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[Dariush]

Why are you putting a majority vote on me? Do you think it's beneficial for town to kill someone D1? My vote on ToonyMan was near the beginning of the game, why did you vote now when i already racked up some votes?

ARE YOU FUCKING KIDDING ME

You voted Toony literally two posts above mine. Yes, it is beneficial for town to kill someone, and the proper term is 'lynch'. You ignored the question about steering the town (because honestly, 'let's make a rule that blahblahblah' is not something you should say). And finally, the amount of hipocrisy in those meagre three sentences is indescribable. Go fuck yourself, and by 'fuck yourself' I mean 'fuck yourself and go hang'.

No i didn't Read the thread. Or just page 6  if you can't bother reading the thread.

Not only does this response not have any relation to my post you quoted, it doesn't even make any sense.

Admittedly, i'm not very good at mafia, but i must ask you to place some trust in me. If i survive until next day I'll hopefully have some useful information for you all.

Blackmailing the town. Nice work.

Also, you aren't aware of the term 'lynch', but use words like 'pressure vote' and 'bandwagon'. For some inexplicable reason I get a feeling someone experienced is helping you from behind the scenes.

[Pranz]

Why are you putting a majority vote on me? Do you think it's beneficial for town to kill someone D1? My vote on ToonyMan was near the beginning of the game, why did you vote now when i already racked up some votes?

ARE YOU FUCKING KIDDING ME

You voted Toony literally two posts above mine. Yes, it is beneficial for town to kill someone, and the proper term is 'lynch'. You ignored the question about steering the town (because honestly, 'let's make a rule that blahblahblah' is not something you should say). And finally, the amount of hipocrisy in those meagre three sentences is indescribable. Go fuck yourself, and by 'fuck yourself' I mean 'fuck yourself and go hang'.

No i didn't Read the thread. Or just page 6  if you can't bother reading the thread.

Not only does this response not have any relation to my post you quoted, it doesn't even make any sense.

...
I'm sorry, but do you have any reading comprehension at all? If you just took the time to read that page, you see that i didn't vote ToonyMan the first time two posts above yours, i did on page 6. The one i linked. This is very much related to your accusation of me bandwagoning Toony.
PEDIT: i see i missed a dot there, right before "Read". still, why didn't you bother reading the page i linked to you?

Admittedly, i'm not very good at mafia, but i must ask you to place some trust in me. If i survive until next day I'll hopefully have some useful information for you all.

Blackmailing the town. Nice work.
[/quote]

Of course, that's always a possibility. I'm just saying, is it neccesary to kill me D1 when i might be of use? If i'm just a townie and tries desperately to survive, maybe scum will kill me this night and anyone else will be safe. Gone will only be what seems to be the towns number one FoS.

Also, you aren't aware of the term 'lynch', but use words like 'pressure vote' and 'bandwagon'. For some inexplicable reason I get a feeling someone experienced is helping you from behind the scenes.

I said vote kill one time. I now see that word doesn't make sense, even outside mafia. English isn't my first language, I occasionally make mistakes.

[Mii]

I'll write an actual post later - which is to say, Urist McUselessNoble, I will be showing you my scum-reads on Toonyman. I'll be back in only but a few hours to do so.

[Bookthras]

[Warning: Wall of Text Ahead]

Unvote Everybody.

Moderator:

Moderator, please clarify: when does the day end? Will there be any more opportunities to extend after D1 ends?

The extension has NOT been used - it is simply available. We'd have to have majority request to extend to use it. If you guys think you need it to get through the weekend, feel free to use it.

OK, I had misunderstood. I thought the extension was already in place. When does the day currently end?

Red means an attack add against another, you can run as many as you want?
Green means a self vote for the straw pole? Would anyone not want to vote themselves?

Yes. Yes (you can also vote as many as you want). Because of noone not votes themselves, no one wins, and no one is protected tonight by their Leader of the Pack status. It's definitely a possible outcome!

I had not realised we could also multi-vote in green... what happens if, say three (or say, nine) people are tied for the top number of green votes? Do all become front runners, or none? Will the front runner mechanic/green votes continue to be on Day 2 and further, or is it a D1 only thing?



McNoble:

In particular, Bookthras and Tiruin have been voting more people than there can possibly be mafia+third party in the game at this point. Please be advised that this is starting to look an awful lot like lazy, bandwagony scum play.

"Hey, Dr. Freeman! Don't forget to reload!"

I'm sure you mean well, dude, but I don't need your help to remind me who I'm voting or what effects it may have. If you're curious, I did want to vote everybody and see how it would be reflected on the vote count, to test GG and to familiarise ourselves with the mechanic. However, I may or may not end the day voting more people than you think is wise; you are free to interpret this how you wish, and vote your conscience. I have been so advised.

It also seems a bit too helpful. Like you really want to see the town how you're helping it...

Everyone:
Does anybody have any objections to a mass Issue claim?

I do. What purpose would it serve? D1 is too early for any sort of mass claim or cunning plan in any case.

So, to make sure you don't slip out of sight again, I'd like you to tell me your Stance on the Issue of Economics.

You seem too focused on the issues for my tastes. Not that they're not important, but campaigns aren't won with issues, they're won with arguments. A bit fishing, and a bit more of that "too helpful" vibe.



Tiruin:

So a shortened version before I miss any of my multiple votes.
Unvote Dariush: You missed an RVS question.
Unvote Mii

Please explain this. Why would you miss any of your multiple votes? How many do you have? Why? Are they temporary? Also, for Votes/Unvotes to count, they must be coloured red.

How could I answer the question on why he chose his name when even I don't know why he chose his name.

Even I? That's a suspicious wording... as in, why would any random bloke know it, but why would even his partner-in-crime know it?
Tiruin: You said earlier that Pranz's post made you think he was scum. Why? If you thought he was scum, why didn't you press him further? Do you think Andrew is scum?

How suspicious? I worded it to mean me, specifically me. Are you trying to incriminate me by putting fake words into my mouth?
Oh, and Pranz hasn't posted anything from then on by the way.

Re: wording. Yes, your "me, specifically me" seems suspicious to me. A generic person without knowledge would say "I don't know", rather than "even I don't know"; the "even" (and your subsequent denial) implies an anxiety to portray that you have even less knowledge of his name than others who also don't or wouldn't know, betraying that there's perhaps a secondary channel of communication, like a scumchat.

Re: Pranz. You didn't answer the question. I didn't ask whether he had posted, I asked why you thought he was scum, and how have you pressured him to find out. Avoidance and unapologetic unsupported vote in one sentence.

Tiruin It's people like you who give bad names to us true Conservatives.

Sure, Andrew425, target me and me alone, without any reason.

Plus a nice OMGUS to complete the trifecta. Yeah, you are scummy.



Pranz

Bookthras and Tiruin:
why are you voting for >80% of the players?

See my first answer to McNoble.

Why are you putting a majority vote on me? Do you think it's beneficial for town to kill someone D1? [then later] Admittedly, i'm not very good at mafia, but i must ask you to place some trust in me. If i survive until next day I'll hopefully have some useful information for you all.

Dude! "why lynch me?" "you'll regret it!" If you are town, you're doing it wrong. If you are scum, you are also doing it wrong. Do better. Or we'll do without.



ToonyMan:
I see no actual useful content from you. Please give me your reads on Toaster, Mii, and Dariush, and who would you green-vote if you couldn't green-vote yourself?


Dariush:

ARE YOU FUCKING KIDDING ME[...]Go fuck yourself, and by 'fuck yourself' I mean 'fuck yourself and go hang'.

Shut the fuck up. Why don't you do something useful instead of yelling like a lunatic? Your top four scumpicks, please, and details on how you plan to pursue the lynch of at least two.


Toaster:

Actually, here's a thought question (that everyone should read):  If the majority thinks that X person is town, why shouldn't we, instead of greenvoting them, red vote everyone else?  That will end the game with that person left alive, and their alignment (if we're correct, town) winning.  If someone claims cop with a town result on them, we could greenvote the town result person to protect them and lynch the cop claimant.  If the cop is town, then we could lynch everyone but said townie.

Dude, I think you just broke the game. We should totally do that as soon as we have a solid lead on a townie.

[GlyphGryph]

OK, I had misunderstood. I thought the extension was already in place. When does the day currently end?

In about 31 hours. Roughly. I'll give people an hours notice before I close - I might run late, wouldn't be much of a surprise.

I had not realised we could also multi-vote in green... what happens if, say three (or say, nine) people are tied for the top number of green votes? Do all become front runners, or none? Will the front runner mechanic/green votes continue to be on Day 2 and further, or is it a D1 only thing?

Meh. What do you think?

[Bookthras]

Meh. What do you think?

Hmm. Yeah, I guess nine would be sorta out there, eh? But not even two? OK, we'll assume tie means no one is front runner. But do please answer if you can whether that mechanic will be active the rest of the game, or if it's only a D1 thing.

Also, voutecount, please.

[GlyphGryph]

Maybe

Also, yeah, vote count may or not happen any time soon - I am at work after all. You guys can feel free to do your own, though. Aside from Tiruin having an extra vote on whoever he had an extra vote on, everything else has been pretty straightforward so far on the voting front.

[Urist McUselessNoble]

Book:

You seem too focused on the issues for my tastes.

I refer you to the discussion of pros and cons I gave Toaster. Appearances notwithstanding, I have given the matter more than casual thought before making the suggestion.

and a bit more of that "too helpful" vibe.

I'm not trying to be helpful. I'm establishing for the record that you know what you're doing, so that if you keep doing it and it goes to shit you can't go "oh, I herpaderped, my bad" when D2 rolls around.

[Bookthras]

So a shortened version before I miss any of my multiple votes.
Unvote Dariush: You missed an RVS question.
Unvote Mii

Tiruin: I repeat, please tell us more about that "before I miss my multiple votes" or details about it. Please show us: double-vote me. Or someone else. This is important.




McNoble:

Book:

You seem too focused on the issues for my tastes.

I refer you to the discussion of pros and cons I gave Toaster.

I read it when I went through the thread. I grant that you gave it thought, but I'm still unconvinced of its merits, and your proposing it still seems off to me. Then again, I lack meta on you to read it better, but I'll keep an eye out. Oh, looky:

and a bit more of that "too helpful" vibe.

I'm not trying to be helpful. I'm establishing for the record that you know what you're doing, so that if you keep doing it and it goes to shit you can't go "oh, I herpaderped, my bad" when D2 rolls around.

Now this is more like it. While "please be advised" and such do sound intentionally helpful, as well as some of your theories, plans, and posts... but maybe you're just a cordial kind of guy. Nothing wrong with that. However, when confronted with the notion that some find it scummy, you retreat from even the appearance of helpfulness, and into a more adversarial position ("if it goes to shit, I'll git ya!").

That is what scum do when confronted, yes. My vote stays on you.

[Toaster]

Mii:

Who seems the most scummy to you (if not me) at this current point in time? Why?

You're the one I feel most confident with, largely because I didn't like your defense of yourself.


Pranz:

Admittedly, i'm not very good at mafia, but i must ask you to place some trust in me. If i survive until next day I'll hopefully have some useful information for you all.

Don't faff about.  Either outright claim cop or don't claim at all.  I'm not asking you to do claim- that's your call- but don't do this scummy "If you lynch me you'll regret it" crap.

Of course, that's always a possibility. I'm just saying, is it neccesary to kill me D1 when i might be of use? If i'm just a townie and tries desperately to survive, maybe scum will kill me this night and anyone else will be safe. Gone will only be what seems to be the towns number one FoS.

This is a (bad) appeal to emotion.  Also scummy.

The only reason I'm not voting you is because I'm getting a very strong "clueless newbie" read from you, and it's extremely tenuous- and doesn't mean in the slightest I think you're town.  It's like trying to figure out just by eyeballing what color marble is at the bottom of a bucket of black paint.

[Urist McUselessNoble]

Book:
Wait, what? The sum total of your case against me is... a rhetorical flourish and a clarification of same? Please tell me you're pulling my leg.

I prefer to start with politeness and let things go downhill from there, rather than the other way around. Dariush provides the most instructive and memorable demonstration, by way of counterexample, of the merits of my approach.

[Bookthras]

Book:
Wait, what? The sum total of your case against me is... a rhetorical flourish and a clarification of same? Please tell me you're pulling my leg.

Oh, Sir Humphrey Applebee would be proud of your capacity to circumlocute by the otherwise numerous, if admittedly tenuous, elements of the case that your humble servant, who refers to himself via the use of the perpendicular pronoun, has presented as support, nay, justification! of his adventurous but inexorable daring to utilise that most crimson of colours to countenance your Noble appellation.

No, saying "please be advised" is not the sum total of my case, and your disingenuously implying that it is is both scummy and false. No. You also are guilty of being too concerned to appear helpful to the town, of diving into light fishing (issues, not roles), and of turning markedly confrontational as soon as some of your actions were called scummy. Not a damning case, to be sure, but certainly more than a three-word sum total, isn't it? You can add your "rebuttal" as an additional point (as in "Lynch all liars"). Want one more? over-defensiveness.

Any more questions?

I prefer to start with politeness and let things go downhill from there, rather than the other way around. Dariush provides the most instructive and memorable demonstration, by way of counterexample, of the merits of my approach.

Having addressed your scummitude above, I however do support and applaud this stance, and hope you preserve it. It's unfortunate that it has nothing to do with your alignment; you'd be equally polite as scum or town, yes? And it's your reactions to questioning, not your politeness or lack thereof, which eventually betrayed your true RINO self.

[ToonyMan]

Spoiler: OOC (click to show/hide)

Yeah I'll listen to Urist McNoble and not caplock (as much) for reading coherence, I GUESS

Well first Unvote Everybody so I can lay down righteous law more clearly.

I'm wary of ToonyMan - I believe him to be scum. He is acting a bit too relaxed for my tastes, and those tastes involve 'comically bitter'. He does not seem serious, but too laid back, in other words.

Laid-back??  I can assure you my blood pressure is through the roof!

ToonyMan:

Toony:  Tunnelling is one thing, but you're just lashing out now.  Why?

LIBERALISM.  Liberals are among us and must be eradicated.

This is a crap answer.  Awaiting your next post.

During the vote-count I was only voting three people I believe.  Everything else was useful aggression for finding liberals.  As you can see it's doing pretty well.

ToonyMan:
I see no actual useful content from you. Please give me your reads on Toaster, Mii, and Dariush, and who would you green-vote if you couldn't green-vote yourself?

Toaster is fine, MII thinks I am relaxed which is RIDICULOUS.  It's a state of emergency here!  And Dariush is defending me which is creepy.  I'd probably straw vote Toaster or you, Bookthras.

PRANZ is voting me for what again and seems to be SKIRTING some important issue and being strange.  And Tiruin still doesn't seem to understand what I was saying previously, INTENTIONAL misinterpretation??

[Andrew425]

Andrew425 seemed oddly forgettable, so I decided to check his posting record, and now it doesn't seem so odd anymore. So, to make sure you don't slip out of sight again, I'd like you to tell me your Stance on the Issue of Economics.

My stance on economics are simple. The government is to clumsy and bureaucratic to ever be of help to us. We must let the free hand of the market drive itself.

Toaster: Are religious freedoms being trampled today?

Toonyman: Why are you throwing fellow conservatives under the bus? Shouldn't we all work together to beat Obamabot?

[Urist McUselessNoble]

Book:
Wait, what? The sum total of your case against me is... a rhetorical flourish and a clarification of same? Please tell me you're pulling my leg.

[snip]
No, saying "please be advised" is not the sum total of my case, and your disingenuously implying that it is is both scummy and false.

Which part of and clarification of same did you find it difficult to understand?

Your case, such as it is, rests upon only two concrete facts: A perceived backtracking that was not, in fact, a backtracking. And a disagreement over the tactical options offered by the issues mechanic. The latter I have dealt with elsewhere, making the former the only outstanding issue you have presented.

Everything else you have here is speculation, gut feeling and rhetorical legerdemain in the service of a preconceived conclusion. To whit:

You also are guilty of being too concerned to appear helpful to the town,

Want some cheese with that Wine?

of diving into light fishing (issues, not roles),

I dispute the scumminess of this, for reasons already conveyed in response to Toaster's inquiry.

and of turning markedly confrontational as soon as some of your actions were called scummy.

Surely you are joking, Mr. Feynman? If clarifying your misreading of my statement counts as confrontational in the version of English you are presently employing, then I shudder to imagine an actual confrontation.

You can add your "rebuttal" as an additional point (as in "Lynch all liars").

So, when I'm being brief I'm lying by omission...

Want one more? over-defensiveness.

... and when I'm being thorough I'm over-defensive.

Kafka would be proud of that reasoning.