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[whiterook6]

Hey guys

I can set up a hole in the wall and support my first seven dwarves through their first year. But I'm so OCD that without a complete plan in my head before hand I don't know what to do to move to a larger fortress. How does the old one fit within the new one? How do I layout the piles/shops/etc.? I need some serious help.

What are your guys' strategies for expanding?

[zchris13]

Cut a larger hole in the wall, and use it to kill everybody who arrives.

[ein]

I usually have an entrance, inside this is my trading depot. Then the path branches off slightly. One leads to a large hollow area where I put my workshops. Another lead to bedrooms and barracks. The third leads to stockpiles and the eating/recreation areas. There's also usually a short tunnel leading from the workshops to the stockpiles. One level below that is workspace for all sorts of things. Then I have two levels of quarries. Finally, I have the tombs. If you don't mind built walls, the quarry can be quickly converted into extra space. Also, built walls can be easily torn down, allowing you to rebuild as you please. Other than that basic outline, I just improvise what I need.

Another note, if you plan on expanding, build more beds than you need. 7 beds is not enough, you need at least 15. It helps if you mod the game so that you can use metal, stone, and glass as logs.

[Exponent]

I don't actually dig a small fort first.  I dig the initial portions of a large fort, and haphazardly place workshops and beds in this spot.  Many dwarves working, sleeping, and eating in hallways at this stage.  Then, as the large fort gets carved out more fully, I begin deconstructing things and moving them to where they actually belong.

[Krelos]

I don't actually dig a small fort first.  I dig the initial portions of a large fort, and haphazardly place workshops and beds in this spot.  Many dwarves working, sleeping, and eating in hallways at this stage.  Then, as the large fort gets carved out more fully, I begin deconstructing things and moving them to where they actually belong.

This is the exact method I use. On my current fortress my dwarves spent the first year sleeping in the 'barrel' where we shoot all the 'fish' that siege us.

[Time Kitten]

I tend to just build progressively slightly more impressive forts as I branch out, with apartments or such strung out between.

[Nilus]

For a basic help, just dig a hole in the wall, then make a small corridor for defences. Then dig a large (30x30 tiles or larger) room for the meeting hall and place everything around that.

[Albedo]

But I'm so OCD that without a complete plan in my head before hand I don't know what to do to move to a larger fortress.

I'm right there with ya. 

I love to dig my first year in soil - fast, painless, and it can all get slagged into one massive TC farm if need be.

A couple approaches, and I use all of them.  I tend to think of my fortress as modular - I have a living module, a forge module, a farm module, a small butcher/tanner/leather module - and all of those can pretty much get plugged in whereever they fit, so long as they are near what they need to be.

We'll assume you have a site for the "larger fortress".

Think about an entrance.  For me, that's a long valley with high levels on the sides/at the end for defense.  Start with your defensive balcony for the siege weapons, and barracks and archery range for military, and design around that.

 Dig exploratory shafts in that area, and see if you can't find some  high-value veins.  If you do, that's your dining hall, and/or high-value rooms.  Build your central living there, and expand out.

Look at your magma - dig the feeder system to your magma forges and magma glass-works, and then build from there.

The hardest part is worrying about maximizing the given space - don't.  Consider it, but you're dwarves - you OWN the mountain.  Don't worry about the natural landscape - carve to fit.

[Volfram]

I've learned to build my fortress such that the parts that need expanding are easy to expand.

My housing complexes are horribly inefficient 3x3 rooms and 7x7 Nobles' rooms stacked in 7x15 square clusters, surrounded by 3x3 hallways, but I can expand them indefinitely, and they keep the noise away from my dwarves.

My workshop area begins with a 2x2 large-block square with workshops around the edges separated by 1 tile and a stockpile in the middle.  The stockpile can grow with the workshop area, which simply gets dug out in a line.  Around the outside of the workshop area is a doorless refuse stockpile which automatically keeps miasma contained.

My dining hall is always a 2x2 large-block square and takes up 3 levels.  One level for mist generators, one level to keep the water off of my dwarves, and one level to hold all of the tables.  I have not once filled an entire dining hall with tables and chairs.  I usually lose interest too quickly.

All of my farm plots are 1x1 large-block squares containing a max-sized farm plot with a specified function.  The first is year-round plump helmets.  The second usually introduces Sweet Pods.  Again, I can expand them indefinitely.

With this basic design, I've supported a fortress of my original 7, all the way up to 75 dwarves.(pop cap.  I'll probably raise it soon.)

(large-block is when you hold down the Shift button to move the cursor.  It makes for quick scaling of larger areas.)

[Albedo]

My dining hall is always a 2x2 large-block square...

All of my farm plots are 1x1 large-block squares containing a max-sized farm plot...

large-block is when you hold down the Shift button to move the cursor.

121 tiles for farm plots??? You must be swimming in plant food.

And a 21x21 dining hall??? Yah, I'd hope you don't fill it with furniture for 75 dwarves.

Your sense of scale might need some re-evaluation.  But so long as your having fun, that's all that matters. 

[NegaDwarf]

I like making an epic dining hall me.

t = table c = chair _ = open space | = Wall

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

tc_cttc_ct|             |tc_cttc_ct
tc_cttc_ct|             |tc_cttc_ct
tc_cttc_ct|  Food     |tc_cttc_ct
tc_cttc_ct|Storage   |tc_cttc_ct
tc_cttc_ct|             |tc_cttc_ct
____________________________
____________________________
tc_cttc_ct|             |tc_cttc_ct
tc_cttc_ct|             |tc_cttc_ct
tc_cttc_ct|             |tc_cttc_ct
tc_cttc_ct|             |tc_cttc_ct
tc_cttc_ct|             |tc_cttc_ct

Easy enough to leave out some center tables to and do an overhead mist generator. My dwarves love it.

[piesquared]

In my latest fort the first thing I did was dig a standard "starting" fort into the sand.  A hallway with a bunch of 2x2 rooms, one suite for the bookkeeper, a dining room, and a large workshop area.  Outside farms.  Next up came walling off a small grass/tree/brook region so that the first siege wouldn't destroy me... then building the "real" fort.

And then when that fulfills all the functions previously in my "small" fort... remove all the buildings, mine out the walls, and add it to my tower-cap farm.

[Qwernt]

I don't have a "hole in the wall".  I just build my farm area first and it will suffice for the whole fort.  I play orcs mod (with 4 orc races operating year round) so I tend to follow the order:
    Farm (including space for buildings and food storage - inlcuding specific areas for things to butcher and plants) - usually a 3x4 plot with plump & pigtail and a 2x3 plot with sweetpod, cavewheat, plump.
    Carpenter's area - usually where the clothier will finally end up, close to farms - 3 buckets, 2 cages and then reoccuring bed/2barrel - carpenter drops all moving tasks
    11x11 room close to entrance, first used as storage will later be used as barracks
    While non miner/masons are storing stuff, miners/masons make defensive stuctures (defenses have to be up before the first trader comes, because there is generally little time after that before the first 2 squads of orcs come (10-16 orcs will destroy 7 dwarves without losses) - note might require mechanics shop
    layout & digout dining area (with associated food storage if far from farms or manufactoring)
    layout & digout manufactoring floor
    Start digging a few search tunnels if I want more valuable rooms
    Layout & digout bedrooms or create/upgrade entry to trade center (multi-level tunnels with defenses built in)
   
That is my general strategy.  It sometimes means that I don't have farms really cranking until season 2

[blackfire83]

I've often agonized over just the same thing. I want the "main" fort to be perfect in design, but that takes FAR too much time. On one of my last forts I dug a temporary fort in a corner mountain and then constructed my main fort and moved. BIG pain in the ass...

This time I struck an idea that I think works more efficiently, and keeps my OCD at bay...

I dug my normal entrance corridor, placed my Trade Depot, etc. Then I dug a massive barracks-like area behind the entrance corridor. Or, at least, it WILL be my barracks eventually. Right now it's got stockpiles, workshops, beds, and the like. Once I get all the proper areas dug out, those will be moved and my big open area will become a proper barracks, with no unnecessary rooms lying about.

-blackfire83