:MUSCLE:BONE:CARTILAGE] would work, instead of your original one.
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Putnam

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Re: Question about tissue layers
« Reply #11 on: February 12, 2012, 09:09:16 pm »
Quote from: Hugo_The_Dwarf on February 12, 2012, 02:15:14 pm
[TISSUE:SCALE]
   [TISSUE_NAME:scale:STP]
   [TISSUE_MATERIAL:INORGANIC:COPPER] - IRON
   [SCARS]
   [RELATIVE_THICKNESS:1] - increasing this makes it thicker aka blocks more
   [HEALING_RATE:100]
   [VASCULAR:1] - if damaged will bleed if creature has blood
   [PAIN_RECEPTORS:5] - if damaged will give off pain
   [CONNECTS]
   [TISSUE_SHAPE:SCALES]

this also raises the question I have, what are all the TISSUE_SHAPE tokens?

Quote from: the wiki
Value can be LAYER, STRANDS, FEATHERS, SCALES, or CUSTOM.

Layer = skin, organs, bone, muscle, etc. Strands = nerves, hair, etc, attacks tend to pass right through or tear. Feathers=feathers, attacks usually pass right through. I'm not sure about scales. CUSTOM is really confusing me >_>
[/quote]
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Drawde

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Re: Question about tissue layers
« Reply #12 on: February 12, 2012, 09:17:38 pm »
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:VERTEBRATE_TISSUE_LAYERS:SCALE:FAT:MUSCLE:BONE:CARTILAGE] was in the raw.  Here's the current creature raw:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Don't know which of that is redundant though.  Or even useful.  Modified from the original dragon entry.

Every time I test it the drake wins roughly 50% against a single creature, usually a bear.  I think they usually win against smaller creatures though.  In the fight the scales get damaged when hit, IF they get hit.  The blows often hit other layers instead.  I suppose a hit might always damage the scales, though I'd think some would glance off. 
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Hugo_The_Dwarf

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Re: Question about tissue layers
« Reply #13 on: February 13, 2012, 12:07:02 am »
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:STANDARD_MATERIALS]
      [REMOVE_MATERIAL:SKIN]
      [REMOVE_MATERIAL:LEATHER]
      [REMOVE_MATERIAL:HAIR]
      [USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:SCALE:DRAKESCALE_TEMPLATE]
      [USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:BONE:DRAKEBONE_TEMPLATE]] - there is an extra "]" here
   [BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:STANDARD_TISSUES]
      [REMOVE_TISSUE:SKIN]
      [REMOVE_TISSUE:HAIR]
      [USE_TISSUE_TEMPLATE:SCALE:DRAKESCALE_TEMPLATE]
      [USE_TISSUE_TEMPLATE:BONE:DRAKEBONE_TEMPLATE]
   [BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:VERTEBRATE_TISSUE_LAYERS:SCALE:FAT:MUSCLE:BONE:CARTILAGE]

Also try making the DRAKESCALE material as tough as copper or iron that shouls still allow armed units to kill it and natural attacks harder to damage it
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Drawde

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Re: Question about tissue layers
« Reply #14 on: February 13, 2012, 08:33:13 am »
Here's what I'm using for the drakescale template:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

But it doesn't seem to do anything.  I set it to be slightly better than copper, but much worse than bronze.  But the creatures I've sent after them in the arena don't seem to notice it, damaging the scale easily, if they don't pass it completely.  I've even tried adjusting the RELATIVE_THICKNESS in both the tissue template and the creature raw.  To 10000.  Still nothing.  I'm hoping I just set something wrong and that someone here can help.

I removed the extra "]" as well.

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