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Author Topic: Tougher enemies  (Read 633 times)

CognitiveDissonance

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Tougher enemies
« on: December 15, 2009, 07:06:45 am »

Like many a dwarf, I got tired of Eagles & crocs. As such, I've been seeking out more challenging locations.
A Terrifying biome sounds like a good idea. What about a cold/glacier biome? Yeah, great. Or a swamp. Or both.

Well okay, so it's a bit of a challenge to build. But... the most "terrifying" enemies I've found so far have been Zombie Slugmen/Snakemen (my novice macedwarf has 55 kills), and that's about it.

Occassionaly, my forts would get a straggler skeletal croc. Also not very fun.

Where can I get truly dangerous fauna? I've been playing around with the map generator for more savagery and more evil... and still nothing.

Does this have anything to do with the age (aka wealth) of the fort? Meaning, will my Slugmen fort get something more interesting as time goes on?
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Shima

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Re: Tougher enemies
« Reply #1 on: December 15, 2009, 07:28:54 am »

If you want Fun, get 80 Dwarves but never fortify the entrance.
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Amalgam

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Re: Tougher enemies
« Reply #2 on: December 15, 2009, 08:09:27 am »

Terrifying biome with a river and you'll get undead sturgeon and other fish which are pretty dangerous. Embark by a terrifying ocean and you risk an encounter with undead whales which can wreak havoc... Though, most ocean wildlife seems to spend most of it's time around the edges of the map, so you can avoid it if you're careful. Magma pipes are also fun due to the fire imps and magma men, and if you've got a chasm you might be lucky enough to get giant cave spiders, which are hell. I think it's possible to get undead versions of creatures in features (heh) too, so be on the lookout for zombie batmen.

So: Terrifying, river, magma vent, and chasm for extra fun. There's also Rysith's orc mod which guarantees brutal sieges early on, but I don't recommend that unless you *really* like losing.
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Kanddak

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Re: Tougher enemies
« Reply #3 on: December 15, 2009, 02:21:43 pm »

Yeah, the most challenging sites in vanilla are definitely undead rivers. Skeletal carp will mess you up.

I play with orcs. They aren't really that bad, I just start my forts by digging a deep hole with a retracting bridge over it.
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Flying Carcass

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Re: Tougher enemies
« Reply #4 on: December 15, 2009, 07:38:17 pm »

Try generating a world with lots of large caves, then embark on a site with one of said caves. You'll have lots of tough critters to fend off then.

Like, in my current site I've got a large cave full of undead cave monsters including several skeletal trolls, skeletal giant bats, and 4 skeletal cyclopses (two of the cyclopses charged my caravan immediately after embark. Had to dig quickly in order to survive)

And in my previous jungle fort, for some reason the critters spawned outside the cave, in the jungle, so I had a dangerous jungle teeming with monsters, including many trolls and 5 giants (one of whom attacked my dwarves immediately upon arrival).
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IronyOwl

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Re: Tougher enemies
« Reply #5 on: December 15, 2009, 11:08:53 pm »

Quote
So: Terrifying, river, magma vent, and chasm for extra fun.

That's about right, as far as wildlife goes. Emphasis on the terrifying river, as magma men aren't especially tough, imps are only dangerous because they light things on fire (which tends to produce all-or-nothing situations), and many chasm creatures spawn on the lower levels where they then can't really reach you.

To really get dangerous, you'll need to turn to modding. Numerous already-made mods exist for just this purpose, but in my experience they tend to either also add stronger materials or the like, so you end up with an Invincibilium-clad dwarf mauling twenty-foot orcs to death (ie vanilla but bigger), or else encourage/require walling yourself up and picking foes off with crossbows or waiting for them to go away, which, again, rather defeats the purpose of "tougher foes".

Modding things yourself isn't particularly hard, but making foes "stronger"- much less the strength you want them- is a bit trickier. Damblock, size, and weapon damage all affect their performance in combat, but I've heard damblock isn't as useful as you'd think, and usually calls for "tougher" foes means those that stand up better in combat, not ones that one-shot a champion and then get ripped apart like tissue.
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darkflagrance

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Re: Tougher enemies
« Reply #6 on: December 16, 2009, 10:40:30 am »

Quote
So: Terrifying, river, magma vent, and chasm for extra fun.

That's about right, as far as wildlife goes. Emphasis on the terrifying river, as magma men aren't especially tough, imps are only dangerous because they light things on fire (which tends to produce all-or-nothing situations), and many chasm creatures spawn on the lower levels where they then can't really reach you.

To really get dangerous, you'll need to turn to modding. Numerous already-made mods exist for just this purpose, but in my experience they tend to either also add stronger materials or the like, so you end up with an Invincibilium-clad dwarf mauling twenty-foot orcs to death (ie vanilla but bigger), or else encourage/require walling yourself up and picking foes off with crossbows or waiting for them to go away, which, again, rather defeats the purpose of "tougher foes".

Modding things yourself isn't particularly hard, but making foes "stronger"- much less the strength you want them- is a bit trickier. Damblock, size, and weapon damage all affect their performance in combat, but I've heard damblock isn't as useful as you'd think, and usually calls for "tougher" foes means those that stand up better in combat, not ones that one-shot a champion and then get ripped apart like tissue.

In my experience, Relentless Assault actually has decent balancing, without actually adding anything other than civs (and even then it only modifies already existing creatures), though someone once reported that the arrival of the first enemies can be a bit slow.

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