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[Hague]

You could make bows and crossbows weigh 8000 units... That way the unit fires less quickly...

[Fishersalwaysdie]

Well, I believe the point of an arrow was not to pierce guts and organs, but actually to slash veins and arteries.
But armor piercing arrows on the other hand were indeed made to pierce, but on unarmored opponents that was rather useful.

I read that somewhere I am not so sure on the whole idea.

[Draco18s]

quote:Originally posted by Fishersalwaysdie:
<STRONG>Well, I believe the point of an arrow was not to pierce guts and organs, but actually to slash veins and arteries.</STRONG>

I'm not sure if that's true, but I do know that arrows were designed to Stick_In as to cause pain and be difficult to remove should the injured party escape.

But yeah, we need to get rid of the super-criticals where a piercing weapon (like a spear) can hit the head, both eyes, right lung, brain, stomach, and throat of a creature in a single strike.

[Lord Licorice]

quote:Originally posted by Draco18s:
<STRONG>I'm not sure if that's true, but I do know that arrows were designed to Stick_In as to cause pain and be difficult to remove should the injured party escape.

But yeah, we need to get rid of the super-criticals where a piercing weapon (like a spear) can hit the head, both eyes, right lung, brain, stomach, and throat of a creature in a single strike.</STRONG>

Maybe it was jabbed down through the top of the head and buried all the way down into the victim's stomach?

[Inquisitor Saturn]

The problem with bows vs crossbows is that crossbows are more advanced technology... It's like comparing a musket with a rifle.

[Squeegy]

quote:Originally posted by Inquisitor Saturn:
<STRONG>It's like comparing a musket with a rifle.</STRONG>

More like a musket with a bazooka.

[Earthquake Damage]

quote:More like a musket with a bazooka.

If we're gonna be ridiculous, why not liken them to "pointy stick" and "strike fighter" respectively?

[Quift]

quote:Originally posted by nicholasneko:
<STRONG>and thus as it was said, when fighting is overhauled O.o;

bows: less accurate then crossbows until user is highly trained. longer ranged. and generally more power over distance due to larger ammo and longer pullback

crossbow: more accurate at low skill levels then bow. shorter ranged and at close ranges (figure what now? 5-7 spaces?) it will go through plate armor.

another issue with bows and crossbows is range, i mean if we really want to make it accurate they are going to shoot damn far, i did 100 yards back in middle school (gods that was long ago) and you can be pretty accurate, so you can assume volley fire against lots of enemys you could hit even further as your not trying to aim it so exactingly.

another point to this is that bows tend to arc the arrows through the air to hit those further away where as crossbows are usually used as line of sight weapons, similar to how one uses a gun today. i'm not saying you couldn't arc the shot for better range, but due to the light weight of most bolts they would loose to much energy by then and be just an annoyance at best.

ok i'll shut up and go to bed now.</STRONG>

a separation beween short bow and long bow, aswell as one between crossbow ansd arbalest (and Scorpio!!) might be usefull. I can't really picture a dwarf using a ling bow unless standing on a chair, with arms like a chimp, neither a goblin for that matter. a drarf with an arbalest though, shooting right through the gobling right into the one behind.

[Forumsdwarf]

quote:The problem with bows vs crossbows is that crossbows are more advanced technology... It's like comparing a musket with a rifle.

It's actually like comparing kung fu with a can of mace.
A can of mace requires sophisticated technology to produce and turns novices into street fighters after a very short training period.
A kung fu master is low-tech and can wipe the floor with some chump with a can of mace, but learning kung fu takes years.
The only weakness of longbows (and their even more lethal cousin the Mongol horse archer's composite bow) is the learning curve ... but it's a crippling weakness.

[Chops II]

Cant you balance it by just adjusting some things (as opposed to changing what is possible)?

Like: Speed of reloads/draw time need to be more realistic, peircing more than one organ at once is just highly unlikely, not impossible (as long as in roughly same area of body, depending on length of projectile)
Seriously, killing someone in one shot is easily possible with bows etc, but difficult for reasons of accuracy, and their minimum practical range.

Also, the idea of bows being better but more difficult (than crossbows) is good, as is inability for almost all dwarves to use longbow (could they hold it horizontaly?). Perhaps bows require more strength to draw back fully? Actually i dont know how to draw a crossbow so that might be wrong.

[Fishersalwaysdie]

Dwarf arms are too stubby to draw the bow properly.

[Quift]

quote:Originally posted by Chops II:
<STRONG>Cant you balance it by just adjusting some things (as opposed to changing what is possible)?

Like: Speed of reloads/draw time need to be more realistic, peircing more than one organ at once is just highly unlikely, not impossible (as long as in roughly same area of body, depending on length of projectile)
Seriously, killing someone in one shot is easily possible with bows etc, but difficult for reasons of accuracy, and their minimum practical range.

Also, the idea of bows being better but more difficult (than crossbows) is good, as is inability for almost all dwarves to use longbow (could they hold it horizontaly?). Perhaps bows require more strength to draw back fully? Actually i dont know how to draw a crossbow so that might be wrong.</STRONG>

I have stated smewehere that one of the reasons a dwarf would use a crossbow instead of a regular bor (apart from the arms like a chimp thing) is that a crossbow is much better in tunnels. it shoots in a straight arc, and most importnatly it can hold it's own draw. So you prep the bow, enter the tunnel while streadily aiming forward. as soon as you see something you pul the trigger and PAW, dead goblin. a bow would be quite cumberome to use in these circumstances, and this is also one of the many reasons the switch from bows to crossbows was made. since the main element of warfare during the european middle ages was siege warfare.

in game term that would give the crossbow immensly better accuracy at short distances over the bow. no matter the skill level.

and again, most people taking a crossbowbolt through their platemail wouldn't say that they are that overpowered ingame damagewise... there is a reason the pope forbade them.

[ilnar]

we could just beg toady to change the expirence pounts gained per shot, since its not in the raws

[Areyar]

I guess dwarves could draw longbows by lieing down and holding it with their feet, like pygmees are rumoured to do.
They would likely refuse as it feels undignified for a dwarf to use his feet for anything else besides standing on.