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Author Topic: Scourge bug - not exactly what i thought it was?  (Read 2074 times)

breadbocks

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Re: Scourge bug - not exactly what i thought it was?
« Reply #15 on: September 12, 2010, 06:05:12 pm »

Fact is, Scourges are dwarven lightsabres, except they can't be made by dorfs in vanilla.
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ledgekindred

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Re: Scourge bug - not exactly what i thought it was?
« Reply #16 on: September 12, 2010, 06:09:30 pm »

As mentioned, scourges are treated as edged, whips and flails as blunt.  (In real life they are all blunt.  A cat-o-nine tails is a type of scourge.) The reason they are all so damned deadly is because all their attack power is focused into one tiny point on impact.  Whips and flails I would expect to be much more effective against armored opponents because currently blunt weapons do better damage against armor than edged.  Against lightly armored opponents I would expect scourges to tear them limb from limb since that's the current characteristic of edged weapons.  Against heavily armored opponents the reason why whips are so danged effective is because they do the same thing a hammer does, except to what amounts to an infinitely small point.  Pretty much any impact from a whip is going to break something.  So if a dwarf gets hit with a whip, they are probably going to pass out from something getting broken, at which point the Lasher is going to bash them into pudding.

Incidentally there was another thread a few days ago where someone's weaponsmith went into a mood and made an adamantine scourge.  Lucky guy.
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I don't understand, though that is about right with anything DF related.
I just hope he dies the same death that all dwarfs deserve: liver disease.
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Urist Imiknorris

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Re: Scourge bug - not exactly what i thought it was?
« Reply #17 on: September 12, 2010, 07:45:44 pm »

Quote
Whips aren't bugged as such, they are just not modeled well. Their RAW entries are fine, the problem is that weapons are assumed to be rigid. Even leather whips would be excellent vs. armor since whips behave more like tiny supersonic hammers.
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Shoku

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Re: Scourge bug - not exactly what i thought it was?
« Reply #18 on: September 12, 2010, 08:32:41 pm »

The whips in the default raws have a velocity of 5000 as opposed to the 2000 on scourges. I think this is the heart of why they penetrate armor so much better.
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Solace

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Re: Scourge bug - not exactly what i thought it was?
« Reply #19 on: September 12, 2010, 09:34:54 pm »

Might be what Urist Imiknorris is implying, but I think the problem is the weight. If I hit you with a sword, the full weight of the sword (and my arm) are behind that, but if I hit you with a whip I'm just hitting with that tiny little scrap of something at the end. Of course, accurately modeling the damage of whips would probably take them out of the arena of weapons. :P
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axus

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Re: Scourge bug - not exactly what i thought it was?
« Reply #20 on: September 12, 2010, 10:43:59 pm »

It's weird, I don't notice goblin lashers tearing my dwarves up more than the other types.  Hammers and Xbows seem like my biggest threats.  Meanwhile, my steel axedwarves do really well.
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MarcAFK

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Re: Scourge bug - not exactly what i thought it was?
« Reply #21 on: September 12, 2010, 10:49:26 pm »

I changed whip velocity to 200 and tested steel armoured steel short sword dorf vs steel armoured steel whip dorf..
It seems fairly evenly matched, most of the time the sword or the whip are deflected off the armour, but the whip gets through eventually causing minor bruising and some bone brakages...
eventually the sword dorf gets knocked over and gets BRUTALLY lashed to death over hundreds of turns of combat....
It's awesome and as far as i'm concerned it's balenced quite well :P
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They're nearly as bad as badgers. Build a couple of anti-buzzard SAM sites marksdwarf towers and your fortress will look like Baghdad in 2003 from all the aerial bolt spam. You waste a lot of ammo and everything is covered in unslightly exploded buzzard bits and broken bolts.
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