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[The Dog Delusion]

So after a quick search through the forum and the wiki, it becomes pretty obvious that this is a tricky issue. I'm currently forging all of the armor sets for my military, and it is time for shields...but I don't know what material to use?

Here's what I've gathered:

0) My xbow dwarves will be able to use shields
1) Shields are important because they block many attacks
2) Shield material does not affect blocking (?)
3) Shields are also used for shield bashing
4) Shield material DOES affect bashing
5) Shield material also affects weight, but after a a lot of skill has been gained, that will be negated (?)


So assuming that I've got any materials available to forge these shields from, and assuming I want these shields to be as awesome as possible in terms of combat effectiveness, what's the optimal material? I've seen folks say copper, bronze, or steel are the best choices, but is that still under debate?

[clockwork]

Well, steel will put down your dwarve's speed, more than, say, bronze. Also, I believe skill doesn't negate weight. I like to use bismuth bronze, as it provides more metal per tin bar than the normal stuff. Plus it's lighter than the heavier but stronger metals, allowing my militia to move faster. The drawback is in bashing power if you're not using steel.

[Montague]

Wood shields are light and cheap, so use them for dwarves unskilled or unlikely to shield bash, like marksdwarves or random conscript militia types.

Copper is the heaviest material for shields, but only marginally more then bronze, iron, steel. Use these for your professional soldiers that have high armor skill/ strength.

[The Dog Delusion]

Wood shields are light and cheap, so use them for dwarves unskilled or unlikely to shield bash, like marksdwarves or random conscript militia types.

Copper is the heaviest material for shields, but only marginally more then bronze, iron, steel. Use these for your professional soldiers that have high armor skill/ strength.

Well, I'll be cross-training all my dwarves to be pretty skilled in armor and shields, so in that scenario, would a copper shield be a good choice for a marksdwarf? What exactly is the "ranking" of the various metals? We're looking at the "solid density" perameter, right? Higher is better?

[celem]

Yeah its a blunt weapon and uses that scale.  you want weight and rigidity, platinum>silver>copper.  then iron/steel

[The Dog Delusion]

Yeah its a blunt weapon and uses that scale.  you want weight and rigidity, platinum>silver>copper.  then iron/steel

excellent - this means that I can use all of that bismuth bronze for my crossbows

[AutomataKittay]

Yeah its a blunt weapon and uses that scale.  you want weight and rigidity, platinum>silver>copper.  then iron/steel

excellent - this means that I can use all of that bismuth bronze for my crossbows

Crossbow's a bashing weapon in melee, but should your crossbowiers be that close in first place? 

[The Dog Delusion]

Yeah its a blunt weapon and uses that scale.  you want weight and rigidity, platinum>silver>copper.  then iron/steel

excellent - this means that I can use all of that bismuth bronze for my crossbows

Crossbow's a bashing weapon in melee, but should your crossbowiers be that close in first place? 

They most certainly should NOT be in melee, but if it comes down to it, and if we're going for best gear in all possible situations, there's no reason not to have crossbows made to be good at two things, right?

[kotekzot]

Keep in mind masterkwork and artifact weapons get a x2 and x3 to-hit multiplier, respectively. So if you can make masterwork wooden crossbows, but only sub-masterwork metal crossbows, go for wooden ones.

[Jake]

Actually, I've heard reports that it's possible to issue your crossbow squads a proper backup weapon, which they'll switch to in melee. It's related to the bug that makes everything a one-handed weapon.

[zx.pr0jk#]

Sorry to hijack the thread a bit, but this is still about materials.

Everyone knows training weapons are made of wood. And you can make stone swords...

But my mountain home civ apparently has no access to trees. Why does this matter? They are making Training Weapons out of Gemstones.

I have Pink Tourmaline Training Spears, Black Opal Training Axes, etc. They will continue to bring me training weapons of assorted quality and gems every caravan. Which brings me to my question.... How do gems stack up against metal versions? I'm willing to bet they are weaker, and they are classified as "Training Weapons", but it's worth know in the event they come back with an exceptional Clear Diamond Training Axe. Thoughts? Diamond would presumably be a harder axe.

[kotekzot]

Gems don't appear to have weapon-relevant raw tags, except for density. That probably makes them poor edged weapons. Diamonds also have less than 50% steel density.

[Zaerosz]

Looks like you have some duplicated raws there. Last time I did that I got a fire opal pickaxe on embark, and a cave spider chitin cloak for every one of my dwarves. 'twas cool, though rather buggy - instead of elves I had maneras. An entire civilization of maneras.

[The Dog Delusion]

instead of elves I had maneras. An entire civilization of maneras.

That's pretty hardcore...and sounds a lot more interesting (and playable) than the time I embarked as tables. The game crashed as soon as I unpaused

[Syrup Roast]

Sorry to hijack the thread a bit, but this is still about materials.

Everyone knows training weapons are made of wood. And you can make stone swords...

But my mountain home civ apparently has no access to trees. Why does this matter? They are making Training Weapons out of Gemstones.

I have Pink Tourmaline Training Spears, Black Opal Training Axes, etc. They will continue to bring me training weapons of assorted quality and gems every caravan. Which brings me to my question.... How do gems stack up against metal versions? I'm willing to bet they are weaker, and they are classified as "Training Weapons", but it's worth know in the event they come back with an exceptional Clear Diamond Training Axe. Thoughts? Diamond would presumably be a harder axe.

I'm guessing the lack of tags turns it into a similar case to weapon traps with glass components. They'd have a random edge (duller than dull to possibly sharper than candy).